USMMA and Coast Guard Professors Rated Worst in the Country [REPORT]

Maritime Academy USMMA
1

According to a report today by CBS Moneywatch, professors at the US Merchant Marine Academy are once again, rated worst in the country.

Here’s the bottom 25:

  1. U.S. Merchant Marine Academy (NY)
  2. Michigan Technological University
  3. U.S. Coast Guard Academy (CT)
  4. Milwaukee School of Engineering
  5. New Jersey Institute of Technology
  6. Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute (NY)
  7. Widener University (PA)
  8. St. Cloud University (MN)
  9. Bentley University (MA)
  10. Indiana State University
  11. Worcester Polytechnic Institute (MA)
  12. Central Michigan University
  13. Minnesota State University, Mankato
  14. Pace University (NY)
  15. Stevens Institute of Technology (NJ)
  16. Seton Hall University (NJ)
  17. Westminster College (PA)
  18. Howard University (DC)
  19. Iowa State University
  20. University of Toledo (OH)
  21. Truman State University (MO)
  22. Illinois State University
  23. University of Connecticut
  24. Oregon Institute of Technology
  25. University of Maryland
2

Will at least my Academy is first at something.

3

We finally found a category where USMMA ranks #1.
They only ranked #3 for the school with the most unhappy students.

Come on SUNY Maritime -

edit - Aww S-n-G, You beat me to the punch by 1 minute.

4

[QUOTE=Sweat-n-Grease;107705]Will at least my Academy is first at something.[/QUOTE]

Sorta like Mississippi and literacy. . . .

On a side note, go read the article and check out some of the comments. . . . .often times the comments are far better than the stories themselves. . .

5

This list is based upon the website ratemyprofessors.com so it’s real no big surprise KP would be at the top of the list. KP students hate their school while their and hate their professors. Not a surprise.

6

Not to dismiss the hatred of the KP educators but notice this list is very engineering and technology loaded. Could it be that the coursework is harder than your typical school? And less subjective as in liberal arts classes? Maritime curriculums are tough and if you can’t drink and fuck on your time off… Well, it makes guys outright cranky.

7

[QUOTE=leadline;107717]This list is based upon the website ratemyprofessors.com so it’s real no big surprise KP would be at the top of the list. KP students hate their school while their and hate their professors. Not a surprise.[/QUOTE]

Have things ever changed at KP since I was there (1958 - 1962). I never hated any instructor, although there were a few I thought were a tad over the top so to speak, and I can not recall any class mate being different in this regard. I well recall many instructors as excellent. Even though I was not a happy camper at KP I didn’t hate the Academy. I didn’t want to return to the Academy after my full sea year but I did and so I developed methods to deal with the situation. I bought a rag top chevy (not allowed back then) with money saved from my sea year, rented a garage off Steamboat Road, and was a Zombo (I thought the regimental system as being destructive, even stupid, I still feel this way). Here is a picture taken after Catholic Mass on the Sunday before graduation. I’m the Cadet on the left. Do I look angry? Hardly, I’m about to receive my License.
Oh. Maurice’s Tavern helped a lot. :smiley:

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/176/graduations.jpg

8

HA HA! Getting a FREE education and they bitch! AMAZING! Why don’t the midshippies all just run amuck and trash the place if they’re so effing miserable? EFFING PUNKS!

9

[QUOTE=Sweat-n-Grease;107728]Have things ever changed at KP since I was there (1958 - 1962). I never hated any instructor, although there were a few I thought were a tad over the top so to speak, and I can not recall any class mate being different in this regard. I well recall many instructors as excellent. Even though I was not a happy camper at KP I didn’t hate the Academy. I didn’t want to return to the Academy after my full sea year but I did and so I developed methods to deal with the situation. I bought a rag top chevy (not allowed back then) with money saved from my sea year, rented a garage off Steamboat Road, and was a Zombo (I thought the regimental system as being destructive, even stupid, I still feel this way). Here is a picture taken after Catholic Mass on the Sunday before graduation. I’m the Cadet on the left. Do I look angry? Hardly, I’m about to receive my License.
Oh. Maurice’s Tavern helped a lot. :smiley:

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/176/graduations.jpg[/QUOTE]

I would say most of that hatred comes from things lately going on at school, plus having the majority of your instructors not having been to see in 20 plus years.

