CCS is growing the most in tonnage under class. DNV GL is falling, but still the leader of the pack:
A state owned classification society regulating state owned shipping companies. What could possibly go wrong?
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Classification Societies are not regulators. That is the job of the Maritime Authorities of the different flag states. (Refr. ABS vs. USCG)
You’re splitting hairs. The inherent conflict of interest is my point
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Whether they are regulating or just classifying it is still one big incestuous nest.
I wonder if this puts them in a place to be eligible to be recognized by the USCG.
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As a Class Society and member of ICAS they are certainly recognized by the USCG. If you are asking if they are eligible to be in the ACP the answer is no and probably won’t be in the foreseeable future. At the moment there are 4 that are eligible. I can’t see a US Flag ship owner entertaining the notion of being classed by CCS at this time.
I should add that BV and RINA are authorized to issue certain IMO certificates in agreement with the USCG.
I just wonder if anybody here have any first hand knowledge of, or have ever had any dealings with, CCS?
Or is there just an assumption that since they are a Chinese company they must be less competent, unbiased and independent than their US/Western counterparts?
I have had dealings with them, both in China and Singapore and found their Surveyors to be knowledgeable and cooperative.
I have also found them to be able to accept that they could have been wrong and correct a mistake. (Unlike certain other IACS Surveyors)
That is not correct. USCG does not recognize all IACS members. I’m not positive but I think it is only ABS, DNVGL, ClassNK, Lloyds and BV.
Ships classed by CCS is regularly calling at US ports and being inspected by PSC inspectors from USCG. That is different from doing inspection and issuing certificates on behalf of USCG, which is only the societies you mentioned. (ACP approved)
When will this confusion between Classification and regulatory functions end??
Isn’t this being taught as part of maritime education, at least at management level as required per STCW standard?
Classification:
www.iacs.org.uk/media/3784/iacs-class-key-role.pdf
Maritime Authorities:
Are you saying if a ship classed by CCS or any other member of ICAS called at a US port that the USCG would not recognize the IMO certificates issued by the class society as being valid? Unless shown otherwise, I don’t think so. That is not to say the USCG would not do an inspection under their authority as Port State Inspectors but that is a whole other issue.
Currently ABS, DNVGL (DNV and GL separately before their merger), Lloyds and ClassNK (NKK) are eligible to issue certificates under ACP. Both BV and RINA can issue certain certificates but not all.
Document pulled from the above link:https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Portals/9/DCO%20Documents/5p/5ps/Alternate%20Compliance%20Program/ClassSocietyAuths.pdf?ver=2017-10-18-091452-957
I have had dealings with CCS in Houston, good Team they have there. I like their separate Offshore Group as well.
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The bigger news is Liberia being #2! Glad to see a quality Flag beat out those MI marketers.
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I meant recognize as in a “Recognized Organization” under the CFRs. I’m not sure any PSC gets to not recognize statutory certificates as being valid as long as they are issued in accordance with the rules of the flag state. You may give that vessel more “attention” but you don’t get to say they are somehow invalid even if you wouldn’t do it that way.
The global maritime statutory scheme is sorely missing from maritime education.
USCG PSC annual report 2017 available under this link:
Interesting read.
On page 11 of this report: 2017 Recognized Organization Safety
Compliance Performance.
Note the document I linked in my previous post.
Thanks … By “recognize” I was after the six listed under “Authorizations”. The five I listed plus RINA. I thought I had seen them listed in the CFRs once before but could never find them again.
According to the USCG website, ABS, NKK, DnV, GL, LR and DnV-GL are in the ACP program. While BV and RINA are not in ACP, they are Authorized Class Societies. All are considered to be Recognized Organizations by the USCG. CCS is not.
Classification Societys need your money so they will do anything you ask.
Once you con some guy in some country that defect remains forever
They get their income from new builds, so the shorter the ship life the better for them.
here a book from real world experience
https://www.amazon.com/Tankship-Tromedy-Impending-Disasters-Tankers/dp/0977647900
It’s available free electronically from the author here (the first two links):
http://c4tx.org/ctx/pub/index.html
Also note the fourth link: “The Rise of the Paper Classification Society”
technology in the engine room and propulsion has left them in the dust.
Your boat gets classified but the technical companies are rewriting the software just before, during and after the sea trials. How is that classed?
I was on a boat a while ago and the thruster control system would take the thruster away from the DP system inside a minute if the DP didnt send a command to it.
To get it back you had to go out of DP
How did that pass class, very dangerous.
Not a one off either as its a major thruster player now