Bulk Carrier ‘Tutor’ Abandoned After Houthi Attack

Scuttlebutt
43

And this what he says, in part, from the article you quote:

“…What we learned was that to defeat pirates operating from bases ashore you need to go ashore and neutralize the attacks before they successfully get out to sea…When we began to strike the pirate bases ashore, capture or kill the pirates and destroy their equipment, the threat gradually reduced. While the Houthis are far better trained, equipped and organized thanks to their masters in Tehran, the same principle applies. Go ashore.”

Which is exactly what I keep saying . If you want to do that, admit it. Admit you want to send in American ground troops to fight in another Middle East conflict. Own it.

44

I fear your not really reading the post and/or just want to argue.

45

I think my reading comprehension is just fine. Could be other people’s are off . To re-state my thesis:

  1. my belief is that carpet bombing and napalming the Houthis isn’t a plan. It’s a slogan. If you want to really root out the Houthis, ground troops need to be sent in. If you want to do that, be upfront about it.

  2. my esteemed colleagues say they disagree. Some say no ground troops would be needed. Some cite the plan advocated by Admiral S. as one they would follow.

  3. The thing is, the key to the admirals plan is sending in ground troops. Which is what I keep saying.

What am I not comprehending?

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46

We Europeans do not have balls, without the help of the U.S. nothing is possible from a military POV.
The major issue is that, like with piracy, if no one handles firmly and swiftly, the problem will only increase.
If piracy would have been considered as act of war, pirates could have been “processed” accordingly from the very beginning and I bet that piracy would be history by now.
Each pirate caught alive costs hundreds of thousand US$.

Now everyone is waiting until the Iranians get their bomb, everyone knows since 30 years but no one acts firmly. Sanctions never work. And once it will be too late everyone will wonder why nothing has been done.

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47

We have a clear template for a successful military conflict against a rogue state in the Middle East. The Kuwait War. Hands down victory, led by the USA. Essential component: coalition.

48

We should have empathy for murdering terrorist thugs posing as a nation? Huh? You never saw a Hitler rant I am certain and probably understood nothing if you did. Why is it that whenever someone acts as Churchill or Roosevelt did in WWII they are compared with Hitler, very strange indeed. You are truly confused. Answer: because you know nothing of history Mr Chamberlain. You are the poster child for appeasement, and you are a merchie and think Houthis can be negotiated with? I dealt with Egyptian, French, Dutch bootlickers in DC while with the CG and that was precisely the pathetic emasculated response against Somali piracy they exhibited as well. Sophmoric phrases as “war like speeches…” mark you as a Islamo-Nazi appeaser. You are probably a supporter of the 16 and soon 20 million horde barbarian invasion across the southern border as well? America’s diplomacy under this Communist meat puppet which you likely voted is one of surrender and retreat from the world stage, i.e. Afghanistan; aiding those peaceful genocidal terrorist financing Iranians you apparently support to the tune of billions who soon will be deploying nukes against Israel, so who is the Hitler who wants to murder jews kamerad?

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49

[quote=“freighterman1, post:45, topic:69788, full:true”] The thing is, the key to the admirals plan is sending in ground troops. Which is what I keep saying.

What am I not comprehending?
[/quote]
No one wants Yemon.
Your the only one who wants boots on the ground…
MacAuthor / Truman proved the error of ROE and the failure of politics in fighting an opponent.

Did Curtis LeMay have any aggressive offspring?

50

The country of Yemen might surprise some . The interior is green and and fertile. Moving Palestinians there has merit, they kicked out 200,000 Jews who had lived there for 2000 years in 1948. Besides we have learnt to grow coffee elsewhere.
I am unsure as to how we go about taking action given the indoctrination of our young people by left leaning media. Seafarers welfare is not their concern.

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51

And Socotra…

Also various countries ruin their huge touristic potential, mostly due to religious (guess which religion) or political issues, or both.

