Hey US Retailers, boo freakin hoo

Maritime News
1

Hanjin related troubles, http://www.wsj.com/articles/hyundai-ships-take-cargo-delayed-by-rival-hanjins-bankruptcy-protection-filing-1472747412

Hey Walmart, Target, etc, why don’t you book some cargo on a US flag ship? Or rather why haven’t you been?

Funny how federal regulations are to blame for everything under the sun according to some of these people (I’m looking at you Retail Leaders Industry Association) and now they have the gall to go to the Federal Maritime Commission and ask for their intervention in a commercial transaction. Ports and stevedores don’t want to be left hanging and not get paid for handling this cargo. So what do these retailers want? Another bailout? For a foreign flag carrier no less.

You probably paid rock bottom freight rate and now you are upset? How about deposit the money to cover the remaining costs yourselves. Yeah life’s tough like that sometimes.

Ehh I hope your containers full of GI Joes with the Kung Fu grip rot and get moldy and are too late for the holiday season.

2

[QUOTE=KPChief;189805]Hanjin related troubles, http://www.wsj.com/articles/hyundai-ships-take-cargo-delayed-by-rival-hanjins-bankruptcy-protection-filing-1472747412

Hey Walmart, Target, etc, why don’t you book some cargo on a US flag ship? Or rather why haven’t you been?

Funny how federal regulations are to blame for everything under the sun according to some of these people (I’m looking at you Retail Leaders Industry Association) and now they have the gall to go to the Federal Maritime Commission and ask for their intervention in a commercial transaction. Ports and stevedores don’t want to be left hanging and not get paid for handling this cargo. So what do these retailers want? Another bailout? For a foreign flag carrier no less.

You probably paid rock bottom freight rate and now you are upset? How about deposit the money to cover the remaining costs yourselves. Yeah life’s tough like that sometimes.

Ehh I hope your containers full of GI Joes with the Kung Fu grip rot and get moldy and are too late for the holiday season.[/QUOTE]

Maybe you can direct them to the US Shipping Companies that operate US flag Container ships able to carry their goods cheaply, safely and on time?

Not only Container ships by the way. What about US flagged ships to carry commodities to/from US ports. Where are they?

3

I work for a large NVOCC and broker and at the moment people are quite literally and figuratively losing their shit over Hanjin’s meltdown. It’ll be a bit before any kind of protection scheme can be worked out that will allow their ships to drop the hook or tie up anywhere respectable without being arrested or seized, but customers don’t apparently don’t want to hear that.

4

[QUOTE=RumRunner;189813]I work for a large NVOCC and broker and at the moment people are quite literally and figuratively losing their shit over Hanjin’s meltdown. It’ll be a bit before any kind of protection scheme can be worked out that will allow their ships to drop the hook or tie up anywhere respectable without being arrested or seized, but customers don’t apparently don’t want to hear that.[/QUOTE]

Where are their alliance partners in this? Presumably they have boxes on some of these ships too. Will they pony up to get them unloaded and put to sea? Then they could all go back to Korea and raft up without stiffing ports, vendors, seamen or taxpayers all over the world.

5

[QUOTE=ombugge;189808] Where are they?[/QUOTE]

Run out of business by the scumbags who pay mariners $2 an hour and pay politicians to bail their asses out when their houses of cards collapse.

Run out of business by scumbag lobbyists who buy politicians to provide welfare to American agribusiness conglomerates.

Kept out of business by insane “free trade” treaties that gut what little remains of American industrial capacity.

That is where they are. Just wait until Norway runs low on the oil money, you will see first hand how it works when your politicians are looking at cash on the table. They will sell your ass down the tube so quick you won’t even see it happen.

6

[QUOTE=Steamer;189834] Just wait until Norway runs low on the oil money, you will see first hand how it works when your politicians are looking at cash on the table. They will sell your ass down the tube so quick you won’t even see it happen.[/QUOTE]

Don’t hold your breath. How long would it take 5 million people (most of them old) to burn through 7 trillion NOK? If I had a Norwegian baby today, her great grandchildren wouldn’t have to worry about it.

