AB to Mate 200 question

I’m asking about what people do when different licenses are available to them.
So I’m looking at the Coast Guard requirements for Mate 200 and it says about sea service:

“360 days of deck service on Ocean or Near Coastal water”

For AB Special it says:

“AB Special – 360 days deck service on any navigable waters of the U.S.”

So if you entered the Piney Point apprentice program and finished with an AB Special, could you also get the Mate 200 license? Why wouldn’t you? Could you advance faster in getting your licenses as a Mate of a lower tonnage ship, or as an AB? Assume for the purposes of this question that you ultimately want to get a Master Unlimited.

No, you can’t also get the mate 200-ton license. Why? see google.com.

I tried that, I don’t see anything about my question.

CFR 10.427 Service requirements for mate of near coastal steam or motor vessels of not more than 200 gross tons.

Yes, 360 days like I posted. An AB special is also 360 days. I know there’s an exam for Mate. What are you trying to say? You made a statement that you can’t get a Mate 200 under the scenario I posted.

Master/Mate of not more of 200 GT Master:

Two years total service on ocean or near coastal waters. Service on Great Lakes and inland waters may substitute for up one year of the required service. One year of the required service must have been as a master, mate or equivalent supervisory position while holding a license a master, as mate or as operator of uninspected passenger vessels; or,
One year of total service as a licensed operator or second-class operator of ocean or near coastal uninspected towing vessels. Completion of a limited examination is also required.
Mate:

Twelve months total service in the deck department of ocean or near coastal steam or motor, ail or auxiliary sail vessels. Service on the Great Lakes and inland waters may substitute for up to six months of the required service; or,
Three months total service in the deck department of steam or motor vessels operating on ocean, near coastal, great lakes or inland waters while holding a license as master of inland steam or motor, sail or auxiliary sail vessels of not more than 200 gross tons.
The holder of a license as operator of uninspected passenger vessels may obtain this license by successfully completing an examination on rules and regulations for small passenger vessels.
In order to obtain an endorsement on this license for sail or auxiliary sail vessels, the applicant must submit evidence of six months of deck services on sail or auxiliary sail vessels.
A License as master of near coastal steam or motor vessels may be endorsed as mate of sail or auxiliary sail vessels upon presentation of three months or service on sail or auxiliary sail vessels.
In order to obtain a tonnage endorsement of over 100 gross tons, the applicant must complete the additional examination topics indicated in subpart I of this part.
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I don’t know why you posted that. Twelve months in the deck department is the same as 360 days. My question is if you finish the Piney Point program and get an AB Special, why couldn’t you just go on for 200 ton Mate at that time? Assuming you can pass whatever test is required. Is there some disadvantage I’m not seeing? Is it easier or faster to advance as a Mate 200 than as an AB? Thanks.

Boy all this figuring out what sea time for what license and what tonnage and what HP. Sounds like the 4 years I spent at the academy was easier. Then take a test and handed an unlimited license

Maybe because the Piney Point deal is a special program that gets you the AB. It’s not a program that gets you the 200 Mate. Do the program, you get the AB.
TANSTAAFL

[QUOTE=Flyer69;61304]Maybe because the Piney Point deal is a special program that gets you the AB. It’s not a program that gets you the 200 Mate. Do the program, you get the AB.
TANSTAAFL[/QUOTE]

I’m not sure they hand you the AB, I thought you had to apply for it on your own. They do not advertise or guarantee you get an AB, this was just information I found out over the phone. Regardless, my question is, if you have the AB can you apply for the Mate 200 based on the almost identical sea service requirement? Or, framed another way, why would someone who has 360 days service get an AB instead of the Mate 200? Can a Mate 200 work as an AB Special?

Did you read the part that says you the 200 ton mate license is an upgrade license; and, that you have to have logged time as a master or mate while holding a license as a master or mate?

