STCW Manilla Amendments and ECDIS

Does anyone know how a US mariner is supposed to be able to comply with the latest STCW amendments RE: SHIP SPECIFIC ECDIS TRAINING? For example, how is one to know what exact type of ECDIS system you will have onboard your next vessel? If you don;t know, how can you get trained beforehand? How many ECDIS classes will we have to attend and pay for??? Is there just ONE class somewhere that trains you on ALL available types of ECDIS or do you just have to hope you go to a class that has say a TRANSAS and you are lucky enough to get one of those exact machines on your next ship??? If not, you are breaking the law, right? I was told that the USA has not made this STCW requirement the law yet so we are not breaking the law in the USA on a US flagged ship but…

OK, next question. Since there are no USCG approved schools for this yet in the USA, at least not since the last time I checked with the USCG or the schools, what happens when we get a job offer on a foreign ship that has an ECDIS onboard? Now, we are breaking the law again, right??? I suppose there are some foreign schools that have been approved to teach this class but the USCG will not accept any foreign training for a US mariner, so, we don;t have any classes approved yet in the USA and we can;t use foreign classes to satisfy our USCG, so, looks to me that means we will have to take a foreign class first and then another one here whenever they get around to approving one. IF we want to work on foreign flag ships (which seems to be what we have working in the GOM).

Is it possible someone can get the IMO to think about this just a tiny little bit before they pass these rules and MAYBE allow us to do this onboard like we always have before? How about when we get on the ship, we have someone show us how the specific type of ECDIS is different than the other ones we already trained on??? Is that really too much to ask, that they make the rules simple enough that we can actually follow it without a HUGE cost to us in time and money?

I took ECDIS at SUNY Maritime. Pretty sure it was an approved class. I know Quality Maritime has approval for their ECDIS class. I am sure there are other schools out there as well.

I was at BRM last week and the instructor mentioned that they were having difficulty even getting the course demands for the upcoming requirements from Imo concerning ECDIS standards, never mind how many of the different models were going o be required. So the short answer is wait. Even the accredited schools don’t know what is required yet.

It would be good to know if those mentioned classes are just classes or if they are actually approved to meet these new levels of STCW training. It would seem difficult.

[QUOTE=JP;76583]Does anyone know how a US mariner is supposed to be able to comply with the latest STCW amendments RE: SHIP SPECIFIC ECDIS TRAINING? For example, how is one to know what exact type of ECDIS system you will have onboard your next vessel? If you don;t know, how can you get trained beforehand? How many ECDIS classes will we have to attend and pay for??? Is there just ONE class somewhere that trains you on ALL available types of ECDIS or do you just have to hope you go to a class that has say a TRANSAS and you are lucky enough to get one of those exact machines on your next ship??? If not, you are breaking the law, right? I was told that the USA has not made this STCW requirement the law yet so we are not breaking the law in the USA on a US flagged ship but…
OK, next question. Since there are no USCG approved schools for this yet in the USA, at least not since the last time I checked with the USCG or the schools, what happens when we get a job offer on a foreign ship that has an ECDIS onboard? Now, we are breaking the law again, right??? I suppose there are some foreign schools that have been approved to teach this class but the USCG will not accept any foreign training for a US mariner, so, we don;t have any classes approved yet in the USA and we can;t use foreign classes to satisfy our USCG, so, looks to me that means we will have to take a foreign class first and then another one here whenever they get around to approving one. IF we want to work on foreign flag ships (which seems to be what we have working in the GOM)… [/QUOTE]
I’m not aware of any STCW requirement for ship specific ECDIS training, apart from the general (existing) requirement for shipboard familiarization training in all equipment the mariner will use (STCW Regulation I/14). The competency standards for deck officer endorsements include ECDIS, but there is no requirement for ship specific training. While the Coast Guard has proposed regulations requiring ECDIS and endorsement restrictions to vessels without ECDIS, we have not proposed endorsements for specific types or manufacturers of ECDIS equipment. The Coast Guard does not endorse or restrict ARPA to specific ships or manufacturers; the requirement for the specific equipment on any vessel is covered by the familiarization requirements noted above.

Whether another country will accept USCG approved training, or endorse an STCW certification issued by the U.S. is determined by the laws and policies of that country. You would need an STCW document issued by the flag of any vessel you serve on. As noted above, the U.S. requires the courses it approves to be substantially similar to the IMO model.
As specified in STCW (Chapter II) competency standards and the Coast Guard’s SNPRM, ECDIS would work like ARPA does now. If you do not have CG approved training, your STCW endorsement will have a restriction to vessels without ECDIS. The STCW requires, and the Coast Guard has proposed, that this ECDIS requirement/restriction take effect on 1/1/2017.

The Coast Guard currently requires approved ECDIS courses to follow or be substantially similar to the IMO model course for ECDIS. The model course was recently revised and I do not believe another revision is planned for the indefinite future. It is likely that the Coast Guard will continue to approve courses that follow the IMO model course. When the Coast Guard publishes its final rule implementing the 2010 STCW and this ECDIS provision, we will review all existing approved ECDIS courses and determine if they will be acceptable to meet the new ECDIS requirement (see discussion above about the IMO model course). Approvals of those courses will be revised as appropriate to indicate if they will meet the new requirement. I would not anticipate that a previously approved course would not be found acceptable for the new requirement if they were developed in substantial compliance with the IMO model.

[QUOTE=cappy208;76598]I was at BRM last week and the instructor mentioned that they were having difficulty even getting the course demands for the upcoming requirements from Imo concerning ECDIS standards…[/QUOTE]

They are hardly a mystery. The IMO has a model course for ECDIS.

There are currently approved courses for ECDIS even though no requirement for the tyraining yet exists. The courses were approved in anticipation of a future requirement.

That is true as far as existing approval. But the issue of what type you are trained on being relevant to the course machines seems to be the issue. There is a wide variety of ECDIS out there, with no industry standardization as yet. The OP pointed that out. What type is taught at these ‘approved’ courses? What is that fulfilling if there is more than one standard to meet? Imo hasn’t tackled the issue of uniformity (yet) so why are we jumping through hoops already?

[QUOTE=cappy208;76645]That is true as far as existing approval. But the issue of what type you are trained on being relevant to the course machines seems to be the issue. There is a wide variety of ECDIS out there, with no industry standardization as yet. The OP pointed that out. What type is taught at these ‘approved’ courses? What is that fulfilling if there is more than one standard to meet? Imo hasn’t tackled the issue of uniformity (yet) so why are we jumping through hoops already?[/QUOTE]

Simple version of my previous response:

The approved training for the STCW endorsement issued by the Coast Guard is generic, any equipment is appropriate for the course if it meets or realistically simulates the applicable performance requirements for ECDIS. The ship owner has the burden of ensuring you are familiar with the specific type of equipment on board. In other words, it’s exactly the same “problem” as has existed for over 15v years with ARPA courses, and even longer for with radar observer courses.

What are the USCG requirements to teach an approved ECDIS course?