Tanker Sola and Norwegian navy frigate Helga Ingstad collide off Norway

On the video there are also two false echos ! On board, where they using a 10 or a 3 cm Radar ? What was the azimuth band width discrimination of that radar ? Was Sola TS amalgam with other targets ?

Anyhow, I also believe that for whatever reasons they never really saw visually nor electronically the Aframax. Rule 6, Safe Speed, alerts navigators; at night the presence of background light such as from shore lights or in this case, background navigations lights. Thence and once again, if Fedje VTS had made sure that KNM Helge Ingstad was fully aware that an Aframax was departing Sture terminal, crossing inbound lane and heading outward, the belief perseverance wouldā€™ve not persist after such evidence given to them. :thinking:

So HI thought there were three northbound ships port and one ā€˜objectā€™ straight ahead and HI was confused. The mystery is why HI didnā€™t slow down/stop at once. If you donā€™t know where you are and what is going on in the dark, my recommendation is to stop at once. Once I didnā€™t and ran up on rock. At slow speed. I was 90Ā° off course and had no idea where I was. Luckily we were pulled off the rock after an hour. BTW

What means ā€˜vƦre lommekjenteā€™? My norwegian is not on top.

And this:

Fregatten til minst fire milliarder ble pĆ„fĆørt en 45 meter lang flenge under kollisjonen. Til tross for dette skal skroget vƦre lite skadet.

What is a ā€˜flengeā€™. 45 meter? Lite skadet???

Iā€™d say that the HI first detected the Sola by radar on the stbd bow, but did not realize it was another vessel because they couldnā€™t see any matching lights and did not expect to see a ship on that side. Just an unknown radar return. The Sola was moving slowly and not sufficient time to track so the bridge watch assumed it was dead in the water.

When the HI bridge watch got a message from the VTS telling them to alter to stbd they thought it was a request to open up more room for the vessels to port. They replied that had to first clear the object, not aware it was moving. Just an unknown object.

After the collision apparently they were still unaware they had struck another vessel, they assumed they had hit the ā€œobjectā€.

Would it mean that HI bridge was not equipped by a Radar AIS overlay or an ECDIS Radar- AIS overlay ? We know that HI AIS was not transmitting, but was she at least receiving ?

Ā«The tankerā€™s use of deck lights after departure also meant that the crew on KNM Helge Ingstad were unable to spot the navigation lights on Sola TS. When KNM Helge Ingstad at approximately 04:00 stated that they could not turn to starboard, it was based on a continued perception of the lights as being stationary and that a turn to starboard would send them straight into the lit object.Ā»

I really hope for Sola TS not navigating with her deck lights on ! But Iā€™ve seen it ā€¦

To know a place like the back of your hand. Or in other words you know the place very well to the smallest detail.

Thanks a lot. It is interesting to note that less than 4-5 minutes after the collision HI lost propulsive power but apparently not its electric power. Maybe the engine rooms were up-flooded due to the collision but the generator room was dry. Buoyancy and stability were then positive. But there must have been HI hull damages below waterline, and they cannot have been caused by the Sola TS anchor. Then some tugs pushed HI against the rocky shore, it was secured by wires but it started the trim on the stern and suddenly it lost stability and heeled to 45Ā° to finally sink due to a combination of progressive flooding and down-flooding. Maybe the HI underwater hull was damaged, when pushed against the shore.rocks? In retrospect the tugs should have pushed HI when still floating upright with no trim to an area with a flat sea floor at say 5 m depth to prevent complete sinking.

From the video, it looks like the tugs pushed from the wrong side, pushing the hole into the water. It must have been a complete confusion just after the collision, and few people with real hands on experience in mooring.

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1= HI at 03:55 change of watch
2= HI at 04:02 collision

There plenty things to help them to find out where they where, if they was ploting at all,

Hi @Baard,

Thank you for posting maps. Does it mean thereā€™s no traffic separation scheme in the area?

