Russian spy ship off US coast operating in 'unsafe manner,' officials say

Now that is funny and if the oil field recovers it may well be true, especially if they’ll work for peanuts.

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Apart from Cruise ships and US vessels trading domestically international shipping is now crewed by Asian or former Soviet Personnel. The last refuge for western mates and engineers is the oil patch.

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Not entirely true. Croatians don’t consider themselves former Soviet [they’d rather forget] neither do the Scandinavian country’s mariners. However you are correct that Western as in UK and USA are not being offered jobs as before, it’s all about the money. As far as USA mariners are concerned needing to offer them health insurance is a turn off for most employers. It’s an expense they do not wish to bear just to hire a mariner when mariners from most developed countries have their health covered by their home country. Wages, like water seek equilibrium. Like it or not that is the future.

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Help me understand. When VICTORIOUS was in the ECS, and being harassed by the PRC, it was not the US that was violating ROR.

Please provide an example to substantiate your “American Public Vessel” comment.
Thanks

You are correct about Croatian seafarers, many of whom are employed on cruise ships. The Scandinavian countries form part of Western Europe.

If one was to be a bit naughty… one would put together a dream team of mariners from the bridge of the Fitz and Helge Ingstad and put them in a chartered tanker to play about in the same water…
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I will now wash my mouth out with bourbon for suggesting such a bad idea.

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‘Send a destroyer to contain the menace’? Why? So the Russian spy ship can spy on the destroyer up close and personal? Why help them out?

Public vessels (warships, naval auxiliary and such) that are owned or operated by sovereign nations are often omitted from many international agreements. Their compliance is usually voluntary.

Imagine a conflict where a ship must do something that violates ROR, MARPOL, SOLAS or some similar agreement or else be discovered, outmaneuvered or destroyed. No nation would bind their ships to obey laws that would cause their loss or failure of mission. Therefore, public vessels are exempt.

For example, imagine a ship approaching the coast of an adversary to launch missiles or insert special ops. They would go in as unnoticeable as possible - maybe no lights or radar. No nation would direct their ship to announce their position because ROR says so.

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Yes, except I wouldn’t bother with a destroyer. Just send a USCG cutter out to shadow it.

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Public vessels of all nations are exempt from STCW and (IIRC) COLREGS.

I hear this lame excuse all the time on Marad and MSC ships.

Doesn’t make it any less true.

  1. Application

(a) These rules shall apply to all vessels upon the high seas and in all waters connected therewith navigable by seagoing vessels.

(b) Nothing in these Rules shall interfere with the operation of special rules made by an appropriate authority for roadsteads, harbours, rivers, lakes, or inland waterways connected with the high seas and navigable by seagoing vessels. Such special rules shall conform as closely as possible to these Rules.

© Nothing in these Rules shall interfere with the operation of any special rule made by the government of any State with respect to additional station or signal lights, shapes or whistle signals for ships of war and vessels proceeding under convoy, or with respect to additional station or signal lights or shapes for fishing vessels engaged in fishing as a fleet.

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Like the saying goes, ‘When a dog urinates on a fire-hydrant it isn’t committing vandalism - it’s just being a dog.’

Warships are expected to operate aggressively in the presence of opposition. It’s what they do. Calling that behavior ‘unsafe’ or ‘illegal’ is just propaganda for the uneducated domestic audience.

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Everyone knows those ships are surreptitiously fishing under the guise of intelligence-gathering.

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This argument doesn’t make sense to me.

Say you have a driver at night driving on the wrong side of the road with the lights out. That would be considered by most people to be unsafe.

But if the driver is drunk that would not be unsafe because that is what drunk drivers do?

I see what you were trying to say but we have laws and limits to try and keep drunk drivers off the road because we know it makes the roads unsafe.

Both drivers are knowingly choosing to engage in behavior that threatens others. The dog is not.

You could make the argument that when mingling with civilian traffic and under no threat of attack, warships should comply with the COLREGS but the judgment call is theirs and they choose blanket exemption.

There is NO blanket exemption for warships, not in the Convention not US law:

33 US Code 1603. Vessels subject to International Regulations

Except as provided in section 1604 of this title and subject to the provisions of section 1605 of this title, the International Regulations, as proclaimed under section 1602 of this title, shall be applicable to, and shall be complied with by—

(1) all vessels, public and private, subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, while upon the high seas or in waters connected therewith navigable by seagoing vessels, and

(2) all other vessels when on waters subject to the jurisdiction of the United States.

Here is the USCG notice:

The United States Coast Guard has received reports indicating that the RFN VIKTOR LEONOV (AGI-175) has been operating in an unsafe manner off the coast of South Carolina and Georgia. This unsafe operation includes not energizing running lights while in reduced visibility conditions, not responding to hails by commercial vessels attempting to coordinate safe passage and other erratic movements. Vessels transiting these waters should maintain a sharp lookout and use extreme caution when navigating in proximity to this vessel. Mariners should make reports of any unsafe situations to the United States Coast Guard.

Presumably this would be considered unsafe if it was a civilian commercial ship. How does the fact that it is Russian military change that? Even if it is expected behavior how would a mariner know to expect it without the notice? How would they know the type of ship?