Thinking of getting into tug/towing industry. What is actual defined term for 200 ton Master/mate of towing? What vessels can be run Inland/Nearcoastal or Oceans on this
license??
headdesk
Why do you ask about that license specifically? Speaking of, I don’t believe that license even exists currently…
Currently the only way to obtain a license as ‘Towing Master (or Mate)’ is to have either:
A master of ‘Over 200 GT’ and then obtaining a TOAR.
Or:
Testing for a 50, 100 or 200 GT master, and then testing for a MOTV ‘Master (Mate) of Towing Vessel’ then completing a year and a half apprecticeship upon a towing vessel and completing a TOAR.
You have to have a prior license to get a towing license. So you could figure out that having a Towing license would enable you to operate any power driven vessel (of the tonnage category you are licensed for) but a towing vessel license specifically does not exist on its own.
Any clearer?
a towing vessel license specifically does not exist on its own.
Sorry your wrong Cappy , I currently hold a MOTV N/C with no tonnage listed. In reality it’s good to 299 tons then the vessel becomes inspected and my license doe’s not apply.
I know a guy who recently got a mate of towing inland. That and master of towing restricted route are his only licenses.
Trying to get a straight answer is like pulling teeth. I have signed of three individuals over the past 4 years. Their progression was: first test for a 100 ton Master, 200 ton Mate, NC. With an ‘apprentice steersman’ endorsement. Then with 18 months seatime on Towing vessels and a Complete TOAR they got an endorsement as Mate of towing. Total seatime 4.5 years for all three guys. I have not heard about this MOTV Only license. I was under the impression this was weeded out to raise the standards. Even though Kirby recently successfully got the requirements weakened.
My license was originally a OUTV witch was changed to a MOTV. I have heard rumors of this license being eliminated but the CG keeps renewing it.
The OP was asking about an entry level person asking about current conditions of licensing. Not past grandfather clauses that confuse the issue.
I don’t know how he did it. Maybe it is possible to do the apprentice mate progression without ever getting a normal license.
In what way did kirby weaken the requirements?
[QUOTE=cappy208;76011]The OP was asking about an entry level person asking about current conditions of licensing. Not past grandfather clauses that confuse the issue.[/QUOTE]
I did not intend to go off topic. I was assuming probably incorrectly that if the CG is still renewing this license they would still issue it.
They still issue the motv, but usually you need to have an unrestricted license in order to get it.
Master, Towing exists on it’s own. The progression is AB, Apprentice Steersman, Mate, Towing, Master Towing. 4 years seatime from green to MTV.
The crossovers are 200 ton, and TOAR in several varieties
[QUOTE=Capt. Phoenix;76029]I don’t know how he did it. Maybe it is possible to do the apprentice mate progression without ever getting a normal license.
In what way did kirby weaken the requirements?[/QUOTE]
As usual, the archaic workings at NMC are hard to figure out. Knowing the USCode is the Law, but the Navics are the USCG interpretation is a bitch to get a straight answer from. This goes back about 10 to 12 years, when the whole OUTV license structure was changed to the MOTV system. They made the MOTV a harder exam. They made the ability for someone not in the towing industry to have to take an increased exam AND have tome on a towing vessel PRIOR to assuming command.
I mentioned Kirby because they were instrumental in tearing apart the structure that had been implemented. The towing license structure was ‘tightened up’ to make it not so easy to transfer laterally in the industry (eg. from yachts to tugs, from OSV to tugs, and deep sea to tugs). Industry trade groups WITH the USCG taskforce came up with the novel idea that experience upon other types of vessels was not enough to walk onto a tug and stand a watch (successfully) and that a certain amount of time was required to ‘learn’ the requisite knowledge to assume a watch on a towing vessel. The thought that ONE year would be a good starting point of learning for a new transfer into the industry.
[I]On a side note, I was thinking my Master of Towing Vessel endorsement was worth about a pound of Gold at this point. I thought,
'Hey, the wages HAVE to go up, since we will be getting scarcer now that there is a definite higher hurdle towards getting approved." Little did I know that the Industry would trump the shortage by deception. (Of course this is my opinion, but it seems to have wrung true over the years)[/I]
Almost NO companies in the ensuing 4 years until the new implementation date even started a training plan. Almost none of the companies were actively looking for Mates. They just sat back and waited for the law to come into place. There WAS a 4 year ramp up until implementation. The only Company that seemed to have an idea about how to have enough trained Mates to fill their needs was Vane Brothers. They hired around 20 or 30 EXTRA mates and trainees on a ‘just in case they are needed’ basis. That drove all the east coast companies UP in wages, and in desperation they all (except McAllister) lifted wages. The inland fleet (of which Kirby is the largest) did NOT lift wages. They just sat and waited. Then they cried to the USCG the new regulations were too diffcult to meet. Wah, Wah, Of course they were difficult to meet. Especially when they started reacting in the last couple months to the deadline. Then people come on there wondering if Kirby is a good place to work.
Then as the implementation date neared American Waterways Operators (Kirby being a HUGE vocal member) got several politicians involved, and explained their issues to some ‘knowledgeable’ politicians who sought relief from the USCG to relax these tough new laws. The USCG folded, and weakened the TOAR program to 30 days (thus the 30 day wonder moniker) and Kirby (amongst others) gloated at their ability to hire outside the industry and pencillwhip 30 day wonders into the wheelhouse. The AWO petition would not have gained traction IMHO without Kirbys being the bull in the china shop so to speak.
You asked, I was bored… watch out! 
[QUOTE=hawsepipe;75894]a towing vessel license specifically does not exist on its own… [/QUOTE]
It does. You can either qualify for it by having a license as mate/master for greater than 200 GRT, or by progressing through Apprentice Mate/Steersman.
[QUOTE=Capt. Phoenix;76054]They still issue the motv, but usually you need to have an unrestricted license in order to get it.[/QUOTE]
You can get a mate/master of toqwing vesselsd as yourt only license. I think the comment was referring to the old OUTV, which is no longer issued (not since 5/21/2001). However, holde4rs of it were eligible for grandfathering to master of towing vessels.