All that I found was this :
"
Section 132. (Ban on use of the waters near Sture terminal) Vessels shall not use the waters within the following positions:
a)60Ā°33,59ā€™ N 004Ā°49,59ā€™ E
b)60Ā°32,79ā€™N 004Ā°49,21ā€™ E
c)60Ā°32,65ā€™ N 004Ā°49,35ā€™ E
d)60Ā°32,46ā€™ N 004Ā°49,95ā€™ E
e)60Ā°32,41ā€™ N 004Ā°50,28ā€™ E
f)60Ā°32,81ā€™ N 004Ā°51,04ā€™ E
The first paragraph does not apply to vessels that are to call at or depart from Sture terminal and vessels that assist during arrival and departure.
"

However some news reports seemed to suggest thereā€™s an TSS.

When HI was speeding down at Hjeltefjorden, it was always in the white sector of the Uksefida lighthouse some nm South, which meant that you could turn starboard safely, when approaching an object ahead. Actually there should be no objects in a white sector of a lighthouse. I have a feeling the OOW of HI is making up things to protect his ass. Or the asshole didnā€™t see the lighthouse?

And after damaged in the collision the OOW should have asked the tugs to push him in safety at, e.g. Nordra Sandvika or Adnesflua.

Your coordinates seems to be that one for Kollsnes (3) on the other side of the islands.

kollsnes k2

No TSS

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Weird.

Thatā€™s the source that I used :

https://www.kystverket.no/globalassets/trafikksentraler/maritime-traffic-regulations_updated-2015.pdf

The local rules are quite clear:

Communication between a vessel traffic service (VTS) centre and a vessel must take place over the VTS centreā€™s VHF working channels.

Communication between vessels concerning passing or other coordination of voyages must take place over the VTS centresā€™ VHF working channels.

The master of the vessel or whoever is in command in his place must be able to communicate in a Scandinavian language or English if the vessel is not using a pilot. Vessels under military command may communicate with the VTS centre via mobile telephone when necessary.

Clearance must be requested via the VTS centreā€™s VHF working channels before entrance into the (Fedje) VTS area or when leaving a dock or anchorage site and must include the vesselā€™s international call sign, name and intended sailing route.

Requests for clearance from vessels with a length greater than 100 metres or vessels carrying hazardous or noxious cargo must be made at least one hour before expected departure from the port, mooring site or anchorage site.

Vessels carrying hazardous or noxious cargo with a gross tonnage in excess of 20,000 tonnes must use a tugboat when they use the waters within the sea boundary in the Fedje VTS area.

Maybe HI contacted Fedje VTS centre via a mobile phone so that nobody else could hear?

It seems Sola TS had to use a tug all the way to open sea outside the VTS.

Maybe easier when we see a map.

1 = HI 03:55 change of watch

2 = HI 04:02 Collision

3 = Kollsnes Terminal

4 = Mongstad Terminal

5 = Fedje VTS + Radar

6 = Vikingneset Radar (Fedje VTS)

7 = Maroy Radar (Fedje VTS)

8 = Sture pilot boarding (Helicopter)

9 = Mongstad pilot boarding (Helicopter)

The tug is cast off just before leaving to the sea, east of the islands.

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It does not seem like so ā€¦ isnā€™t it amazing! It looks to be quite the free for all navigating in that VTS supervised fjord ā€¦ :partying_face:

Anyhow; Ā«After the ship has sunk, everyone knows how she might have been savedĀ» ā€¦ hoping that everyone will know how to prevent such an occurrence to happen again within the approaches of a major crude oil terminalā€¦

I was puzzled by the criticism levelled at the HI for changing the watch. It is reported that the 4 to 8 watch were on the bridge 20 minutes before handover which should have been sufficient time to get a handle on the situation; unless of course they spent the time discussing last weeks run ashore.
Was there a data recorder on HI that recorded the bridge conversation or is what was said over the VHF the only voice recording available?

I didnā€™t realize you were responding to this article that I posted on the other thread.

I thought the watch change criticism was just based on pure hindsight. To the watch it would have seemed like a simple turn-over.

As far as the possibility of unprofessional conduct, I donā€™t think itā€™s likely. The bridge is a mix of commissioned officers and enlisted ratings and seaman. Any nonsense is going to be gossip fodder for the enlisted side and likely to spill over to command.

My experience at least, if the officers are going to act unprofessionally they are going to do it where the enlisted donā€™t see it.

3 posts were merged into an existing topic: Frigate Helga Ingstad Design - Damage Survivability

The Police is said to investigate Fedje VTS:


Here is a lengthy summary with a lot of graphics that appeared in VG.no today:

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