10

Well, as they say, you get what you pay for, and it is the only “free” maritime academy

12

I would bet that the instructors at Kings Point are NOT the worst in the country, nor are they close to that distinction (they are government employees so it is possible, but I don’t think they are the root of this ignoble #1 ranking). You want to find out what stinks like an over-flowing latrine in the Louisiana summer?? Look no further than those little snot-nosed snobes that wrote those reviews.

Yeah, my money is on those precious free-loafing pretend-to-be future mariners who are getting a no-cost liberal business edcation on the taxpayers’ dime, and “surprisely” believe themselves to be divinely better than “any sucker who has to pay to go to college” or “any instructor who has to teach for a living”. These kids haven’t worked for what they have; they likely don’t know how to work for what they need; they focus their self-absorbed personalities on struting around campus and Steamboat Road like little gold-plated cock-a-doos; they have never had their butts paddled for their crappy conduct, insolence or arrogance; they can’t understand anything that is beyond their nose; and they don’t like it when instructors or staff hold them accountable for watever it is they are to be accountable for (say, honor, integrity, attitude, aptitude, studying, doing assignd tasks, et cetera).

So after they complete the class and chage diapers, they sit down and write some crappy comments on their instructors just to get back at these big bad people. Make all these USMMA students commit to 4 years of ACTIVE duty in the military after graduation, and I’ll bet all these tin-plated cock-a-doos (as well as most of the other business and pre-law Kings Pointers) will pack up their bags and bail out of there faster than a bag full of oiled marbles rolling off a frozen deck.

13

I cannot agree more than this is just sour grapes from unhappy students and how can any student be happy then they must exist in a system which is filled with hypocrisy and in a school which is obviously under a very poor leadership regime. In their misery and low morale they flail and professors make easy targets yet I do feel that KP does not itself attract the best and the brightest even though it is a federal job with the great benefits. It is always been that with regards to the maritime instructors, each and every one could be working in the industry at double or more than they make teaching so there must be a defacto defect with them and their abilities…those who can do, those who can’t teach is the saying I believe.

Yeah, my money is on those precious free-loafing pretend-to-be future mariners who are getting a no-cost liberal business education on the taxpayers’ dime, and “surprisely” believe themselves to be divinely better than “any sucker who has to pay to go to college” or “any instructor who has to teach for a living”. These kids haven’t worked for what they have; they likely don’t know how to work for what they need; they focus their self-absorbed personalities on struting around campus and Steamboat Road like little gold-plated cock-a-doos; they have never had their butts paddled for their crappy conduct, insolence or arrogance; they can’t understand anything that is beyond their nose; and they don’t like it when instructors or staff hold them accountable for whatever it is they are to be accountable for (say, honor, integrity, attitude, aptitude, studying, doing assignd tasks, et cetera).

I made basically the same observations earlier but in a blunt, profane and hamfisted manner which was not appreciated by the moderators so it was pulled. I will add thought that the whole “we are the best” mindset with KP’ers is force fed and brainwashed into the newbs there from day one. How can the school justify itself if it does not pretend and delude themselves that they are the best even though there is no definitive evidence to prove that? It further helps retain miserable midshipmen in that it gives them an incentive to endure the nonsense believing that there will be a gold plated award waiting for them when they graduate and enter the industry which except for where the alums have their little closed societies in broker houses and such, does not exist…especially with regards to going to sea.

So after they complete the class and chage diapers, they sit down and write some crappy comments on their instructors just to get back at these big bad people. Make all these USMMA students commit to 4 years of ACTIVE duty in the military after graduation, and I’ll bet all these tin-plated cock-a-doos (as well as most of the other business and pre-law Kings Pointers) will pack up their bags and bail out of there faster than a bag full of oiled marbles rolling off a frozen deck.

I am with you 100% with regards that if KP is to remain open that all grads do active duty after graduation to pay back at least some of the cost of their educations. Some will become career military officers which gets back most of the education cost and the remainder will have at least done something to pay the nation back for the taxpayer paying so much for the free ride. If a prospective midshipman doesn’t like that and wants to bail out then fine and if it holds back others from entering KP then also fine. The free education NEEDS to be APPRECIATED by the grads and what better way that to serve their nation as form of thanks. When they leave the service, they can go on to become brokers and lawyers and power plant operators.

