Upgrading to 2/M Unlimited on OSV under 3000 ITC

Good Afternoon, I was wondering if anyone knows exactly how to upgrade your 3/M unlimited to 2/M unlimited/1600 ton master while working as a mate on a supply boat that is just under 3000 ITC.

Turn in your application when you have 240 - 12 hour days as 3rd mate.

So I can continue sailing as a 1600 ton mate while holding my third mate and still be able to upgrade? thanks for your help

It’s the time on your 3/M that counts toward 2/M.

sorry for the confusion so I wont be able to upgrade if I don’t get on a vessel over 3000 ITC and sail as third mate

Like I said before, when you have 240 - 12 hour days, turn in your application for 2nd Mate. You will have no problems upgrading on an OSV that’s 2,500 ITC for instance. Why you have a 1600 ton mate and a third mate unlimited would be the question I have.

I have is my third mates unlimited I graduated from a maritime academy but on the OSV they hire you as a 1600 ton mate but the license I am using is my third mates thanks for the info

Actually, on OSVs you’re hired as a mate, as OSV COIs do not specify 3/M, 2/M, C/M. Then, of course, there’s all that GOM 2nd Captain 3rd Captain bullshit that someone made up. But you don’t have a Master’s license so you don’t have to worry about that. Yet.

No kidding, never mind all companies are different in this regard and you have to spend 10 minuets to explain it to H/R so they now how your old position translate to their system.

I thought 3000 ITC was equal to 1600 GRT as far as the regs are concerned. But you can upgrade to 2/M Unlimited without any seatime on a ship over 3000 ITC?

I was wondering the same thing…:confused:

He/She will still be able to upgrade. They might put a tonnage limitation, but I’ve seen where they did not. Either way, there will be a license to facilitate the career path.
Depends on what 3rd Mate wants to do. I doubt being a 2nd mate is the goal here. Then you have to ask about Chief and Master…then tonnage is not an issue at all because you can’t upgrade to Master Unlimited on an OSV no matter what the tonnage is. I’ve been down this road myself.
The worst thing that can happen is upgrading to 2nd mate with a 4,000 ton limitation (150% of highest tonnage), then to Chief Mate, but somewhere along the line, over the course of getting seatime, make sure you get on an OSV over 3,000 tons ITC for a few hitches to get the limitation taken off. This can happen in parallel to upgrading…no time lost.
If the name of the thread was “Upgrading to Unlimited Master on OSV under 3,000 ITC”, then I would be dismissive all together.

So basically what I can do is get on an OSV that is 3000 ITC or more an then I would not have no tonnage limitations at the time for upgrade to 2/M, and I could go all the way up to Master Unlimited when the time comes even though I will be working on an OSV greater than 3000 ITC if thats the case?

If you get on an OSV over 3,000 tons, then yes, there will be no risk of getting a limitation on your license. You will be able to upgrade to Chief Mate, but not to “unlimited” Master on an OSV. You will have to get actual Chief Mate time to upgrade to Master. This cannot happen on an OSV for several reasons:

  1. Although OSVs do require OICNW, which includes 3rd and 2nd mates allowing you to upgrade, they do not require Chief Mates.
  2. Although you may consider yourself a chief mate on an OSV, and the resposibility of the vessel might fall to you if the captain becomes incapacitated, you are still not the Chief Mate, or “Chief of the Mates”, because there is only you. There is no hierarchy of mates required, so you can not be the Chief of what’s not there. Some argue this point by definition, but before you can define anything, you have to meet the term first. The term would be “Chief Mate” in the context of using a “Chief Mate” license.

I would suggest not working on OSVs; if your ultimate goal is to have a license that’s not required on an OSV. I am the pot calling the kettle black because I got my Masters license 99.9% working on OSVs, I just had to get on another ship for 6 months as Chief Mate to upgrade. Now I’m on an OSV with a license I don’t need…Wooopty Dooo. I do believe that the industry is moving toward unlimited vessels that require small boat skill-sets, so maybe, I might become valuable one day.

You’re valuable to us, anchy.

I was hoping we could shed a little more light on this topic. I have the same question of advancing from 3M to 2M on a vessel under 3000ITC - but not OSV. Is the rule different for say smaller drill ships or research vessels - “special purpose vessels”.

To me the rules seem contradictory. Hopefully someone can make this more clear for me.

The following section makes me believe that I need to be on a 10,000ton vessel or 6,500 x 150% to upgrade my unlimited.

[B]§ 11.402 Tonnage requirements for ocean or near coastal endorsements for vessels of over 1600 gross tons.[/B]

<stars> I If the applicant for an endorsement as master or mate does not have the service on vessels over 1600 gross tons required by paragraph (a) of this section, or is qualifying for third mate under the provisions of §11.407© of this subpart, a tonnage limitation is placed on the endorsement based on the applicant’s qualifying experience. The endorsement is limited to the maximum tonnage on which at least 25 percent of the required experience was obtained, or 150 percent of the maximum tonnage on which at least 50 percent of the service was obtained, whichever is higher. Limitations are in multiples of 1000 gross tons, using the next higher figure when an intermediate tonnage is calculated. When the calculated limitation equals or exceeds 10,000 gross tons, the applicant is issued an unlimited tonnage endorsement."[/I]

From this section it seems as though ANYTHING under 10,000 would have a limitation put on the license upgrade. I cant find anything that talks about 3000ITC - even though I have heard of many folks with it.

Under the definitions you will find the following for Gross tons and ITC

[I]Gross register tons (GRT) [/I]means the gross ton measurement of the vessel under 46 U.S.C. chapter 145, Regulatory Measurement. For a vessel measured under only 46 U.S.C. chapter 143, Convention Measurement, the vessel’s gross tonnage, ITC is used to apply all thresholds expressed in terms of gross register tons.
[I]Gross tonnage, ITC (GT ITC) [/I]means the gross tonnage measurement of the vessel under 46 U.S.C. chapter 143, Convention Measurement. Under international conventions, this parameter may be referred to as “gross tonnage (GT).”

This is confusing because of the 1600/3000ITC - From the definitions it seems GT = ITC - is this not the case? If it is they why the distinction? I thought the point of ITC was to standardize the measurement.

Can anyone point me to where it talks about 3000ITC in the CFR’s - I cant seem to find it.



Read Norleen’s article…

3,000 ITC is an STCW limit, without a 3,000 ITC restriction you’re considered unlimited tonnage.

I have a question and apologize for hijacking this thread. What are the requirements to advance from 3rd Mate to 2nd Mate after having received the 3rd Mate through policy letter 01-02? Would I require testing or just seatime? Does tonnage become an issue now?

[QUOTE=CaptKrunch;17466]I have a question and apologize for hijacking this thread. What are the requirements to advance from 3rd Mate to 2nd Mate after having received the 3rd Mate through policy letter 01-02? Would I require testing or just seatime? Does tonnage become an issue now?[/QUOTE]

Seatime only, and a new flashing light certificate, along with a renewal application with all of the goodies.

Tonnage does make a difference. I know a guy with a 3rd Mate unlimited and a 2nd Mate with limited tonnage.

I was just informed that I will be getting a tonnage limitation on my 2/M license. This is after several of the mariners I know have gotten their unlimited 2/M from working on vessels smaller than mine(2994 ITC). It seems that it’s luck of the draw with which CG evaluator you get. If they’re gonna enforce a regulation it should be universal, instead it appears to be haphazard, effectively screwing some mariners, or looking at it the other way, giving the lucky ones a license they don’t deserve. It would be nice if they figured it out.