There is a lot of variation. Trips to Southeast are very predictable.
Crowley in Valdez has a set even time schedule. Trips to Dutch Harbor are longer and a lot less predictable. A trip to Barrow will take months. This is the nature of going on a long voyage.
There are companies that want people to get on in Seattle and work straight through for six months and not get off until the boat gets back to Seattle in the fall. These companies are are just too cheap, too silly, or both.
Lots of people are complaining now that they are working too much because there is a shortage of people to relieve them. Part of this is old timers retiring. Part of it is tougher physicals at some companies screening too many guys out. Part of it is guys that have left for more money and more consistent rotations in the Gulf.
West Coast pay is now at least $100 to $200 a day lower than it should be. The number of companies paying door to door travel has increased to attract more people from the East Coast. West Coast companies are advertising on gcaptain and hiring distant recruiting firms. That was unheard of a couple years ago. It’s time for a healthy West Coast pay increase.
rshrew- Year 'round, or just the summer season? Is dunlap still towing for Northland in SE, or has Western pretty much taken that over and Dunlap is just going out west now?
Not sure I’m guessing seasonal on the polar wind. So april-oct but not 100% on that. Dunlap is towing for northland out west only and Hawaii. Western is doing all of SE AK now on aml barges
[QUOTE=rshrew;132926]very true seems to be a revolving door people in & out a various places lately[/QUOTE]
When I was working on the West Coast it seemed like the middle/lower tier companies were a mix of regulars and mariners either working their way up to the upper tier companies or the ones working their way down. That and non-career folks looking for a temporary wage boost for various reasons.
[QUOTE=rshrew;132926]very true seems to be a revolving door people in & out a various places lately[/QUOTE]
Some companies are getting more competitive on a case by case basis. I see instances of guys giving notice that they are leaving for more money, and then getting better raises to stay.
People who would not return my calls a couple years ago are now inviting me out for lunch.
The tug and barge industry on the West Coast needs to catch up on wages.
[QUOTE=Bayrunner;132972]Thats the truth. Especially one of the 3 big reds.[/QUOTE]
Master of Towing with some experience and ability should be a lot more valuable than what the companies are now paying for it. The USCG no longer just hands this license out to anyone that has some other license and no towing experience.
The USCG, and the companies, now demand lots of extra training and certifications, but they are not paying extra money to get them.
I don’t understand how some of these companies can crew their boats at the wages they are paying.
I don’t understand why some of these companies would rather hire cheap guys who are always getting into trouble, rather than pay another $100 a day for guys that can actually do the job.
[QUOTE=tugsailor;133002]Master of Towing with some experience and ability should be a lot more valuable than what the companies are now paying for it. The USCG no longer just hands this license out to anyone that has some other license and no towing experience.
The USCG, and the companies, now demand lots of extra training and certifications, but they are not paying extra money to get them.
I don’t understand how some of these companies can crew their boats at the wages they are paying.
I don’t understand why some of these companies would rather hire cheap guys who are always getting into trouble, rather than pay another $100 a day for guys that can actually do the job.[/QUOTE]
The Companies in N.Y. Harbor are for the most part still working under the same mind set that started with the 1988 333 Strike. All they care about is a warm body to fill a spot. They proved that there will ALWAYS be someone that will work for a couple of $$$ less so why should they pay anyone more just to have them or keep them. Until everyone just plain refuses to work for these lower wages nothing will change and We all know that this will never happen!
Say what you will about Unions but at least back in the old 333, everyone (while sailing in the same position and class of vessel) made the same money and all of the Companies had the same crew costs, which leveled the playing ground.
Problem I see is they hesitate to get rid of the guys who are always getting into trouble, and even when they do someone else will hire them right up without checking into their past. Too many examples come to mind of people who should have been run out of the business for major fuckups. CG personally to blame for not pulling licenses. I’d be too embarrassed to show my face on a tugboat again if I was involved in some of those cases.
Look at what the grain terminals are able to pay those guys running boats for them on the Columbia river! No reason they can’t pay the rest of us that cash.
Like you tugsailor I hope the value will increase for us with a MOT. There is a big group I see retiring in the next 5 years that should in theory make it happen.
Because the job is still getting done. Let’s face it. All of the money that is being throw around is making everyone feel underpaid. Will tug wages increase around that? I have a hard time thinking they will. I think the one thing that the towing industry has working against is its failure to innovate. The GOM is building larger vessels requiring more certifications and training. Dp1 Dp2, 6000 ITC…etc. minimum now a days is 1600 ton.Other a TOAR, MOT or a master of towing, maybe a tankermen, what other certifications do we have that can make us better then the next guy? You can make a living with a 200 ton license. Some mates I work with don’t even have AB or their ticket. Other then pinned vessels (and that’s nothing new) what is in the horizon for the tug and barge industry? Moving LNG?
Not doing damage, taking out bridges, not having spills.
What will Subchapter M bring? If it requires licensed engineers they will have to bump engineer pay significantly. That should in turn increase pay throughout the licensed ranks.
[QUOTE=z-drive;133009]Not doing damage, taking out bridges, not having spills.
What will Subchapter M bring? If it requires licensed engineers they will have to bump engineer pay significantly. That should in turn increase pay throughout the licensed ranks.[/QUOTE]
Not that more regulation is generally a good thing, but in the case of the massive American tug fleet (one of our nation’s last remaining formidable maritime assets), I think that this new wave of regulations will effectively “cull the herd” or “prune the bushes” of much of the waste that is long over-due to be gotten rid of. I can only hope that subchapter-M will bring about the demise of some of the more pirate-like organizations who, for years, have gotten by with shooting from the hip and hoping for the best. As a new and different atmosphere descends on the industry as a whole, it is my expectation that our strongest sea-borne resource will become stronger and more emboldened to persevere, even in the face of the decline of American shipping.
[QUOTE=seadonkey;133007]Because the job is still getting done.[/QUOTE]
That’s it right there. Are they having trouble finding people to crew their boats? Are they losing good experienced people to the Gulf? Is the quality of West Coast tug crews declining? Is the number of incidents going up? I don’t know the answers to any of these questions, you guys tell me. But it seems like unless some of those things start to happen, the companies out here have little incentive to give us any more money. They’re sure not going to do it out of charity, or some sense of fairness.
some have ran south for bigger pay. I think the big issue is aging masters of tugs and a group of mates who have not had a lot of hands on operating experience. On the west coast the capts. Primarily do most of the boat handling and shared knowledge can be hard to obtain from the old school guys. You also have a change in the dynamics of vessels with atbs more prevalent there is always an assist at most docks. You don’t see many companies landing barges solo much, it’s a lost art. I have seen at some outfits that have upper houses the captains calling the shots from the wheelhouse and the mate is just a distance caller, not much learning happening there. There is a different era of young mariners it seems now. A lot of the younger guys don’t relate to some of the older ones who went to Alaska with loran and a shitty radar and NO CELL phone. Now you almost have phone and internet daily, computer chart plotting and ais it’s a changing world out there new tools but old knowledge have to meet in the middle. Finding the balance and working to train young mates and AB’s is important.