I will close by saying that I find it extremely illuminating that there are no current midshipmen on this forum out in the open making noise about the school. It certainly cannot be because every student there is just so gosh darned sooper dooper happily happy that they simply love everything about the place and those who run it. I must believe the Administration has muzzled the students there from speaking openly in this forum which is rather akin to the Chinese Communist Party stifling all public dissent on the internet. A rotten system such as a KP must never be allowed to be outed from within so it is only us living on the outside of that totalitarian country that can speak for those existing inside the closed borders. I would think a clever young person could find ways to circumvent the system and post the truth here from within the walls of “the Village” but they must be so damned scared of retributions that even those who can don’t dare try (perhaps the threatened punishment is to be meted out upon the entire school if any single voice of dissent is raised from within?) Of course, many there I am sure two fist the Kool-Aid served to them in the messhall and as much as the highly distinguished Uniblab says that my endless barbs against the Academy as widely read there, I can only hope that there are more than a few cadets at KP who laugh in agreement with my posts even if they don’t jump to join the chorus here in the forum (although I would be thrilled if we heard from some disaffected KP cadets writing incognito).

Like anywhere with a strong authoritarian system of management control, there are always free thinkers who see all and know all even if they can’t speak all, but that’s ok however, because speaking loudly and openly is my job…

.

14

c.captain and tunatom

Just a side note but making those guys go active duty forces us as tax payers to pay and carry them for another 4 years. I’m not about having 200 plus kids go active duty so my tax dollars can pay their salary.
To be honest I’d rather see them sail as much as possible so as to put them in a higher tax bracket so they pay more in federal taxes this really paying back the money they owe and hopefully lowering my tax burden.

15

[QUOTE=leadline;107851]c.captain and tunatom

Just a side note but making those guys go active duty forces us as tax payers to pay and carry them for another 4 years. I’m not about having 200 plus kids go active duty so my tax dollars can pay their salary.
To be honest I’d rather see them sail as much as possible so as to put them in a higher tax bracket so they pay more in federal taxes this really paying back the money they owe and hopefully lowering my tax burden.[/QUOTE]

That’s all fine and good if there are those high paying seagoing jobs for all the graduates but there aren’t. That is the whole fallacy behind KP. It was created at a time when there were sailing jobs begging to be filled and thus the need for such a training institution clearly existed. Once WWII ended, the school should have closed or become tuition based and privately run or at least turned over to the State to run but they already had Fort Schuyler. Just like all the other USMS managed training facilities closed shortly after WWII so should have KP but the cold war rationale that there someday might need to be a WWII scale sealift to fight the Soviets in Europe kept the funding going. Once the Soviet Union collapsed, then so should have KP closed which is what Al Gore advised happen (for as much as he is pilloried by us, there he was spot on!)

16

This is strange. Most of these schools are in the Northeast, with a few exceptions.

And the data is compiled from “RateMyProfessor?” That can’t be very objective.

17

That was some impressive writing gentlemen! Telling it exactly like you feel. Rant worthy topic.

After a little reflection, I humbly submit that as much as I would like to say otherwise, I’ve had some KP cadets the past few years that were awesome guys. Really were. Good teenagers. The kind you would hope your own son would be like. Maybe I got lucky. If the high schools of America were producing more of these type kids the country would be better off.

Sure most of them have fallen into KP as a free ride with the nuisance of having to get a Merchant Marine based education as part of the deal, hell, for me to pay for SUNY I pumped gas and cleaned restrooms all summers. It’s not their fault they were rejected from the Air Force Academy. That’s tough to get into.

The Academy should either close or morph into something else that still satisfy the legal requirements to keep the property. And it should charge tuition. Nothing settles motivation more than money. Charge a reasonable contributive tuition of about $10,000 per year to clarify each students motivation. It would still be a killer deal.

A SUNY take over of Kings Point would be sweet too. Merge the two campuses. Have students compete for the scholarship monies from the Feds. Expand the non-regimental curriculums, cadets could take classes at both locations. Open a nursing or teaching school to get more women to come make up alongside these mid ship men…

I’m having fun.

18

[QUOTE=Starboard Ten;107872]That was some impressive writing gentlemen! Telling it exactly like you feel. Rant worthy topic.

After a little reflection, I humbly submit that as much as I would like to say otherwise, I’ve had some KP cadets the past few years that were awesome guys. Really were. Good teenagers. The kind you would hope your own son would be like. Maybe I got lucky. If the high schools of America were producing more of these type kids the country would be better off.

Sure most of them have fallen into KP as a free ride with the nuisance of having to get a Merchant Marine based education as part of the deal, hell, for me to pay for SUNY I pumped gas and cleaned restrooms all summers. It’s not their fault they were rejected from the Air Force Academy. That’s tough to get into.

The Academy should either close or morph into something else that still satisfy the legal requirements to keep the property. And it should charge tuition. Nothing settles motivation more than money. Charge a reasonable contributive tuition of about $10,000 per year to clarify each students motivation. It would still be a killer deal.

