This old chief engineer I worked with in the 80’s told me there were no shipping jobs in the commercial sector. When I quit off his ship, ( I had four months aboard and the ship was going on a 4 month Westpac) He pulled me aside and told me I was making the right choice. There are other options out there for MSC professional seamen. If you have no other life but MSC than so be it. Network with old MSC seaman as I still do and I get jobs through them. A lot of MEBA guys are ex MSC and they are chiefs, port engineers and union officials.
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There certainly are not shortage of haters out there towards MSC. Nor are there any shortage of horror stories about MSC (which I believe every single one of them).
You are correct, the people in the office are inept, incompetence and indifferent to everything involving CIVMAR’.s. They are all too often the reason people quit.
However, MSC is the largest employer of merchant seaman in the world. They are bigger than Maresk. Bigger than Transocean, and bigger than anyone else you can think of. We are at 5000+ CIVMAR’s and set for modest growth in the future. They aren’t going away any time soon. It would be an accurate statement to say “They are too big to fail”.
What about sequestration? Yes, it will absolutely affect us. But since we are 15 chief mates short right now, we can afford to take some cuts. The oil patch has it’s high’s and low’s. Every industry, even government, has periods of growth and cuts. MSC will get through it.
Just like there are a variety of different commercial companies out there and a variety of experiences with those companies, the same could be said of MSC. Yes, there are some bad ships. Yes, there are some bad captains and some bad chief engineers. But there are a few good ones too. I recently heard MMP “re-organized” their pension plan. From what I gathered, they were cooking the books and now their members are screwed. And you can’t tell me AMO is any better. Yeah, I’m going to have to work for MSC for 40 years before I can retire – but I will get 40% of my base salary, plus my 401K plan. Anyone else getting the same or better out there?
Yes, the time off sucks – but if you know how to work the system it can be made a lot more bearable. Between medical, Navy reserve time and training, there are ways to get what you want. MSC doesn’t charge me any time off when I travel to and from my ship. Taking a USCG upgrade test – I don’t get charged. Training – I don’t get charged. Reserve time – I don’t get charged. Can the same be said for international oil rig workers?
There is no guarantee the government won’t go broke or change the retirement plan, but the same can be said of the unions.
So hate all you want, but as I was sitting outside a Caraboo Coffee having a Mocha and blueberry muffin – on overtime – and thinking about how I just made $20K (gross) last month, I was also thinking about what I was going to go see while we were in port for the next three weeks, I thought “You know, this aint so bad”.
S[B]o hate all you want, but as I was sitting outside a Caraboo Coffee having a Mocha and blueberry muffin – on overtime – and thinking about how I just made $20K (gross) last month, I was also thinking about what I was going to go see while we were in port for the next three weeks, I thought “You know, this aint so bad”.
[/B]
Notice you didn’t mention MEBA if you start at 22 and retire at 50 your pension 71% of high 3 years or gvt cap chiefs are pulling down 140 plus a year (6 months work). You also have a 5-10% money purchase benefit(amount varies by co contracts) and any money you stashed in a 401k The best thing you have is 1/2 your life (you only get 1) . MSC takes 80% of your life which you never get back. Enjoy that latte I’m at home with a beer.
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$20k for a months work? Bwahahahahah
Not only that but having to work 4-6-8 months straight sounds like a lose lose…
Why I can respect that you enjoy MSC, I dont think 20k and 40% pension are anything to brag about. 20K a month for who? I didnt see what position you hold but 2nds and 3rd where I am at will pull that down with minimal OT.
I see by the coffee statement that you fit in very well with government work.
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However, MSC is the largest employer of merchant seaman in the world. They are bigger than Maresk. Bigger than Transocean, and bigger than anyone else you can think of. We are at 5000+ CIVMAR’s and set for modest growth in the future. They aren’t going away any time soon. It would be an accurate statement to say “They are too big to fail”.
“Mercahnt Seamen”, well if your definition is somebody with an MMC, you may have a point. But I dare say that half if not more of an MSC ships crew is made up of folks in the Supply, Communications and Steward department that hold OS/Wiper/FH ratings. How many of these type folks are on a replentishment vessel? 25? 30? More? These jobs don’t even exist on non-CIVMAR crewed vessels that sail with a crew of <20. While MSC does employ lots of folks, (like a cruise liner company), referring to them, (or Issac the bartender), as Merchant Seamen is bit fallacious.
