I held a 3rd Mate Unlimited Oceans and Master 100 ton Oceans license that expired too long ago to renew (my fault, I stopped sailing and didn’t keep track of the expiration dates). I’d like to get at least a 25 ton Near Coastal (or greater tonnage if possible). I have more than the required 90 days recency but on a 16 ton auxiliary sailing vessel.
I’ve called NMC three times and have gotten 3 different answers. The first said I needed to “start all over” and submit a new license application. The second said she wasn’t sure and to submit an application and they would sort it out. And the third said that I needed to request to have my 100 ton license “reinstated”.
I have a TWIC card, and plan on getting my physical, first aid, CPR and drug screening program sorted before submitting my application. I also requested (and received) a copy of what NMC has on record for my sea-time and licenses.
My questions are:
Who at NMC was right? Has anyone ever heard of “reinstating” a license before?
Can I take a local OUPV/100 ton master’s course locally in lieu of driving 12 hours to the nearest REC to take the test?
Will I be able to “reinstate” my 100 ton license except limited to Near Coastal if I take that course?
[quote=“prof_mariner, post:1, topic:45425, full:true”]
Here’s my situation:
I held a 3rd Mate Unlimited Oceans and Master 100 ton Oceans license that expired too long ago to renew (my fault, I stopped sailing and didn’t keep track of the expiration dates). I’d like to get at least a 25 ton Near Coastal (or greater tonnage if possible). I have more than the required 90 days recency but on a 16 ton auxiliary sailing vessel.
I’ve called NMC three times and have gotten 3 different answers. The first said I needed to “start all over” and submit a new license application. The second said she wasn’t sure and to submit an application and they would sort it out. And the third said that I needed to request to have my 100 ton license “reinstated”.[/quote]
They are all right (sort of) since you have asked more than one question and the answers for each are different.
To “reinstate” a license that’s been expired for more than a year, see 46 CFR 10…227 . You’ll have to re-take the full exam for the endorsement(s).
If you want anything other than what you had, you will need to apply for it as an original. You can use the sea time to get your old licenses, subject to recency requirements. But since Master 25 is a sub-set of Master 100, it would be easier to just re-instate the Master 100 endorsement.
You can take a Coast Guard approved course to substitute fort the Master 100 exam. I suggest applying first and not committing to a course until NMC approves you to test fro the endorsement.
Interesting that you had a 100 ton Ocean license. I’ve looked at the national licensing structure, and didn’t see that there was an option for 100 GRT Ocean. Just Near Coastal. But I suspect that your license might predate the differentiating between national and STCW. Has anyone ever tried to change a 100 GRT NC to Ocean with success?
Hi jdcavo, appreciate your helpful responses.
In following your link to 46 CFR 10 I see the below:
(i) Re-issuance of expired credentials. (1) If an applicant applies for re-issuance of an endorsement as deck officer, engineer officer, or qualified rating more than 12 months after its expiration, instead of the requirements of paragraph (e) of this section, the applicant must demonstrate continued professional knowledge by completing a course approved for this purpose, or by passing the complete examination for original issue of the endorsement. The examination may be oral-assisted if the expired credential was awarded based on the results of an oral exam. The fees set forth in §10.219 of this part apply to these examinations. In the case of an expired radio officer’s endorsement, the endorsement may be issued upon presentation of a valid first- or second-class radiotelegraph operator license issued by the Federal Communications Commission.
In the case of someone seeking to renew a 3rd mate unlimited which has passed the 1 year grace period, are you aware of any “course approved for this purpose” as per the CFR, or is “passing the complete examination for original issue of the endorsement” the only option on the market currently for this?
There are no courses, I am sure because the demand for them is extremely small, So unfortunately, the taking the original exam is the only available option. The language on exams was inserted because there are courses for original 100 and 200 ton licenses.
The open book is for the license. To maintain STCW, you will need the refresher/revalidation courses. Which ones will depend on what you hold. It sounds like your colleague got lucky. You get the open book if you don’t have one year of seas time to renew the license. So if they did not have that, they also did not have the one year of time needed to renew STCW prior to 2017. If this was after 2017, they definitely got lucky, even persons with one year of sea time now need some “revalidation” training to renew STCW.
Mr. Cavo, I currently hold a Chief Engineer Limited endorsement and am considering applying for a 100 Ton Master near coastal. All of my seatime (22 years) has pretty much all been engine room time, with the exception of about a year or so back in '97 or 98. Also, almost all of my time is on vessels of 3,000+ tons. What do I need to sit for this endorsement? Do I need actual deck time as an OS or can my Engine time go towards this.
It’s a total of 2 years in the deck department, there is no provision allowing engine time. Only 3 months needs to be “recent” (in the past 3 years, so your time from '98 can be used.
apologies I probably wasn’t clear. my colleague definitely had to take the “refresher” courses, so no gap there.
What I was curious about was the concept of “open book”. For my own reinstatement of US license w/STCW endorsements, I am having to take the standard suite of 2m/3m exam modules, along with the refresher courses.
I was wondering if there was a simpler option such as, take refresher courses + “open book” as my colleague did. (I’m just not sure what “open book” consists of… it’s a new term to me)
Open book is what it sounds like. They mail you a test and you complete using any reference publication you want, and mail it back. It’s two modules, rules, and another for everything else except navigation problems.
Assuming you don’t have the one year of sea time in the last five, and that this is the first time you are renewing since 2017, you would need the open book at hom,e test for your license, and for STCW:
Basic Safety Training Refresher course(s);
PAdvanced Firefighting refresher;
Proficiency in Survival Craft Refredsher; and
Leadership and Teamworking Skills.
The Leadership requirement is one time only, and is either assessments or a course for OICNW, If you aren’t sailing now, the course is probably your only option. If you have plans to upgrade to Master or Chief Mate (including Master 1600) consider the longer Leadership and Managerial Skills course. It will do what you need now, and you won’t need another course when you upgrade to Chief Mate/Master.
His MMC expired and he’s asking if he can take the open book exam instead of the regular complete exam series. Supposedly a guy he works with had his stuff expire and was given an open book exam.
@Mairnealach specifically said he wasn’t sure what “open book” consisted of. Mr Cavo was spot on in his explanation. Mairnealach referenced a colleague whose license expired but he didn’t say how long past the expiration date he was before he applied for re-issuance. If less than 12 months and he didn’t have the requisite sea time he would be allowed to take the open book test versus the complete exam.
He’s also asking if his colleague just got lucky or if that’s how it’s supposed to be and those are the details missing in order to compare his current predicament to his colleague’s.
Yes, unless we know the specifics of his colleagues situation and license ANY answer we give is purely conjecture based on hypothetical circumstances. Perhaps his colleague’s application was improperly evaluated and he got “lucky”. Then again it is possible it was evaluated correctly and he was allowed to take the open book exam. Maybe his colleague wisely did a Continuity Renewal which made his license a lot easier to reactivate. Unless we know the facts we are just pissin’ in the wind.