52

Interesting plan . As per Zionist Memel - Islamo-Nazi supporters in USA allowed, tolerated and facilitated :

Could be much more beneficial to absorb 9.6 mil Izraelis - highly educated/organized and resorceful society, not to mention their fighting spirit and military potential, instead of " barbarian hordes" with who knows what deseases and not vaxed against covid and who may and I am speculating here cause in not so distant future the 911 look like a kindergarden event.

They would feel like at home especialy when BIBI claims Congress and Senate are already in his pockets. Is it not a simpler sollution ? And USA will save at least 12-13 bil. usd
per year . Think about it. :wink:

53

Last I checked the Palestine state was on the west bank of the Jordan river. To get peace in the Middle east that fact has to be recognized and ratified by more Governments.

It is dangerous to life in places with heat waves and guns:

54

Here’s a plan.

Since Egypt has a long history with Yemen, even to training the Yemeni army long ago, why doesn’t the USA start a coalition (NATO/Japan) saying coalition countries will stop using the Suez Canal. Period. No threats. No bluster. Just quiet diplomacy. And we will brand the Houthis as pirates, not terrorists. One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter. But pirates are just pirates.

Moreover, the Coalition will refuse to accept cargo from any vessel that uses the Suez Canal. That makes things hot for China. If Xi is smart, he starts putting quiet pressure on Iran to stop arming the Houthis, because China will lose cash. Once Egypt starts losing $8 billion from canal fees it has incentive to exert force on the Houthis. Moreover, Egypt has a long history of military cooperation with Yemen, so they know who they are dealing with.

Make it a war on piracy, waged by an international coalition, ala the successful Kuwait War.

In addition to bombing Houthis strongholds, the Coalition will blockade Yemeni ports, cutting off supplies from Iran to the Houthis. Which also means starving Yemeni woman and children because Iran will try to smuggle arms in with the food, meaning everything must be blockaded.

So, use the historic tactic for Middle East wars: arm the Houthis’ Yemeni enemies. The Yemeni war is, to a degree, a tribal war. So, arm the other tribes. Suggest the Egyptians/Saudis give these “good Yemenis” cover to operate out of a defended area around Aden. Have the Egyptian Army/Saudis/good-Yemenis go in to do the dirty work of rooting out the pirates ashore. Boots on the ground. Remember, the Houthis would have broken Egyptian’s rice bowl, so the Egyptians will be motivated.

Bring UN humanitarian supplies into Aden to feed the “good Yemenis”. The Houthis will starve, and the Yemenis they control, faced with starvation, will tend to revolt against them, leaving the Houthis with little energy for attacking merchant ships. Those tribes that revolt get fed.

The Houthis will attack Aden to get to the supplies and there the Coalition/Egyptian/Saudis can help the “good Yemenis” to defeat the Houthis over a course of years.

The Egyptians/ Saudis, who will take will want something in exchange for cooperation, and for losing troops in ground assaults. So, the US administration will quietly tell the Israeli government to get out of Gaza. Enough is enough. The Israelis made their point. If they want to continue, the supplies of arms to them will become a trickle.

Blowback: In Western countries inflation will escalate as shipping costs rise. China may retaliate against the plan by raising tariffs on US farm imports. Also, the arms we give the “good Yemenis” will inevitably be used against us some years down the line, somehow, somewhere. But that’s the way things are handled in the Middle East, since before the time of the Persians.

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55

Because that technique is working sooooooo well in Gaza with Hamas and the pier for UN humanitarian supplies? I would imagine that Yemenis are equally afraid of the Houthis as Gazans are of Hamas. Every squeaky wheel gets greased… and not in a good way, so they don’t revolt out of fear.

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56

The difference is the Palestinians are a single entity. A temporary dock is being established in a war zone, lacking robust security, to feed a populace that is being attacked by our own ally.