7

[QUOTE=Emrobu;189837]… her great grandchildren wouldn’t have to worry about it.[/QUOTE]

I think that was a fairly common way of thinking in 1920s America.

8

[QUOTE=Steamer;189840]I think that was a fairly common way of thinking in 1920s America.[/QUOTE]

Between 1920 and 1930 in the US, the average woman had between 2 and 3 children. In Norway the average woman has had less than 2 children since about 1975. Any country with more than “2” is growing, any with less isn’t. Coupled with the fact that there wasn’t such a thing as a economic safety net in 1920s America, and you can probably see why comparing 1926 USA to 2016 Norway is a strange thing to do. If Americans had faith in their economy Providing prosperity for foreseeable generations in the 1920s it was everything to do with the (as yet) unbroken myth of American know-how, hard work, ingenuity, or the belief in the grace of God. It’s not because they had a the biggest per capita savings account in the history of the human race, like Norway does.

I don’t mean to embarrass the Norwegians. I know it’s common for them to feel weird about being so wealthy. Weird, yes… But even I have seen them feel guilty about it. Not because they’ve done something wrong, but only because they recognize that it isn’t fair to be born into wealth. And it’s out of (national) character for them to act like they deserve it. They aren’t hip-hop stars about it. Norwegians are so embarrassed about money, that watching them try to talk about money is contagiously embarrassing.

9

[QUOTE=Steamer;189834]Run out of business by the scumbags who pay mariners $2 an hour and pay politicians to bail their asses out when their houses of cards collapse.

Run out of business by scumbag lobbyists who buy politicians to provide welfare to American agribusiness conglomerates.

Kept out of business by insane “free trade” treaties that gut what little remains of American industrial capacity.

That is where they are. Just wait until Norway runs low on the oil money, you will see first hand how it works when your politicians are looking at cash on the table. They will sell your ass down the tube so quick you won’t even see it happen.[/QUOTE]

Don’t assume that things are the same everywhere. Politicians are not ALL corrupt and controlled by lobbyists everywhere. There are many countries where politicians are actually generally honest and try to do the right things for the population. In fact, I think you will find some even in the US if you are looking hard enough.

As for “free trade” and treaties of all kinds, it is a two way street. You cannot insist on free access to other markets if you build “walls” (virtual or physical) to protect your own market from competition.
Likewise, if you sign a treaty you have to stick to it, not suddenly change your mind if it doesn’t always suite you.

As for Norway running low on oil and thus money is not all that worrying. Norway was a relatively rich country before oil was found due to cheap hydro electric energy, from fishery and the world’s 3rd largest merchant fleet trading world wide. In terms of GDP per million it was ranked No. 8 in 1970: http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Economy/GDP-in-1970-per-million

Today Norway has a population of just over 5 Mill. and growing due to migration from other European countries, North Africa and the Middle East mainly, but also from North and South America and Asia.
With the largest sovereign fund in the world: http://gulfbusiness.com/worlds-10-biggest-sovereign-wealth-funds/
it is not likely that Norway will suffer too much from a total collapse of the oil market.

In fact Norway will still be doing fine in other sectors, even without being member of EU, or dependent of the largess of US aid.
The merchant fleet under Norwegian flag has shrunk, but the Norwegian owned and controlled fleet is still large and modern, as is the Offshore and Fishing fleet. Fisheries and Aquaculture is booming and Norway is still an energy rich country without oil & gas. (100% Hydro electricity)

I don’t think you should worry too much about the Norwegian political scene becoming something like the US, but appreciate your concern. I worry for you with the dysfunctional system that is being shown to the world and the potential of a shift towards even more isolationism.

10

The biggest problem for the US’ future is that the welfare slugs are being subsidized by the govt to birth crotch-fruit and vote while those who are the backbone of the workforce can’t afford to have children because of crushing taxes and the out of pocket costs of raising a family.

When Uncle Sugar provides from the womb to the tomb who needs to work?

11

The Norwegians are actually asking this question?

The actual fuck is this? Are they serious? Where are our container ships? Is this what they are asking us? Give me a break!