[QUOTE=Jeffrox;96943]However, MSC is the largest employer of merchant seaman in the world. They are bigger than Maresk. Bigger than Transocean, and bigger than anyone else you can think of. We are at 5000+ CIVMAR’s and set for modest growth in the future. They aren’t going away any time soon. It would be an accurate statement to say “They are too big to fail”.
“Mercahnt Seamen”, well if your definition is somebody with an MMC, you may have a point. But I dare say that half if not more of an MSC ships crew is made up of folks in the Supply, Communications and Steward department that hold OS/Wiper/FH ratings. How many of these type folks are on a replentishment vessel? 25? 30? More? These jobs don’t even exist on non-CIVMAR crewed vessels that sail with a crew of <20. While MSC does employ lots of folks, (like a cruise liner company), referring to them, (or Issac the bartender), as Merchant Seamen is bit fallacious.[/QUOTE]
I take offense sir. I have in the course of my work, visited almost all of the east coast MSC vessels, and have YET to meet one crew member who can mix a decent classic martini. And the exotic drinks? Sex On The Beach? Fugget it. And they have the boiler tube failures to prove it. Too much vermouth drops the hydrate alkalinity way out of sight!
I am working on plans to get out of here before it’s too late. I had more time off when I was in the Navy!! This place just destroys your mental health and like Too Bad Steam Is Gone said it takes 80% of your life away that you’ll NEVER get back. I have a new house that I bought 3 years ago and spent less than 6 months in! I’m a 3rd AE with a 2 AE UL and there’s got to be something better than this! 120/30…screw that!
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Your right that Msc vessels have a larger crew than a traditional commercial ship. I’ve sailed both and therefore seen both sides of the equation. One comment I always hear from the commercial sector is the large manning comment. Msc ships can and have gone to sea with small crews of under 20. The COI are along the same lines am any commercial ship. However the larger crews are required for cargo movement and operations with the navy, Sure, you can take a ship from point A to point B with a small crew, but unlike commercial ships the bulk of work is done at sea for Msc mariners. Communications, and supply personnel while not traditional merchant jobs do go to sea alongside other more traditional roles on Msc ships. They contribute to the operation, and from view point as a Master I never spilt hairs, or considered someone less of a merchant mariner due to their duties onboard.
[QUOTE=Xmsccapt(ret);96977]Your right that Msc vessels have a larger crew than a traditional commercial ship. I’ve sailed both and therefore seen both sides of the equation. One comment I always hear from the commercial sector is the large manning comment. Msc ships can and have gone to sea with small crews of under 20. The COI are along the same lines am any commercial ship. However the larger crews are required for cargo movement and operations with the navy, Sure, you can take a ship from point A to point B with a small crew, but unlike commercial ships the bulk of work is done at sea for Msc mariners. Communications, and supply personnel while not traditional merchant jobs do go to sea alongside other more traditional roles on Msc ships. They contribute to the operation, and from view point as a Master I never spilt hairs, or considered someone less of a merchant mariner due to their duties onboard.[/QUOTE]
My Thanks button went AWOL again so I’d like to post a THANK YOU for that one, Captain.
My thanks button is working :). Thanks for your comment.
Lots of us ex MSC folks have an extreme dislike for the organisation. I remember going to the supply officer looking for purifier parts. A retired navy Filipino guy ( probably was a steward dept guy in USN) could not find the purifier bearing I needed so I went back in the storeroom and found it in 5 minutes. This man was paid the same base as the 1st engineer. I work with great Filipino guys and this guy was a useless boil. I had a 3rd on watch with me trying to get a condensate sample from an evap tube nest drain under vacuum while losing the vacuum on #2 generator. There were good people to but you could not fire these losers. I was in Diego Garcia in 1989 as 1 a/e on a lash ship and ran into some MSC guys and was going to dinner the next night with them. Next night they didn;t show. That same idiot engineer “Mr vacuum” had closed the gen breaker 180 out of phase and welded the contacts together. That’s why my former “good msc guys” never showed for dinner. They spent their evening racking out the breaker and pulling the contacts apart with crow bars. Can you feel the hatred!
