Another TOAR question

Observation and TOAR are two different things.

90 day “Observation” or familiarization must be completed onboard.

MITAGS in Seattle, USMRC in Newport, Maybe Northeast Maritime in New Bedford, and no doubt others offer one day TOAR simulator course assessments that result in a completed TOAR.

Diamond Marine Services offers a one day ocean, coastwise, and Inland TOAR on an antique single screw tug in the Hudson River.

No doubt there are many others.

A few years ago, I asked someone at Crowley in Seattle why they were sending some guys to TOAR courses, he said because it’s cheaper, faster, and easier to schedule than trying to do it on their own boats.

Frankly, I do not approve of these one day TOAR courses whether they are done on a simulator or on a tug.

TOAR has become nothing but an expensive time wasting , tick the box, stumbling block.

Observation in the wheelhouse with a master that provides instruction and allows stick time to practice would be very valuable.

However, a lot of guys seem to get their “observation time” sweeping and mopping and chipping and painting, which of course is worthless.

Who’s signing off on their TOAR? Hard to see how one can acheive competence if they are not in the wheelhouse.

Note that the TOAR is very different than STCW assessments. For STCW the assessor is witnessing a one time demonstration, they are not attesting to competence. The DE that signs a TOAR is certifying they have determined that the candidate is competent.

A lot of guys are getting their TOAR signed off at the one day courses.

I have chosen not to become a DE for two reasons:

  1. I do not want to run guys through TOAR for free. I expect to be paid for performing this extra duty. (Companies expect DEs to do TOARs for free).

  2. I do not want to be pressured to certify people that I don’t think are ready. (Companies want the TOARs pencil whipped for their fair haired boys to meet the unmet demand for low wage new mates).

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Obviously…but my response was in regards to the claim that…

As far as I am aware the route is given (Ocean, NC) is based on the route sailed during “training and observation” as it’s worded in 46 CFR.

Depends on the license held, if someone has 500t or greater, it’s 30 days.

A one day course in a simulator is nuts, but I do know there is at least a few that use old tugs (Diamond Marine for instance) to do the assessments, that’s a bit better but still not really what it should be.

Idk where your at but I think there’s guys in Norfolk doing TOAR classes now

The “observation” time isn’t a part of the TOAR so no one needs to sign it off.

They’re the exact same TOAR so they should be the exact same class.

Yes but only for NC vs Oceans. Inland and Western Rivers are both different TOARs.

The TOAR and “observation time” should go hand in hand. They should be serious instruction and hands on training over 90 (60 -12 hour) days, but that’s not what actually happens in most cases.

In reality guys work as deckhands during their “observation time.” Companies are not going to pay guys to ride along as observers for three months ( with an even time schedule that would take six months). Most companies would not even let guys ride along for free on their own time to observe.

The USCG allows these schools to do one day TOARs. Why the USCG allows this, I don’t know. They shouldn’t.

Several guys have told me that they went to a TOAR school because they were tired of waiting to get scheduled to work with DEs, and/or tired of waiting for DEs to sign them off. The one day TOAR class is a quick and easy solution.

Worse, the one day TOAR courses are an everybody passes affair. The schools running the TOAR courses all know that if they start fairly assessing the competence of attendees, a flunk half of them as they should, companies and students will stop paying for their course and go to a school with a higher pass rate.

This phenomenon is not unique to TOAR, it’s wide spread throughout all the schools that hold courses and issue Certificates or administer USCG exams.

I asked a respected school if they were going to do TOAR courses. They said no. They couldn’t see how it was possible to do the TOAR course in less than 5 days. That would make it impossible for them to compete with the schools doing it one day.

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Well they aren’t a class exactly, the TOAR isn’t to teach you, it’s to record you having done those things. With these “Classes” you’re basically paying for the time on the vessel (or simulator now, I suppose) to be assessed on the aptitude and the ability to perform several items line by line. Nothing more.

I took one at Diamond Marine, and each of the 5 students including myself just rotated out on the wheel and got through all of the assessments in one day, but nothing got “pencil whipped”.

Sure, some students were better than others at docking the barge or controlling the little single screw tug but at the end of that time we all showed that we could do those tasks, if not all with so much grace.

And really that’s all they care about honestly, these guys would be shut down and their Assessor Cert taken away if they were just passing people without actually assessing them so I find that notion to be a little silly.

I think more companies should have a process or program in place for their Deckhands or new Mates to be able to be assessed, or give an incentive for anyone who holds a QA Cert and the desire to assess anyone, but they don’t otherwise these TOAR one day classes probably wouldn’t exist.