A SUNY take over of Kings Point would be sweet too. Merge the two campuses. Have students compete for the scholarship monies from the Feds. Expand the non-regimental curriculums, cadets could take classes at both locations. Open a nursing or teaching school to get more women to come make up alongside these mid ship men…

I’m having fun.[/QUOTE]

Excellent post, Starboard Ten, I have posted similar thoughts on different threads before you joined us. I am very pleased you post your thoughts.
I have worked with graduates from the State Academies and by and large they were not only dam good on the job but were great shipmates to boot. That’s important for me. Few knew I am a Kings Pointer, when they found out most responded "no way."
I heard about the financial situation they were in compared to the free ride Kings Point grants.
I was not pleased about this. It’s past time to correct this unfair situation.

19

US News and World Report has done a pretty good job over the years of ranking colleges and universities.
One thing they do before ranking is to classify and segregate the schools by size and the type of programs they offer and so KP is classified as a “regional college” for this purpose.

They do pretty well for a north area regional college. http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/regional-colleges-north
US News explains the methodology here: http://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/2012/09/11/how-us-news-calculates-its-best-colleges-rankings

I didn’t read far into the original linked article because I stopped when I read that they drew some of their data from “Rate My Professor.” That’s because it’s a forum where anyone can comment, from a 10 year old kid to a disgruntled ex-spouse. How do they control for that sort of thing?

I know the topic was about faculty (and not the other factors that go into a US News ranking) but people read that stuff and make big, life-changing decisions based on that info. Perception is a big deal.

20

[QUOTE=Starboard Ten;107721]Not to dismiss the hatred of the KP educators but notice this list is very engineering and technology loaded. Could it be that the coursework is harder than your typical school? And less subjective as in liberal arts classes? Maritime curriculums are tough and if you can’t drink and fuck on your time off… Well, it makes guys outright cranky.[/QUOTE]

Pretty much what I was thinking.

As an engine major at KP I hated class simply because it was so hard. There were plenty of great professors there, and some awful ones as well…neither made a difference in how much I hated going to class, and how much life on academy grounds sucked as well.

I honestly don’t understand the HUGE generalization about ALL KPers feeling like they are better than everyone else. I am a recent grad (2011) and can say that yes, there were plenty of KP “reg cocks” that walked around with their fake Navy insignia and ribbons acting like their shit didn’t stink, but in no way was it the majority.

Most of my fellow midshipman were just like me. They didn’t take the “regiment” too seriously because they knew it was mainly bullshit, they simply put up with it. They were there for two main reasons, they wanted to sail as officers when they graduated, and they didn’t have enough money to afford tuition at the countless number of overpriced colleges. I personally didn’t choose KP, my financial situation did. I had been accepted to a couple very prestigious schools, including one Ivy League school, mainly because of Wrestling, however even with the athletic scholarships I would have been overcome with student loans upon graduation. So I chose KP, because they wanted me for wrestling, and I would easily be able to afford the small amount it cost to go there. Is it my fault that KP, and the gov’t, offer myself and all the other midshipmen a cheap yet very useful education?

You all have your right to an opinion on whether or not USMMA is a waste of money. I am not disputing that there is plenty that needs to be fixed at the Academy, I was there when we were changing superintendents like pairs of sneakers, and I can say that MARAD got rid of two very well liked Superintendents that the regiment did not want to see go, and the high ranking “officers” in charge of the student body are a bunch of idiots on constant powertrips. However I have no idea how the dispute on the funding of the academy and its cost of tuition, or how the academy is poorly run, directly translates to ALL Kings Pointers being spoiled brats that think everything should be handed to them and being the worst mariners. Neither I nor most of my fellow midshipmen had that type of attitude, and I have yet to get any complaints from my C/E on my vessel on the quality of my work or my work ethic itself. I am currently working with graduates from Maine, Mass, and Cal maritime, and I can say that just like my fellow midshipmen from KP, some of them are fabulous mariners, and some of them are not. The academy you went to doesn’t designate what type of mariner you are, your work ethic, knowledge, and willingness to learn do.

21

Great post KPGulfer.

I go to a state academy and have no ill will against any of the other maritime schools. Perhaps I have a twinge of resentment that I will graduate with student debt - but I don’t blame the KP midshipmen for that.

I would have loved to have gone to KP for free - but alas, there’s an old, insignificant, hickup in my medical profile that would have barred entrance.

It is what it is.