[QUOTE=Ocean31;132356]Okay, someone else explain the South LA (oilfield) concept of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Captain (mate) titles.
I would, but …[/QUOTE]
Ocean31 ! I can ans this!. I was a skeptic but now it make sense. Here from big honkin raise
[QUOTE=ZDriver;67747]This thread is hilarious and provides yet more evidence that antisocial personality types gravitate to the industry.
“Captain” is a purely informal term. On your COI it will list a required Bridge complement including one “Master” and some number of the various flavors of “Mate”. Everyone knows who’s who and what is what. In the GoM, informally, there are Captains and Mates. Captains are legally qualified to command the vessel, though not necessarily in the eyes of management. Mates are qualified to command a navigational watch and nothing else. When someone holds a Master’s license, they are generally referred to as Captain by the other officers and crew out of respect even if they are filling a Mate slot, particularly when they have a history of command.
Normally, the owner or manager will entrust the overall operation of the vessel to the lead Master. He is generally considered responsible for the operational and regulatory condition of the vessel. If he were to be absent during an important inspection, but that inspection went badly, it is quite possible that he could be demoted or fired depending on the outcome, unless the problems are somehow attributable to the actions of the Relief Master (as in, making poorly considered remarks to the inspector or failing to satisfy important requirements during his command). The Relief Captain, while legally culpable for the actions he takes or does not take while the vessel is under his command, is somewhat protected from overall responsibility for the vessel where management is concerned. If the vessel is in poor condition or things are in a disorganized state, the Relief Captain can safely point to the lead Captain, provided he has of course done his due diligence while he was in command. So it is possible that the Relief Captain can preside over an inspection that goes poorly, and be promoted as a result.
I think this system works pretty well all things considered, especially where the Relief Captain is more junior and has less familiarity with the process of inspection and general regulatory requirements. It gives the Relief a good opportunity to run Master with ‘training wheels’ so to speak. If you have two men working even time as Master, then obviously that burden shifts somewhat although one may be considered junior: the greater opportunity he is given to command the vessel necessarily increases the degree to which he is culpable for its condition. All of these are informal moral valuations that are left up to the discretion of management.
Such is life.[/QUOTE]
This was the last post, there is a more discussion upthread but this was a good summary
Here another good post.
[QUOTE=eesmith4;67601]From what I’ve seen, “3rd captain” is mostly used to differentiate between a guy who has the license and practical experience to run as master if needed, versus a “mate” who is someone with just a mate’s ticket and/or limited experience. There’s also usually a pay difference between “mate”, “training captain” and “3rd captain”. I mean really, what’s so hard to understand about it? it’s someone with a master’s ticket that is 3rd in line to be master onboard, so when the 1st or 2nd quits/leaves/is fired he usually moves up.
Yes, he’s running(legally) as a mate, but the title “mate” doesn’t fully encapsulate his ability and place in the greater scheme of things.
Why is this such a big deal with some?
ETA: let me clarify. Most usage of “3rd captain” I’ve seen is intra-company, so people know where someone stands. for example, if a master has to leave suddenly, and the other guy is a 3rd captain, then you know the master spot is covered so you only have to send a mate. If you cover everyone who isn’t the master under the “mate” title, then you have to check and see if you need to send a master or mate.
With outsiders, most folks I know use the master/mate paradigm to explain their position.[/QUOTE]
Extra points for use of the term “paradigm” in a mariners forum.
