Well I bet ole Mr. Gary doesn’t feel so silly anymore…The Norwegians are coping his boys for once!
Least the flag state didn’t require crew on the rig during the tow this time. Hope that pretty little beach is ok.
[QUOTE=Traitor Yankee;188584]Well I bet ole Mr. Gary doesn’t feel so silly anymore…The Norwegians are coping his boys for once![/QUOTE]
No Norwegians. Alps is a Dutch and or German company. This vessel was Netherlands flag and based in Rotterdam. I believe they are an offshoot of Smit. Some of the Alps tugs are Antigua flag and based in Hamburg with German officers.
Unlike Chouest, there is no doubt that Alps knows what it’s doing.
Some specs for the rig.
http://www.deepwater.com/Documents/RigSpecs/Transocean%20Winner.pdf
[QUOTE=Traitor Yankee;188584]Well I bet ole Mr. Gary doesn’t feel so silly anymore…The Norwegians are coping his boys for once![/QUOTE]
Just Swamp Germans doing what they do.
[QUOTE=tugsailor;188587]No Norwegians. Alps is a Dutch and or German company. This vessel was Netherlands flag and based in Rotterdam. I believe they are an offshoot of Smit. Some of the Alps tugs are Antigua flag and based in Hamburg with German officers.
Unlike Chouest, there is no doubt that Alps knows what it’s doing.[/QUOTE]
Alps is part of Teekay Group now: http://teekay.com/blog/2014/02/21/teekay-offshore-acquires-alp-maritime-services-and-orders-four-long-haul-towage-newbuildings-2/
Here is their home page: http://www.alpmaritime.com/
Alp Forward specs. IMO: 9367516
http://www.alpmaritime.com/media/1098/alp-forward-specifications.pdf
[QUOTE=tugsailor;188587]No Norwegians. Alps is a Dutch and or German company. This vessel was Netherlands flag and based in Rotterdam. I believe they are an offshoot of Smit. Some of the Alps tugs are Antigua flag and based in Hamburg with German officers.
Unlike Chouest, there is no doubt that Alps knows what it’s doing.[/QUOTE]
Jesus its a tough crowd around here.
[QUOTE=ombugge;188592]Alps is part of Teekay Group now:[/QUOTE]
The company is called ALP not alps. They’re part of Teekay, but their HQ is in Rotterdam. I was in The Netherlands. They don’t have any alps there. That’s the reason why whenever you get to the top of a Norwegian mountain on a pretty summer day, you find that there’s already a couple of Dutch people hanging out eating their broodjes.
Are you shitting me, So they get a pass?? You have no idea who was running that vessel or the circumstances that it was lost under. Hell I think even one of the square head super Norwegians on here even said at one time that this exact thing couldn’t happen to the Dutch because they’ve been towing things all over the world for years.
Shit happens. When towing everything all over hells half acre some number of incidents are bound to happen.
The Chouest crew had no idea how to tow. They did everything wrong. And they did not learn a thing from the Kulluk incident.
Alp knows how to tow; it’s all they do. I do not know what caused this incident, maybe someone made a mistake or two, but I cannot believe it was a total lack of basic towing skills.
You are right, shit does happen, you are also right that the Aiviq crew made some serious rookie mistakes. Just keeping the conversation honest. If we find out they screwed the pooch like the coonass navy did, then we better be on their ass just like y’all were on the bayou boys.
[QUOTE=coldduck;188619]You are right, shit does happen, you are also right that the Aiviq crew made some serious rookie mistakes. Just keeping the conversation honest. If we find out they screwed the pooch like the coonass navy did, then we better be on their ass just like y’all were on the bayou boys.[/QUOTE]
You’re right. But there is no way a Dutch towing company working in its backyard screwed up on the same scale as Chouest (a bayou mudboat company doing work it did not know how to do, in an unfamiliar place 5000 miles from home where it had no business working).
[QUOTE=Emrobu;188602]The company is called ALP not alps. They’re part of Teekay, but their HQ is in Rotterdam. I was in The Netherlands. They don’t have any alps there. That’s the reason why whenever you get to the top of a Norwegian mountain on a pretty summer day, you find that there’s already a couple of Dutch people hanging out eating their broodjes.[/QUOTE]
You’r right ALP not Alps. (I’ll proof read next time)
BTW More Germans than Dutch around in the summers, but you find Dutchies living in some of the most remote places in Norway.