[QUOTE=MariaW;61287]

So if you entered the Piney Point apprentice program and finished with an AB Special, could you also get the Mate 200 license? Why wouldn’t you? Could you advance faster in getting your licenses as a Mate of a lower tonnage ship, or as an AB? Assume for the purposes of this question that you ultimately want to get a Master Unlimited.[/QUOTE]

Coast Guard approved courses give credit for whatever is stated in the approval letter either x number of days or that the applicant is considered to have met the service requirements for a specific credential. The answer to your question depends on what the approval letter says. For example, the maritime academy’s approval letters say the applicant meets the service requirements towards a Third Mate license, not that the applicant gets 1080 days credit toward any credential.

A 200 ton mate is not an upgrade and can be gotten with no prior licensed service.

What tsteinford said. You do not get 360 days from piney point, you get an AB Special.

To answer your other question, if you want to sail as an unlimited officer you need time on unlimited vessels. It won’t benefit your goals to work as a mate on a vessel less than 200grt.

A 200 ton mate cannot serve on an unlimited vessel as a mate, and neither can an AB Special serve as an AB.

If you don’t get 360 days… that doesn’t make sense. To get to 3rd mate you need three years on deck, it doesn’t say you have to be an AB. So, are you telling me that first year you spent in the program doesn’t count as a year of sea service, that you’re starting from 0 once you get an AB? When you get to 180 days beyond your AB Special, are they going to tell you: “Nope sorry, can’t give you AB Limited, you only have 180 days sea service”. The official CG checklist says nothing about time as an AB Special when you want to upgrade to AB Limited, it only mentions total time on deck, which is 540 days.

Forget I said unlimited please, that was a future goal. Since the sea time is the same, why wouldn’t an AB Special go for a 200 ton Mate, is there a disadvantage to doing that?

[QUOTE=Capt. Schmitt;61316]A 200 ton mate is not an upgrade and can be gotten with no prior licensed service.[/QUOTE]

Thanks, I think PMC missed the “or” in the regulation. One word can make a world of difference.

You seem to have some basic misunderstanding and you are so insistent on thinking that way that you cannot see what people are trying to tell you. You do not get 360 days of sea time from completing the program. You are allowed to get an AB Special with less sea time than normal because you competed their program. You do not qualify for a 200 ton mate based on that, because it is not in their approval letter.

For someone who worked on deck for 360 days then it depends on what they want to do. If they want to work on ships, a 200 ton license will not allow them to be a mate. Then again, neither will an AB Special allow them to be an AB. If they want to work on tugs or crew boats then it would be a benefit. Then again, if they wanted to work on tugs they should not be on ships since you can’t be a mate on a tug without a towing endorsement and tug experience.

And actually, yes the regulations do require you to have time as an AB to get your 3M, and any mate license over 200grt.

Capt. Schmitt its obvious you are the one with the basic misunderstanding. When she rephrases the question for the fourteenth time it will suddenly be crystal clear to you.

Then you rephrase the question for her. As far as I can tell all her questions have been answered but she refuses to accept the answers given.

[QUOTE=tsteinford;61314]Coast Guard approved courses give credit for whatever is stated in the approval letter either x number of days or that the applicant is considered to have met the service requirements for a specific credential. The answer to your question depends on what the approval letter says. For example, the maritime academy’s approval letters say the applicant meets the service requirements towards a Third Mate license, not that the applicant gets 1080 days credit toward any credential.[/QUOTE]

As fare as I can tell from the regulations I’ve been reading, that would make sense, since any advancement beyond Third Mate requires service as Third Mate, and specifically mentions “Third Mate”. If you’re starting out on deck, and not a 3rd Mate yet, any deck service counts towards Mate. The rules say you need 3 years service on deck for a 3rd Mate. You could be an OS for all that time. It doesn’t say 2 of those years have to be as an AB. If the approval letter said you fulfilled the requirements for AB only, and didn’t grant you sea time, then that would mean it would take you a year extra to get to Mate, because the year you spent in apprentice school didn’t count as part of your sea service. Again, none of the rules I’ve looked at mention time spent as an AB as a prerequisite for any licensed credential.

Besides, I’m almost 100% positive that the lady at the apprentice school told me that the AB was an option, and you get sea time credit, not that you graduate with the AB. She even gave me the number of days. I’m going to call them again Monday to make sure.