But the war in Yemen is a civil war split on largely tribal lines. The name “Houthi” comes from the Houthi tribe. The Houthi tribe has tribal enemies, whose remaining strength is centered on Aden, which has docks and wharves. So, strengthen the Houthis’s enemies and have them because our allies. They will run Aden and handle security there for the supplies the Coalition sends in, solely for our allies (financed mostly by Kuwait, Qatar, etc.)

The Houthis, our enemies, get nothing from anyone, except constant bombardment and amphibious raids from the Coalition, which now has Arab members. Which means widespread starvation on the Houthis side, but that is the penalty for supporting pirates.

57

Freighterman, you selectively edited the Admiral’s writing.

The admiral WAS NOT advocating putting boots on the ground. A careful read of his tome was to attack the pirates ashore - not waiting for them to go to sea and attack the ships.

HERE’S THE PART YOU LEFT OUT: “Once the pirates or their weapons — missiles, drones, unmanned high-speed boats — are in the open seaway, the challenges multiply.”

The admiral then gave 4 phases of a campaign - NONE OF WHICH INCLUDED BOOTS ON THE GROUND.

Look, I get that you are a “non-interventionist” . Fine. OWN IT. It’s just fk’g amazing to me that you are content with an entity launching ballistic missiles at neutral shipping, and. be ok with that. [Note: No country has launched BM’s at ships. Not Hitler’s Germany, Russia, China, NOKO. But you’re ok with a group of terriorists. WOW!]

58

Without rancor: You’re not comprehending the Admiral never suggested putting boots on the ground. His four phases had no mention, or implication of a ground assault.

59

What about using US “power of persuasjon” to stop the Israeli slaughter of civilians and starvation of children in Gaza?

At the same time Egypt and Qatar persuade Hamas to release hostages and stop firing rockets at Israel, against promise of a permanent peace agreement.

That take away the declared reason for the Houthis to attack shipping and for Hezbollah to fire rockets into northern Israel.

Finally, get serious about the “two state solution” for a permanent and workable peace in the region.

Of course nothing of this is possible with Netanyahu in charge, with the support of far-right religious selots.

60

My friend, it seems to me we are living on different worlds. In my world, in my last post, just today, a big, detailed post, I advocate a coalition of the USA/NATO/Japan conduct a bombardment campaign on the Houthis, while incentivizing Arab forces to cooperate with the coalition to root the pirates out ashore, while other Arab nation provide food to our new tribal allies, in order for them to crush the Houthis. I also advocate disrupting world trade to focus the world on actively solving the issue. I also acknowledge the reality that all of this will lead to the death by starvation of innocents.

And then you refer to me as a…

In my world, let me assure you, my plan makes me very much an interventionist.

61

While I understand your reasoning, what this does IMO is reward Iran/Houthis for their attacks. They will see our persuading of the Israelis as a victory for them, and therefore incentivize them to restart the missile attacks whenever they want something from us.

I think it better for the Houthis to be destroyed by a world coalition, ALA the Kuwait War coalition, stamping out piracy, and make an example of what happens to anyone who tries to do the same thing.

IMO at all times the Houthis needed to be branded as nothing more than pirates, and stamped out as such.

62

Attacking ships (including piracy) should simply be considered a acts of war and allow both ship owners and states to handle accordingly, swiftly, and without having to ask expensive inefficient bureaucratic organizations à la UNO, and also allow unrestricted lethal measures to fight piracy, including sinking clearly identified motherships.

I do not care the least about the motivations of the Houthis, if they attack ships they have to be “taken care of” accordingly, accepting also some collateral damages.

Unfortunately there are very powerful insidious lobbies, so I merely expect the usual “wait-and-see-until-it-is-too-late” stance, as I already mentioned it, the same as for the Iranian bomb.
There are red flags everythere but no one wants to see them and also sanctions do not work.

Disrupting worldwide logistics is a multi-billion US$ timebomb, it would be way more appropriate to secure the passage and eliminate as many Houthis as required,
and for that there is no need for boots on the ground.