Zero emission ships by 2030?

Shocked may be a bit exaggerated:

Source: Has COVID affected climate change? We Asked a NASA Scientist: Episode 35 - NASA

that nasa reply seems like a stab in the dark, they now have data on covid caused co2 reduction and the net result hence they can calculate how much reduction of man made co2 will reduce the co2 in the atmosphere…
Where’s the data?
Back in the 9-11 economic slowdown there was a atmospheric reduction hence they expected it during covid.

Maybe not Zero emission but at least a step in that direction:


Some thought provoking words in reply to Andrew Craig-Bennett:

Not easy to be “green” when you are at the “end of the world”:

NZ importing record amounts of coal to power their stupid push to EV’s before they have enough green power to run them.


This is just objectively wrong. NZ is on 40% renewable. Coal only makes up 4% of power production. This took 5 seconds to google.

For a bunch of mechanically inclined folks out here trying to optimize fuel consumption of ships, I jusy dont get how we cant wrap our heads around:

ICE Generator at constant RPM > ICE car engine speed up, slow down, stop, idle, gun it, repeat.

Sure, an EV is running in 4% coal, but its also running on 40% renewable. And unlike your ICE car that will always run on gas or diesel, or your gas station that will give gas or diesel to power your car, and EV and EV charging network can change power source with technology and infastructure advances.


took 5 seconds to find ( 10% is coal)

The issue is coal is expanding to plug supply and renewables are not.
I cant grasp the concept that adding more EV’s will somehow create more green power supply when infact they may well be carbon negative except in countries on 100% renewables

yes all true, should have converted to lpg years ago but years of talking…
I guess it got the sulfur content reduced.

Now the atmosphere is getting clearer its heating the planet more, not to mention solar panels are causing lots of localized heating.

The article linked in post #84 was about emission from container transport to/from NZ.
AFAIK none of the container vessels serving that trade is coal fired

Last I checked LPG stood for Liquide Petroleum Gas, i.e. fossil fuel.
Yes causing less particle pollusjon but hardly a “green” fuel.

Particle pollution from ICEs are mainly local. It does not reach the troposphere to affect the global climate.

BTW; particle pollution from coal fired power stations, major forest fires and volcanic activity can get high enough to reach the jet streams. This MAY cause blackening of glaciers and the sea ice, thus causing less reflection an rapid warming in polar areas. This again cause more rapid glacial melting and higher sea levels over time.

PS> Farmers used to spread manure on their snow covered fields to speed up melting in spring.

Agreed carbon from combustion is typically local and gets washed to the ground with rain ( Singapore is a perfect example of that)
BUT the gases from combustion all effect the atmosphere and the different fuels are all different some lots better then others, like lpg versus mgo or hfo
Sure its a fossil but all the pollutants it creates and like 50% or more lower than the common fuels, hence lpg forklifts operate in factories with humans.

Check your dates, that was from 2021 when coal consumption was at a record high. Its now at a 32 year low in New Zealand

The EVs do not create more green energy. The EVs can run on clean energey, as we build it. ICE vehicles will run on gasoline forever. A in 5 years, a 2012 kia soul will be running on 100% gasoline. In 5 years, a Telsa could go from running on 80% fossile fuel to 50% fossile fuel with nothing on changed the consumer end.

This isnt even what i was talking about. A ULSD power generation station, will use fuel more efficiency than me running around down in a VW Jetta. Thats not even considereing 20-40% renewables powering the grid If i were in an EV.

Ocean acidification is the other half of the battle from Co2, so there’s that. Also “See! the pollution we were making everthing cooler! Look how reduced oil consumption is bad for the environment” sounds exactly like propaganda the oil industry would pump out.

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Our previous government was so keen to earn its environmental stripes it closed down all offshore exploration when we had a couple of dry years. We have better quality coal near the main combined cycle power station but we import cheaper Indonesian coal.
The handy sized bulk carriers ship the coal into Tauranga and back load timber products reducing shipping costs.
In government the adults are back in the room and subsidised sales of EV’s are being removed.
The lakes are full now and hydro is providing most of the power together with geothermal.
Our first cargo of frozen meat to London was in about 1883 in the sailing ship Dunedin. The refrigeration plant burnt 3 tonnes of coal a day and she loaded 300 tonnes of coal for the voyage.

oops I have to eat my words, luckily due to global warming they had a wet warm winter and had a big hydro year.

A very good point
Does assume no synthetic fuel will exist or they run on green methanol

another good point

Yes its delicate balance and the world has been where its heading now previously.
The planet needs the atmosphere to keep us warm and cool, different parts of the suns rays need to be reflected.

Co2 levels didnt drop during covid, NASA cant understand why.

I was just talking to a rep from a marine cloth manufacturer and they are saying we are seeing more UV damage in the last couple of years.
Maybe solar panels will work better and make up for the extra heating they are creating?
At what level of EV take up will not add excess co2 to the planet whilst we have part fossil fuel powering them and the co2 output to build them is greater than an ICE vehicle? I can also see they become write offs more often in accidents so the rate of replacement is surely much higher then ice vehicles.
Are salvage yards filling up with them in the USA?

One headline in Australia the other day was a replacement battery for a Fiat 500 EV was more than the cost of the ICE Fiat 500

Polluting less is good and is about the only thing everyone can agree on.

I guess if people repeat this misinformation enough it will always be true?

What you say isn’t going to be true in all operating conditions. A good direct mechanical connection is usually going be the most efficient possibility in theory. There is a reason slow-speed direct drive diesels are used in ships.


Have MPG ratings always been a lie? There is a reason city millage is lower than highway. An EV averages city and highway driving and puts the load on the Utilities’ generator, which is spinning at a constant RPM. Which isn’t even a fair fight, given we’re only on about 80% fossile fuel. Its even less of a fair fight, when very little powere is actualy generated from diesel. A Jeep Wrangler 4xe can run all electric for about 20 miles. Or you can burn a gallon of Gasoline to get just as far. Or you can run it as a full hybrid for like 50mpge. You just need to charge a 17kWh battery. Electical math is not my area of expertise, but thats what, 0.6% of one of the hoover dam turbines spinning for an hour? I know thats not how charging works, but there’s no way an ICE commuter car is going to be more efficient than a utility scale generating station.

Not really practical for my kia soul to run on a slow speed diesel, if I’m not mistaken, dont Slow speed Diesels earn their living running at a constant RPM for days at a time? Not even an apple and oranges comparison, more apples and rocks. Maybe driving downhill for miles and miles might be more efficient? But EVs will even capture energy with regenerative braking rather than turning gas into heat via rotors and brakes.

city millage is less because you are slowing and accelerating the mass using lots more power
Are all buses electric with regen yet to use that fundamental law of physics?

PS a current F1 engine has a BSFC as good as any power plant/ship
Variable speed in a gasoline engine is far less of a problem than a diesel.

We’re almost on the same page.

On the charge side. The generator doesnt stop and go. The generator just go. You can be drag racing, hyper miling, or stuck in traffic. Generator just go brrrrrr. Generator not on car.

Not only do I not drive an F1 car, but my car is also not 20% nuclear power plant and 20% solar pannel. Its 100% gas.