200 mate NC upgrade to 500 mate NC would that be a full exam or limited just checking for a mate that wants to upgrade
I personally am a firm believer that if someone can’t look this up in the CFR’s, or call the NMC on their own, they shouldn’t have a higher level license.
Why bother to say anything dumb a**
Oh come on @Traitor_Yankee… be nice, they still allow oral exams for lower level licenses.
full exam. the only way to get a limited exam is if the person with the 200 grt mate has a mate of tow. i’m sure if I am wrong someone will correct me…
now here is why you didn’t get a straight answer. most of us who answer are providing insight from our own upgrades, own experience. it is by no means definitive. what is definitive is what the cfrs say. the information is out there and easily attainable, and a huge part of our regulatory knowledge comes from there…hence traitor yankee’s comment.
although our professionalism has been challenged recently, I will say in my opinion, if one is going to make a career in this business it says a lot of someone’s gumption if they can’t do five minutes of internet searching or just go to the nmc’s website to find an answer like this.
Go to the NMC website for information? That’s a good one.
. [quote=“LakeMaster, post:3, topic:45669, full:true”]
Why bother to say anything dumb a**
Blow me, that is if you and your friend can stop being so lazy. The information is easily available and it’s a big part of the job of a mate or master to ensure things on your vessel comply with the CFRs. So open them for fuck sake.
Because, as Traitor Yankee said, it’s expected that a mate can use the CFRs on their own as part of the job. Hell, there’s a whole exam on looking things up in the CFR.
If you’re incapable of looking it up yourself you probably shouldn’t have a license and if your too lazy to at least make an attempt before asking no one here wants to fucking help you.
I’ve never seen anything that would indicate otherwise and I had to take the full exam when I did the same upgrade.
Every upgrade that I did was a full exam, from my initial license up to my current license, The only license that was a "Give me"was an OSV license, other then that, it was testing and sea time.
One of the things I am going to recommend for exams is being a little more conversant with CFR’s, Federal Register, different committees and such. As important as how to calculate the distance of Line of Sight lost when you have something long and tall on deck, knowing how to improve the processes is important.
I copyrighted B.L.O.W.M.E. That will be a quarter to our licensing improvement fund.
all the checklists are there and a link to the deck and engineering exam guides.
If your buddy really needs the help, maybe one of the folks who are mentioned in this thread will help him. See? I’m not a total “dirt bag.” But personally, I still say it’s on the NMC website and in the CFR’s what he needs to do in black and white for him to read up on himself.
Alright I’ll start by getting this out of the way up front; you guys that can get answers you’re confident aren’t contradicted by another paragraph that may be more applicable are truly smarter than me. In that regard at least. I’m not being a smart ass I mean that. Now all that said I gotta tell you I couldnt make heads or tails out of that freakin matrix when researching how to add Oceans. I could only find 3 or 4 of the 10 I tried to find during my exam. And…I had some cool tools from Captain Bruce on how to find stuff.
But…forget me I’m a rookie Mate. When I sailed in the GOM I sailed with alot of very experienced (and competent) mariners and very sharp. With the exception of one (possibly) NONE of them had a clue about navigating the CFR’s. I sail Deep Sea and the Chief Mates and Masters know all they need to get through every kind of USCG/ABS inspection but…I’ve never heard the phrase CFR uttered on a ship nor have I ever heard of anyone using them.
This is not a stance that, that is OK. I’m simply calling it as I see it.
And yeah the guy shoulda picked up the phone to NMC. Gotten the policy letter or reference, then read it, then called back as you usually get different answers if you call more than once.
well we aren’t trying to figure out how many b 3 extinguishers are required in the engine room on a 249 gross ton 3000 hp research vessel.we were talking about a license upgrade, which in theory should not be that hard to figure out. this isn"t 20 years ago either before the internet became what we have now.
i get your point though. there can easily be a few different interpretations when looking up this stuff in the cfrs.
I still stand by the fact that at least attempting to navigate the cfrs is an integral part of this business. i started with a 100 ton license 18 years ago and I had to learn it then. obviously i have become more proficient over the years with upgrades and coast guard inspections, and i can still easily get lost and flounder.
there is nothing wrong with asking for help, but I try to help myself first.
All of us can, but we try first. Geez, don’t ask how many times I’ve been looking at the wrong section for vessel requirements and start reading something off when the office can’t look it up either and then go “oh shit… hang on, we’re not a passenger vessel.” But still, the licensing regs are pretty straight forward. I’d bet that 90% of the problems are usually that the CFRs don’t say what the person really wants them to say. Especially when it comes to testing and “lateral upgrades.”
i couldn’t have said it any better. a lot of the problem lies with people not accepting that the requirements are harder than they thought, or their previous sea time should give them some kind of pass.
I’ll second that. Industry is becoming too regulated and complex to ignore reading and having the skill set to look up regulation. Assume nothing… question everything.
I enjoy hearing opinions and perspective, but always do my research. I’d recommend this to the OP.
The point I and others have made is that he didn’t even try first for himself, then ask us to be sure he was right. He just thought “fuck it, I’m lazy, I’ll ask these guys to tell me the answer.”