Calling all lawyers or guys/gals who can translate Coast Guard gibberish!
One on my ABs is looking to upgrade to 1600 mate or 3rd mate AGT. While doing research, he came across policy letter 11-07, which pretty much says if he tests for his 1600 mate, he can upgrade to 3rd mate AGT with no further testing. The Coast Guard 3/M check off sheet on the USCG web page further back that theory up because it says right on the checklist that if he tested after feb 2002 he can upgrade to 3/M AGT as per policy letter 11-07.
So from what I can read of this, he can move all the way up to 2/M AGT by taking the 1600 mate test. I searched on here some but only came up with 1600 master to 3/M AGT posts. Has anyone done this or give me a clear answer?
[QUOTE=ryanwood86;86620]Calling all lawyers or guys/gals who can translate Coast Guard gibberish!
One on my ABs is looking to upgrade to 1600 mate or 3rd mate AGT. While doing research, he came across policy letter 11-07, which pretty much says if he tests for his 1600 mate, he can upgrade to 3rd mate AGT with no further testing. The Coast Guard 3/M check off sheet on the USCG web page further back that theory up because it says right on the checklist that if he tested after feb 2002 he can upgrade to 3/M AGT as per policy letter 11-07.
So from what I can read of this, he can move all the way up to 2/M AGT by taking the 1600 mate test. I searched on here some but only came up with 1600 master to 3/M AGT posts. Has anyone done this or give me a clear answer?[/QUOTE]
The 500,1600,3rd, and 2nd Mates take the same test. You just need to do the assessments and test once. You just need time and tonnage. Of course, if you get a limited master, like a 1600 ton, that is another test. If you wait till 2nd, it’s a very limited test to get the 1600 ton Master.
I went that route several years ago but missed the stcw deadline and had to take the oicnw classes. But, what you posted is correct. I did not have to test again until the chief mate exam.
Warning though, that route only applies with 1600 ton mate, oceans. If he goes for 1600 master he has to test again for thirds. I know, makes no sense. Someone I was in school with went the master route and had to go through it all again to get the thirds.
Added note, if he can test for 500t master/1600t mate, then when it comes time to upgrade to 2nd mate, he won’t have to test for the upgrade to 1600t master. The assumed rank with the thirds is 100t master. If he already has the 500t it becomes 1600 with the 2nds upgrade.
Another plus is that if you test for 1600 ton mate oceans and have taken an approved celestial course within a year of testing then you do not have to take it at the rec. This also carries on all the way until you upgrade to chief mate.
For me, this was several years ago, so he may want to double check to make sure things havent changed.
He’s going 1600 mate for sure, he doesn’t have the time required for master. So you’re saying when he upgrades to 3/M, his oceans will be attached too? We were under the impression it would drop to NC because he didn’t test at the REC.
[QUOTE=ryanwood86;86671]He’s going 1600 mate for sure, he doesn’t have the time required for master. So you’re saying when he upgrades to 3/M, his oceans will be attached too? We were under the impression it would drop to NC because he didn’t test at the REC.[/QUOTE]
If he got oceans via course, ask the school what the stipulations were on the course approval.
I took celestial at the star center in 2004. Turned the cert into the rec and tested for 500t master/1600t mate oceans without testing for celestial. After subsequent sea time, applied and received unlimted 3rds. More sea time, applied and received unlimted 2nds and 1600t master/oceans. Never had to test for celestial until my upgrade to chief in 2008(?)
So, like I said this was a while ago but it worked for me then
[QUOTE=Jeffrox;86749]Sounds like another good loophole. (loop hole?)[/QUOTE]
It looks like this happened to 2008 when NMC was trying to get their proverbial s*** together. At that point many of the evaluators did not know the difference between a Celestial, a Celestrial and keystone screwdriver. Now for better or worse they are on the same page so I am not sure the classes are allowed
for the upper level licenses.
