Nordstream 2 delayed

Allseas are pulling out their ships due to sanctions imposed by the US:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-12-23/germany-expects-gas-pipeline-completion-in-second-half-of-2020
With friends like this who needs enemies?

How nice of you & German government coordinator Peter Beyer to refer to the U.S Government as, “friends”. It’s heartwarming. All other times you & German government socialist leaders refer to the US as enemies of freedom & buffoons. But now since we did something in our best interest to undermine Putin & the Russian economy you throw on the puppy dog eyes, let a tear fall & claim your feelings are hurt because, ":yellow_heart:We’re friends :heart: ".

If you read the article that you linked to you would have seen that your real friends, Putin’s Russia, plans to offset any negative consequences of the sanctions by using their own equipment. Europe can crawl even further into bed with Russia by becoming completely dependant on Putins oil & gas without the help from the evil Americans. What’s the worst that can happen right?

Oh how predictable and unrealistic was your comment.

The largest block of tax revenue that Putin brings in is from oil & gas. Throughout history energy independence & where countries get their basic necessities have been determining factors of their political leanings & national strength.

Obviously you & Merkel’s government have no problem doubling the money Germans give to Russia & no worries about doubling the dependence Germans have on Putin for basic transportation, manufacturing & heating needs.

But really, I’m completely fine with Europes love of Russia & Putin. I would be thrilled if NATO was disbanded & Putin tried a Crimea on all of his old territory. Maybe socialist Europe would wake up & grow a pair. As long Western & Northern Europeans could handle it themselves this time & wouldn’t need the evil Americans to save them again of course. Germany & Russia deserve each other IMO.

Please explain what you see as “socialist view”???

Please explain how you see Germany doubling the amount of oil & gas money sent to Moscow & how doubling it’s dependency on Putin are good things & how the US Government is bad for opposing it.

Are you convinced that export of LNG by US has nothing to do with it?
If so I think you are out of step with reality.

Russia isn’t seen as an enemy, only as a competitor and potential adversary by most Europeans. It is also a very large market for European goods and services.

To stop them (or Germany, Iran or China) from developing their economy will not make them more friendly, less adversary or more “democratic” in an American model.

PS> You didn’t explain what you see as “socialist view”.

No offense intended to you or any desire to appear condescending. Please review my comments on this thread & you will see that I never used the words, “socialist view”. I used the word “socialist” in front of nouns as an adjective to better describe that noun which is the purpose of adjectives. But if you find it offensive or confusing please try to disregard it, I won’t use it further in this discussion as long as you don’t use other adjectives to describe other forms of economic & governmental systems.

I’ve already mentioned my indifference to Russia’s adoption of Crimea from Ukraine. I was sincere in that statement. I assume you feel the same way so prehaps we agree on something? But I’m just a lonely citizen, the US Government under Obama & Trump feel very differently about it which is their right as much as it is Putin’s right to take over former Soviet territories?

Supposedly NATO’s purpose is to advance the agenda of member nations against the threat from Russia. It could be expected some members would object to a fellow member nation doubleing the money given to & doubleing the dependency given to Russia? The actions of the US Government is pretty obvious, predictable & justified in their own eyes. Why wouldn’t the US object to Germany becomeing more dependent on Russia by doubling energy imports? Why not depend more on a “friend” like the US or Norway? The U.S stupidity spends billions of dollars on NATO to help protect Europe. Its a cat & mouse game that has no rights or wrongs, only governments & people doing what they feel is in their country’s best interest with disregard to those who disagree.

As an American citizen & libertarian, I say screw it. Tell the UN to find a building in Africa to meet in, pull all US troops out of the Middle East & Asia & let Putin do whatever he wants in Europe. You people deserve Putin IMO. Let Germany & the rest of Europe double, triple or quadruple the money it sends to Moscow, so far, it always ends the same way. Maybe it will be different this time? But since no one listens to me, I say give the US Government as much leeway & freedom to do whatever it’s wants just as you advocate for the government’s of China & Russia to do whatever they want. History repeats itself, let’s see what happens. Maybe Putin & Communist China are just what the world needs?

I think the same thing when I see that Germany only spends 1.2% of GDP on defense instead of the NATO agreed 2%. Maybe that .8% could be allocated to purchasing US LNG instead of building Nordstream to buy Russian gas.

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I am glad that the US is holding the fire to companies for years that went against sanctions.

To be is simple if a company wants to work or sell to the US they will need to adhere to sanctions.

I don’t think the U.S Government would care if Germany used that 0.8% to buy LNG from Norway or any other country besides Russia, Iran & countries that isn’t considered a foe of NATO & democracy. It’s completely obvious that the US would oppose a NATO member doubling it’s imports & dependency on Russia. NATO was formed to counter balance any negative influences that Russia might have on NATO members. Duh?

ombugge is just being his normal, “woe-is-me, the US Government is so evil” self. He thinks every sovereign nation on the planet has the right to do whatever they want (especially China & Russia) but Americans are the greatest evil in the world & shouldn’t do anything unless approved by ombugge, China, Russia, the EU & the UN. But even then, he would still reserve the right to bitch about it.

While Russia maybe a threat to Europe it is still better to be friends with your neighbour instead of enemy’s. Having the nordstream 2 pipeline will ensure that Europe is not dependent on 1 or 2 suppliers of energy and less dependent on a ally that is shown to whimsical and unreliable. After all, they did not keep their promise of not pushing NATO east… One of the mayor reasons Russia is pushing back.

I’m not saying Germany shouldn’t have the right to double it’s imports from & dependency on Moscow. I’m stating the US & any other NATO member has the right to oppose it & place any sanctions on anything they want concerning it. If you look at the reason NATO was formed it’s a no-brainer.

I think NATO is a joke. The U.S has our energy independence. Let Europe depend on Russia & the Middle East for oil & return Norway to a fishing village country for all I care. Putin is more stable & less erratic than all the EU leaders combined IMO. Let Putin do what he wants in Europe. They desperately need an authoritarian leader like him IMO.

I am not sure how Germany (and other countries) is abusing the “special relationship” they have with the US. I think that works both ways.
As a sovereign nation they have every right to encourage some competition between LNG suppliers. They even agreed to build LNG terminals. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/business/energy/article/New-market-for-LNG-as-Germany-moves-to-add-import-14378430.php

I think the time that Europe will always follow the US lead is over, for better or for worse. I do agree that it is time to strengthen the European armies and be more independent. work on a basis of cooperation, not dictation.

I would like to see Russia just another trading partner but with Putin that harks back to the good old days is spending lots of resource just trying to undermine western countries, he has no economic plan just more weapons and needs to sell oil to pay the bills.
Remember his cyber attach on the Ukraine took down Maersk’s IT via its software supplier