[QUOTE=seadog6608;120105]Given the two choices you give, I would have to go with MSC. And if you do go with MSC, do not join SIU. It is not required and they have to represent you anyway. Basically as a government employee they can’t do anything for you should a beef arise anyhow. I spent 17 years at MSC ( More Shit Coming). And it sucked. Long hitches with short vacations. There was also the Navy inspired nonsense which is never ending. That said, the benefits can’t be beat. Cheap insurance, the TSP and the pension are all better than what you would get at SIU (Scabs Is US)[/QUOTE]
What’s TSP, and why would you stay with MSC if it’s so bad? Do they pay very well? Do you work 12 or 8 hour days?
All workdays are 8 hour. Anything over that is OT. Weekends are also OT. Thrift Savings Plan is the government version of a 401K. MSC can be a very annoying place to work. Late reliefs and some serious low lifes working there. Some people have figured out that they don’t have to do anything except show up, pass the piss tests and don’t get caught stealing and they’ll have a job for life. On the other hand, some of the best sailors I have ever learned from also work there. Some ships sit in port 90% of the time and a lot of the crewmembers move to that port and commute to work everyday. I did that for three years in Cape Canaveral, FL. Sure, I worked just about everyday, but I was also sleeping in my own bed every night.
[QUOTE=MariaW;120139]I’ve seen references to this before on this board, can someone please explain to me why this is? What’s the point of the union then, if the wages are lower? Please, no hyperbole or sarcasm, I’m looking for a sober answer.
Also, why is there no union in the Gulf?[/QUOTE]
Union wages are, on average, higher then non-union, everything else being equal. However everything else is not equal. An important and fundamental factor in determining wage levels is supply and demand.
In the case of the GOM the oil and gas sector is booming right now which increases the demand for workers. There is no equivalent increase in demand in the other sectors of the maritime industry so wages are more or less stagnant.
If boat days rates are high, companies can afford to offer higher wages to lure mariners from other sectors.
As far as unions in the GOM, unions are politically very unpopular among business interests in the South. VW has requested the UAW represent workers in its Tennessee plant and it isgiving politicians there conniption fits.
Yes, and since there are no union offshore vessels there is no comparison to union/non union pay; a point folks aren’t factoring in when they read your points!
Union ship vs non union=union makes more (almost always)
Union tug vs non union=union makes more (almost always)
Union osv vs non union osv=no such thing? But correct me if there are union mud boats.
[QUOTE=Kennebec Captain;120124]I think the 1% is a motto, not meant to be taken literally, it’s short hand for the plutocracy.
AIG executives made good money taking bets they couldn’t cover. When the economy went sour they got a $180 Billion dollar bailout from the taxpayers… AIG then paid out a $165 million dollars in bonuses to its executives.
This is not capitalism in any form the Adam Smith (who supported collective bargaining in his [I]Wealth of Nations[/I]) would have recognized. I do mind having my wages taxed to provide insurance to cover the bets of the very wealthy and I do feel the $14 Trillion dollar lost to the economy caused by the poorly regulated financial industry.[/QUOTE]
i don’t like that any more than being taxed to help all the boobs save their houses ( which they never should have bought) through things like loan modification, etc.
i’ve never missed a single payment, but nobody is giving me free money. if i had purposefully missed payments, then i probably could have had my loan modified… but i feel a lot better about just standing by my word and my signature on the closing paperwork.
at LEAST $50 billion was set aside for that program that you and I paid for. hundreds of thousands, if not millions of those underwater homeowners clearly didn’t get bonuses at the end of the year, but they certainly did take a gamble on the mortgage money that they couldn’t realistically cover if anything went sour.
you and i are also being taxed to cover those bets.
[QUOTE=c.captain;120184]You are most certainly correct sir…there ain’t no such animal in the USA. In the North Sea and Brazil on the other hand…their all union![/QUOTE]
In the '70s and early '80s IBU had contracts with some old Tidex boats out of Port Hueneme. They were operated by Jackson Marine. Some of the boats in the Cook Inlet were IBU. Crowley tugs in the Gulf are SIU.
[QUOTE=MariaW;120139]I’ve seen references to this before on this board, can someone please explain to me why this is? What’s the point of the union then, if the wages are lower? Please, no hyperbole or sarcasm, I’m looking for a sober answer.
Also, why is there no union in the Gulf?[/QUOTE]
most, but not all union wages are lower b/c deep sea shipping and and other operations that have nothing to do with drilling industry are not seeing new frontiers of opportunity. and the competition on a global front is much more competitive than just being able to drill in certain places where there is oil/ng and it’s not too deep to do so.
OSV types having to be jones act vessels in the GOM also has a lot to do with it, as well as newer rules either created by IRS or finally being enforced meant a fair bit of foreign officers had to say bye-bye in starting in late 2008 through 2009. if the MODUS and drill ships drilling (which are essentially all FOC) didn’t have to be US crewed (pretty much all personnel) you can bet those companies would find a way to bring in much cheaper, but competent labor for everything from drillers to mates to engineers. that would ultimately affect all wages.
the wages in GOM (and the # of vessels) in general have shot up over last 5-7 yrs, but there is no guarantee they will stay that way. as far as i know, no one has a contract guaranteeing wages. if oil $ per bbl plummets and drill ships go offline / platforms deactivated, then so will OSVs, crewboats accordingly. you will lose your job for long as it takes for that company or that part of economy to recover.
they don’t have to go bankrupt to lay off people, stop paying pension contributions, stop paying for training, etc., and nothing stops them from shuffling personnel around as they see fit. those are contractual protections you won’t see in GOM.
that’s not how MMP and MEBA work.
i’m not saying one is better than the other, just pointing out major differences.
[QUOTE=z-drive;120174]Yes, and since there are no union offshore vessels there is no comparison to union/non union pay; a point folks aren’t factoring in when they read your points!
Union ship vs non union=union makes more (almost always)
Union tug vs non union=union makes more (almost always)
Union osv vs non union osv=no such thing? But correct me if there are union mud boats.[/QUOTE]
the gap between OSV and Ship as far unlimited tonnage / HP is narrowing very quickly. and with the huge wage increases seen over recent years, i’ll bet the average wage on the large OSV (across all mates and captains) is at least equal to if not better than average wage across all LDOs at say AMO.