I just got my 3rd mate from 1600 master of oceans. I was told that my class celestial cert from my master ticket was not good enough for my 3rd and would have to do my celestial test at the REC. Not sure how it works going from mate to mate. Best of luck
An even better way to go about getting started on his Mates is to go from AB to 3rd Mate. Mate will be limited to 2000GRT and 4000ITC. After 360 days he can upgrade to 2nd mate 2000GRT and 4000ITC and take a limited exam for 1600 master at the same time. It is way less testing and much faster to upgrade this way. He will also benefit with the larger tonnage and If he gets any time on a OSV larger than 3000ITC or has previous sea time as an AB on OSV larger than 3000ITC he will have no tonnage restriction. Look at policy letter 11-12 on the NMC Website for more info.
They only currently put grt tonnage on a limited unlimited license. They will calculate the restriction based on your vessel so if you are in a 2,990 gt supply boat you will have a 5,000 grt restriction.
Far as Celestrail I’ve heard you could sail on the class certificate for one year then it is void. You will have to go into the REC and test to add it to your Lic. Not for sure how true that is though. Pretty sure it was the instructor at school that told me that.
Far as Celestrail I’ve heard you could sail on the class certificate for one year then it is void. You will have to go into the REC and test to add it to your Lic. Not for sure how true that is though. Pretty sure it was the instructor at school that told me that.[/QUOTE]
Are you saying you don’t need to add the oceans route to your license, you can just carry the navigationcourse certificate? If so, that’s total nonsense. You can’t sail oceans without the appropriate license endorsed for oceans. The only thing in this approaching accuracy is the one year limit. You have to add the oceans route to your license within one year of taking the course or it won’t be accepted.
That is not what the policy letter says. Also, there are members of this forum that have recently had their licenses endorsed with both GRT and ITC. I am working with an AB who was told NMC will not endorse for both. He is appealing what his evaluator told him in light of that.
Yea, they told me both also. However, in my case I only got GRT no ITC.
Mr Cavo- maybe you should read again what I posted. It hasn’t been edited and what is different then what you posted?
Maybe the Instructor told me wrong. Are you saying if I take the 2 week course I never have to go to the REC to test for it?
Just pass the course and send in the certificate and they add that to my Lic?
Or are you saying even though I have the certificate and have sent it in to update my MMC I still can’t sail until the new MMC comes in?
[QUOTE=AB Murph;88113]Yea, they told me both also. However, in my case I only got GRT no ITC.
Mr Cavo- maybe you should read again what I posted. It hasn’t been edited and what is different then what you posted?[/QUOTE]
You said “sail on the class certificate” which sounds to me like you are saying don’t need to add “oceans” to your license, you can just just carry the course certificate with you. This would be the same as a mate or master 500 or more carrying a completed TOAR and service letters instead of adding mate/master of towing vessels to their license, or carerying a radar course certificate to show you are current on your radar observer endorsement. This doesn’t apply to a celstaial course for adding an oceans route. Your license has to say “oceans” to be valid on oceans. Having a near coastal celicense and a course certificate qwon’t work.
If the above isn’t what you meant, you might have said something like “your course certificate is only valid for a year and you have to apply for the oceans route within that year.”
I know that isn’t what the policy letter says but it is what they do. I know people who have it and I know what I was approved for and there is no ITC tonnage on any of them.
I have this license and it says 3 rd mate of 2000 GRT no ITC. I asked the higher ups at the NMC and they informed me of the policy letter 11-07. This was when it first came out. I asked about ITC and why they don’t put it on the license since most boats, if not all built in the last 8 or so years only have an ITC tonnage. She said they don’t put ITC tonnage on licenses with tonnage limitations. Whoever said that they are getting ITC tonnage on their 3rd mates license is full of it. I would be surprised if they changed the way they do things for just one person. They have guidelines just like any other government agency and they don’t change their rules because someone thinks they are special. So if you have a 2000grt it is equivalent to 4000 ITC just keep the policy letter handy as your proof to the people that don’t understand about this topic. That policy letter basically is your ITC tonnage sticker that you want.
The guy who said he’s getting ITC tonnage on his MMC must be the same guy that said he’s getting sticker for his ECDIS on another thread. Both full of it.