Some info from Upstream: http://www.upstreamonline.com/live/1440819/transocean-winner-runs-aground
According to Offshore.no the rig was on it’s way to Malta to be stripped of reusable equipment, before being towed to Turkey fr scrapping: http://offshore.no/sak/274868_i-2010-fant-den-giganten-na-blir-riggen-skrapet
This is the first “Norwegian compliant” rig to be sent for scrapping, but is not likely to be he last.
It was working until recently and received approval to drill in Norwegian waters as late as this January: http://www.psa.no/consents/consent-for-drilling-operations-using-transocean-winner-article11782-890.html
Previous name of this rig was Treasure Saga, belonging to WilRig, Oslo.
Treasure Saga was involved in the first blowout that happened while drilling in Norwegian waters in 1988/89: https://translate.google.no/translate?hl=en&sl=no&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ptil.no%2Fartikler-i-sikkerhet-status-og-signaler-2012-2013%2Fsaga-2-4-14-spoekelsesbroennen-article9138-1094.html&anno=2
[QUOTE=tugsailor;188587]No Norwegians. Alps is a Dutch and or German company. This vessel was Netherlands flag and based in Rotterdam. I believe they are an offshoot of Smit. Some of the Alps tugs are Antigua flag and based in Hamburg with German officers.
Unlike Chouest, there is no doubt that Alps knows what it’s doing.[/QUOTE]
The Captain and Chief Officer on the Alp Forward were from Croatia not Germany.
Some companies in Europe try and cut costs by employing people from poor former communist countries, who are generally less educated and experienced with a worse grasp of the English language than their more expensive Northern European counter parts. Also thanks to the wonders of STCW, people from these countries with a bad education systems, can easily get a certificate of equivalent competency from the countries with good ones.
But as the old saying goes, “If you think it’s expensive to hire a professional, wait until you hire an amateur”.
[QUOTE=seamanstan;188968]The Captain and Chief Officer on the Alp Forward were from Croatia not Germany.
Some companies in Europe try and cut costs by employing people from poor former communist countries, who are generally less educated and experienced with a worse grasp of the English language than their more expensive Northern European counter parts. Also thanks to the wonders of STCW, people from these countries with a bad education systems, can easily get a certificate of equivalent competency from the countries with good ones.
But as the old saying goes, “If you think it’s expensive to hire a professional, wait until you hire an amateur”.[/QUOTE]
I don’t think the nationality of the Master, Officers and Crew of the ALP Forward had anything to do with the tow line breaking, or the grounding of the Transocean Winner.
Are you implying that Croatian Seafarers are less skilled, or less educated then their North European and American counterparts?
I have been assessing a large number of Croatian Masters and Officers as part of vessel inspections for various purposes and have not found them inferior to anybody else.
In general their educational standard is good, as is their command of English. Croatian Maritime Education & Training is on par with that in other European countries, as it has to be as a member of the European Union:
http://iamu-edu.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Analysis-and-Trends-of-MET-System-in-Croatia-–-Challenges-for-the-21st-Century.pdf
All Croatians I have met and assessed has held STCW CoC with all relevant Training Certs for their position and the type of vessel they were on.
In my case, this have been mostly of Offshore Vessels of all kinds, from rather primitive OSVs and tugs to the most sophisticated CSV/DSVs and other specialized vessels.
Their STCW CoC and qualifications are accepted by most Flag States, with one exception. (Guess who)
You may want to compare with the standard on equivalent US Towing Vessels, but I’m afraid you will not be happy with the conclusion.
We will conclude that you are full of shit…
[QUOTE=ombugge;188972]All Croatians I have met and assessed has held STCW CoC with all relevant Training Certs for their position and the type of vessel they were on.[/QUOTE]
Yes, because that actually makes fuck-all difference.
Please explain, what makes no difference? No difference whether the Master and Officers on a ship / towing vessel hold relevant certificates?
Tell that to PSC Inspectors, Underwriters and Charterers.
Why would any serious Owner/Operator of expensive vessels entrust their assets to somebody not qualified to operate them safely?
That applies regardless of the nationality of those “somebody”.
In this case, I would assume that a Warranty Surveyor had inspected the towed unit, the towing gear and the tug before signing a Certificate of Approval for the tow to commence. That inspection would have included the qualifications and experience of the Master and Officers of the Tug, the Tow route, the weather forecast for the first 24 hrs. and outlook for the next 48 hrs. thereafter.
If you believe that if the tug had been American and manned by all American mariners, the weather would have been calm and nothing could go wrong, then you must have been listening to Donald Trump.
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[QUOTE=Fraqrat;188975]We will conclude that you are full of shit…