[QUOTE=Too bad steam is gone;97028]Lots of us ex MSC folks have an extreme dislike for the organisation. I remember going to the supply officer looking for purifier parts. A retired navy Filipino guy ( probably was a steward dept guy in USN) could not find the purifier bearing I needed so I went back in the storeroom and found it in 5 minutes. This man was paid the same base as the 1st engineer. I work with great Filipino guys and this guy was a useless boil. I had a 3rd on watch with me trying to get a condensate sample from an evap tube nest drain under vacuum while losing the vacuum on #2 generator. There were good people to but you could not fire these losers. I was in Diego Garcia in 1989 as 1 a/e on a lash ship and ran into some MSC guys and was going to dinner the next night with them. Next night they didn;t show. That same idiot engineer “Mr vacuum” had closed the gen breaker 180 out of phase and welded the contacts together. That’s why my former “good msc guys” never showed for dinner. They spent their evening racking out the breaker and pulling the contacts apart with crow bars. Can you feel the hatred![/QUOTE]
It’s not going to get any better. There’s a hiring freeze…which means the long-suffering who need a relief will have to wait longer, or leave for greener pastures.
[QUOTE=catherder;97130]It’s not going to get any better. There’s a hiring freeze…which means the long-suffering who need a relief will have to wait longer, or leave for greener pastures.[/QUOTE]
There is more…just listened to Admiral Buzby who visited just recently, and basically said IF Congress doesnt’ act by March, the Navy may have to trim costs by up to 10.5 billion this coming fiscal year. He said possibly two AKEs and two AOEs from each coast would be put into ROS. Reduction in spending will even mean that year end ship’s maintenance will be canceled. Reductions will be felt thoughout the Navy and MSC.
[QUOTE=seacomber;97142]There is more…just listened to Admiral Buzby who visited just recently, and basically said IF Congress doesnt’ act by March, the Navy may have to trim costs by up to 10.5 billion this coming fiscal year. He said possibly two AKEs and two AOEs from each coast would be put into ROS. Reduction in spending will even mean that year end ship’s maintenance will be canceled. Reductions will be felt thoughout the Navy and MSC.[/QUOTE]
I believe it. Just spoke to a C/E on an east coast AOE which is shipyard bound soon…he hasn’t heard anything yet but it wouldn’t surprise me if that would be one of them. I’m also willing to bet that several items in the yard package will be cut or done pierside.
I remember hearing stories about guys asking for reliefs after 6 months and then not getting them. Then after another 6 months past telling the old man they were walking off. Captain refused to give them their passports to the point where they had to visit the embassy in Japan. Does MSC sign Articles?
I never surrendered my passport to the old man on any MSC voyage I was on. Is that an MSC employee only policy? I was sailing with SIU all we did was show them passport at sign on. Signing articles for overseas voyage was just showing passport and shot card. Also one argument constantly thrown about is how recession proof MSC is. So you’re stuck without a relief and now they may stack ships and defer maintenance. They pro MSC crowd are slowly losing their ammo.
[QUOTE=brjones;97145]I remember hearing stories about guys asking for reliefs after 6 months and then not getting them. Then after another 6 months past telling the old man they were walking off. Captain refused to give them their passports to the point where they had to visit the embassy in Japan. Does MSC sign Articles?[/QUOTE]
They sign articles but I have never heard of someone not being able to get their passport. I’ll ask around. When I’m overseas and ashore I keep my passport in an inside jacket pocket or some other secure place on me so I can’t imagine someone else locking them up somewhere…can’t be legal
I was once wierded out when an Italian hotel wanted to retain my passport during a month long stay and I demanded it back and got it. But that was a hotel.
The part about the reliefs is true, though. Reliefs are in short supply and it’s going to get worse.
[QUOTE=Fraqrat;97151]I never surrendered my passport to the old man on any MSC voyage I was on. Is that an MSC employee only policy? [/QUOTE]
It depends on where you are sailing. In a lot of ports immigration wants to look at all the passports and sometimes the agent will them all ashore to clear the ship. Not the U.S. however as immigration always wants a “face check” I collect them as required so I don’t have to wake up crew and collect P.Ps at 0300.
I believe that MSC ships don’t get cleared in foreign ports as far as I know as they are U.S. government and exempt.
K.C.
You don’t sign articles on an msc ship, maybe contract but not NFAF. Yes, the purser at times takes up the passports for port calls, then he returns them. No Msc master I ever heard of keeps them hostage. If someone wants to depart the ship they are free to do so with passport in hand. If they resign then they pay their own way back and surrender their CAC card. Simple.
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