We (Americans) are being sodomized without benefit of lubricant here…and what is happening to us can (will) happen to you. (meaning the rest of the world)

For example, look no further than the UK and Australia and see how they have destroyed their merchant marine. Australians have been hauled off ships at gunpoint by their government at the behest of a business! Yes, that is happening! All to save money- and their politicians meekly comply like servants.

When there is a buck to be made, there will be no end to it. Nobody on this planet is immune to the workings of the greedy and powerful. You Norwegians will be on the chopping block if you don’t keep vigilant…and maybe even in spite of your vigilance.

Yes, we have the Jones Act, but the businesspeople wheedle and cajole and whine their way around it one way or another. They cry to the public and get their support. They get waivers, and every waiver is a chink in the wall; all walls eventually fall without maintenance.

I’ve never been more happy to be over 50, because it won’t be me shoved out of a job, not yet anyway, but it’ll be the fools who come after me who won’t do anything about it. Lord knows I tried but I am only one vote and one phone call. I pass the baton…if you are an American mariner and you don’t vote and write your members of Congress and make yourself heard, you have nobody to blame but yourselves.

12

[QUOTE=Bayrunner;189860]The biggest problem for the US’ future is that the welfare slugs are being subsidized by the govt to birth crotch-fruit and vote while those who are the backbone of the workforce can’t afford to have children because of crushing taxes and the out of pocket costs of raising a family.

When Uncle Sugar provides from the womb to the tomb who needs to work?[/QUOTE]

There is no “better” (or worse??) welfare state with “cradle to grave” benefits than Norway and the other Scandinavian countries, as well as Canada, NZ, Australia, UK and the rest of the North West European countries.
Do some people misuse the system? Yes, but not to the extent that you describe. (Or want to believe)

Then there is the question of Health Care costs vs quality. On the cost side the US is #1, but when it comes to quality it is #37.
The next thing is Health Care Insurance. Most if not all OECD countries has some sort of compulsory national health insurance: https://truecostblog.com/2009/08/09/countries-with-universal-healthcare-by-date/
with one noticeable exception; USA. Will this improve with time? Let us hope so for your sake.

The “Social Progress Index 2016” is ranking countries by more then just GDP: http://www.socialprogressimperative.org/global-index/
On this index Norway is ranked # 1: http://www.businessinsider.com/16-most-socially-advanced-countries-2015-4?op=1%3Fr=US&IR=T&IR=T#1-norway-16
United States is ranked #16: http://www.businessinsider.com/16-most-socially-advanced-countries-2015-4?r=US&IR=T&IR=T#16-the-united-states-1

There is a lot of complains on this forum about big (and not so big) industry buying influence in the US.
How does this tally with the rest of the world?
One important index is the Transparency Corruption Perception Index 2015: http://www.transparency.org/cpi2015/

On this index the US is ranked #16 (Up from #19 in 2012, so things are improving) while the Scandinavian countries all rank in the top 10. Canada is #9, while Singapore is #8 as the only Asian country in the top 10.

No this is NOT anti-American ranting by a Norwegian that is jealous of your success as the “largest economy” and “most technically advanced country in the world”, just publicly available facts.

14

[QUOTE=Bayrunner;189860]The biggest problem for the US’ future is that the welfare slugs are being subsidized by the govt to birth crotch-fruit and vote while those who are the backbone of the workforce can’t afford to have children because of crushing taxes and the out of pocket costs of raising a family.

When Uncle Sugar provides from the womb to the tomb who needs to work?[/QUOTE]

Weren’t you asking about a grant on another thread?

15

[QUOTE=Bayrunner;189860]The biggest problem for the US’ future is that the welfare slugs [/QUOTE]

Is gCaptain getting crosstalk from some right wing AM radio Goebbels wannabe? Sure sounds like the really tired old line fed to the people who are the most likely to get bent over.

17

[QUOTE=Bayrunner;189860]The biggest problem for the US’ future is that the welfare slugs are being subsidized by the govt to birth crotch-fruit and vote while those who are the backbone of the workforce can’t afford to have children because of crushing taxes and the out of pocket costs of raising a family.

When Uncle Sugar provides from the womb to the tomb who needs to work?[/QUOTE]

Don’t forget our unfunded wars that we are putting on a credit card.