OK - so then the implication is for as long as we have been operating in the Arabian gulf the ROE as set forth by the command structure of the US Navy allows or requires the vessels under their command to get in a defenseless position against a possible threat. Leads to a further implication that the command itself to be either ignorant or negligent.
Wouldn’t it just be easier to admit that it is just your opinion based on your experience that you think there is nothing the naval vessel could do at the point you chose. And it could well be that if that naval vessel and its CO had the slightest thought that the situation could escalate could turn that vessel into smoke.
Remember the seas are free for all to transit. That means:
US ships are free to operate in the Strait of Hormuz.
Iranian ships are free to operate in the Strait of Hormuz.
Military vessels may and usually do but do not have to follow the International Rules of the Road.
If following IRoR vessels must act ‘safely’ HOWEVER ‘safely’ is subjective. What is safe to one party may or may not be safe to another. Is one mile a safe distance? Or one cable? Or one meter? It’s not written anywhere.
Therefore, as Iranian boats have a right to operate in international waters in ways they believe are safe then a US warship does not have the right to tell it how to operate. Otherwise the converse would also be true: that another vessel could tell a US warship how to operate.
The crux of the matter is that you (apparently) feel the conduct of the Iranian vessels is safe, I do not.
Additionally, allowing vessels to operate that close to our military ships is not allowing an acceptable margin of safety irrespective of who is operating the vessel.
Operating in the Straits of Hormuz is inherent unsafe. (There are a lot of other ships there)
It should be avoided, if you can.
BTW; You don’t see the Iranian navy operating in, or close to, US territorial waters, Chinese naval ship conducting “Freedom of Navigation actions” between Hawaiian island, or the Russians sending their naval ships through the Florida Straits, passing close to Miami Beach and Key West, just to provoke.
PS> It would be good for intelligence gathering. (Imagine the reaction it would create, when you see the reaction when a civil Russian research ship passing within 2-300 miles off the East Coast can cause)
My Pop was on the “Observation Island” back in the 60’s . He was a missle fire control chief in the Navy test firing the old(Then new) Polaris missles. He wrote home about how the Ruskies almost ran them over on the west coast to try to get to the expended missles before them. Same old shit for over 50 years. I think this stuff in the middle east is a bit different, with less good judgement by some… JMHO
You’re wrong. I don’t think any of these games are safe.
I’m pointing out two things: first, that both sides have a right to be where they are and, second, that one man’s too close is another man’s just right.
To the second point, you ever seen where one ship wants one CPA but the other ship thinks that’s too much? Either they haggle on the radio or one ship just ignores the other and does whatever it wants?
For example, I’m on watch and call over to a foreign flagged box boat. I ask for 1.0nm CPA. The guy on the radio either makes a grumbling sound or just stops answering. He then crosses my stern at 0.2nm. The thing is that other guy is just fine with 0.2nm but my captain sure isn’t! And that’s the problem.
So who says 1.0nm was safe but 0.2nm wasn’t? It’s subjective.
I don’t have any problem with people operating in international waters. That is different than dangerously speeding directly toward and around armed naval vessels. We shouldn’t do it, they shouldn’t do it… Really surprised this is controversial.
So you would describe the actions of the Iranian boats as seen in the videos as an inherent part of navigation? Or better described as intentionally provocative and dangerous?
No time for that… They’re busy conducting DENIAL of freedom of navigation patrols in the international waters of the West Philippine Sea (See articles linked above)
I was referring to the fact that there are a lot of traffic in the Straits of Hormuz, both by commercial ships and naval vessels of different nationalities. (Not to mention wooden dows and pleasure crafts that do not always keep “safe” distance, or follow RoR)
That kind of situation has proven " inherently dangerous" to Naval Vessels.
As to the Victor Leonov passing through the Florida Strait; No sh*t Sharlock. She was going to/coming from Havana.
Maybe they did not judge the visibility to be low enough to warrant turning on navigation light?
As to answering every merchant ship that call; maybe they didn’t want to give away their identity to every Tom, Dick & Harry that came along? (Does US spy ship do that??)
As long as they followed the RoR and kept a safe distance that doesn’t sound like much danger, but who can argue with “a couple of US Navy officials”? (that wasn’t even there)
I would say that the Iranians were not suicidal. Have you ever had to navigate in waters with a lot of pleasure boats?
You would sometime wonder if they were.
Was it provocative? Of course it was, and deliberately so.
How else do you make your displeasure with the presents of hostile warship in or near your territorial waters?
PS> There are no really “International Waters” in the Straits of Hormuz. You are either in Iranian or Omani waters. It is, however, recognized as one of the important straits that is covered by “transit rights of passage” under the law of the sea.(UNCLOS, which the US has not ratified)
It is better known as the South China Sea . Nobody is blocking free passage of merchant ships in the SCS or Taiwan Strait, ala they respect the Law of the Sea.
Hostile or provocative actions by foreign warships, approaching close to Chinese bases in the area are met by warning calls and little else (so far)
To avoid any danger, stick to diplomatic protests like the nations around the SCS does.(It doesn’t work, but neither does your “Freedom of Navigation” exercises)
It’s not uncommon for ships to ignore an aircraft carrier, especially when the CVN is radioing everyone demanding a five mile CPA. The carrier might want five miles but everyone else feels half a mile is safe for them. Best to ignore a CVN if they call on the radio. They are a nuisance.
Was meeting a warship off the Florida Keys keys one evening. Was trying to contact him for a safe meeting, they wouldn’t answer. I called again with his course and speed, next thing I know, they zapped me and radar went nuts for a brief time. I didn’t bother after that.
The ruskies do challenge and hope we don’t respond, that is smart I guess. Iranians hope we respond, not to smart on them. Neither one likes us, as we them. Who is smarter and less willing to avoid a confrontation.? Anybody’s guess
If I had anything to say to President Trump it would be to heed the advice attributed to President Lincoln: " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than speak and remove all doubt."
The naval command already has rules regarding engagement and if President Trump wished to warn the Iranians then the Secretary of State could make it known through the highest diplomatic channels. It is a part of the speak softly bit.
If you think the only thing at play is a couple dry runs, you are woefully ignorant about the geopolitics stylus Iran for the last 40 years.
Almost every IED in Afghanistan/ Iraq was either made by an Iranian, supplied by an Iranian, or the maker was instructed by an Iranian.
The IRGC and Quds force have done more harm to Iraqis and Afghans than any other nation.
We have been fighting a proxy war with Iran since 79, and that proxy war, more than vietnam, Korea, or and every other engagement included, is why we have lost credibility and our allies don’t trust the big stick.
It’s time to dust it off, divorce COIN, re- employ total warfare, and finish a job
