I am a 3rd assistant engineer, steam and motor, unlimited and need to renew by July 11. I will have 360 days at sea soon and have been training and drilling on-board.
Do I need advanced fire fighting refresher 2-day class? My advanced fire fighting was completed on March 18, 2011.
Are they picky about exact dates?
When I upgrade to 2nd (motors) and Chief OSV I think I will need gap closing of MEECE, Engine Room Resource Management and Leadership and Management Skills, correct?
You shouldn’t need to renew any STCW classes for renewal until 2017, though if you sail foreign I believe port state control is already asking to see training certs within 5 years. I’ve heard of the NMC requiring this already and they’re wrong, which screws mariners out of money taking classes they don’t need.
The STCW component of your license will not be valid past the end of 2016 without taking those classes. You should take them before you renew or your STCW license will say (not valid after…) so when you take the courses you will then have stickers in your almost new book (less than 6 months old) and they confuse the hell out of port state control officers.
[QUOTE=85TJ;177362]I think these will be questions for Mr. Cavo…
I am a 3rd assistant engineer, steam and motor, unlimited and need to renew by July 11. I will have 360 days at sea soon and have been training and drilling on-board.
Do I need advanced fire fighting refresher 2-day class? My advanced fire fighting was completed on March 18, 2011.
Are they picky about exact dates?
When I upgrade to 2nd (motors) and Chief OSV I think I will need gap closing of MEECE, Engine Room Resource Management and Leadership and Management Skills, correct?
Thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]
The adavanced firefighting refresher requirement does not start until the first time you renew after 12/31/2016. If you renew before then, ity won’t apply until the next time after that you renew. The same applies to basic safety training “revalidation.”
I’m not sure what you are asking, but generally, yes, required dates are strictly enforced. There is one exception - you won’t be penalized for submitting a timely and complete renewal if NMC does not process it until after a deadline. But, if you are asking if you do not even apply until January 2, 2017, or for a renewal, one year and one day after your MMC has expired, then they are “picky” - you’d be too late.
You are asking about STCW, but referenced national endorsements (licenses). If you currently have an STCW endorsement as Officer in Charge of an Engineering Watch (OICEW), you will need Engineroom Resource Management and Leadership and Teamworking Skills. You can renew before January 1, 2017, but if you don’t have them, your OICEW endorsement will not be valid after December 31, 2016. After that date, you cannot renew without them.
If you upgrade to an STCW endorsement as either Chief Engineer or “Second Engineer Officer” you will need assessments at a minimum. If you upgrade before December 31, 2016, you can do it with assessments only, but as explained above, the STCW endorsement will not be valid after December 31, 2016. If you upgrade after that date, you will need: 1. Assessments; 2. Management of Electrical and Electronic Control Equipment; 2. Leadership and Managerial Skills (must be a course); and 3. ERM, if not already done.
Leadership and Teamworking Skills for OICEW can be done with assessments instead of a course. But, since you plan to upgrade soon, it might be better to take a Leadership and [U]Managerial[/U] Skills course. It will count towards OICEW now, and can be used again when you upgrade to Chief.
Also, when you upgrade after your next hitch, you should just renew then and save a bunch of money. (The upgrade fee covers the renewal fee so it doesn’t cost any extra to renew at the same time.)
[QUOTE=jdcavo;177396]1) The adavanced firefighting refresher requirement does not start until the first time you renew after 12/31/2016. If you renew before then, ity won’t apply until the next time after that you renew. The same applies to basic safety training “revalidation.”
I’m not sure what you are asking, but generally, yes, required dates are strictly enforced. There is one exception - you won’t be penalized for submitting a timely and complete renewal if NMC does not process it until after a deadline. But, if you are asking if you do not even apply until January 2, 2017, or for a renewal, one year and one day after your MMC has expired, then they are “picky” - you’d be too late.
You are asking about STCW, but referenced national endorsements (licenses). If you currently have an STCW endorsement as Officer in Charge of an Engineering Watch (OICEW), you will need Engineroom Resource Management and Leadership and Teamworking Skills. You can renew before January 1, 2017, but if you don’t have them, your OICEW endorsement will not be valid after December 31, 2016. After that date, you cannot renew without them.
If you upgrade to an STCW endorsement as either Chief Engineer or “Second Engineer Officer” you will need assessments at a minimum. If you upgrade before December 31, 2016, you can do it with assessments only, but as explained above, the STCW endorsement will not be valid after December 31, 2016. If you upgrade after that date, you will need: 1. Assessments; 2. Management of Electrical and Electronic Control Equipment; 2. Leadership and Managerial Skills (must be a course); and 3. ERM, if not already done.
Leadership and Teamworking Skills for OICEW can be done with assessments instead of a course. But, since you plan to upgrade soon, it might be better to take a Leadership and [U]Managerial[/U] Skills course. It will count towards OICEW now, and can be used again when you upgrade to Chief.[/QUOTE]
So I have not been able to get the sea days needed for the 2nds license and the outlook does not look that good so I have decided to take the Leadership and Managerial Skills course at MTI in Jacksonville because I can commute and not stay in a hotel. The next class is February 22. I have put down the deposit. Once I have the certificate in a couple of weeks I will apply for renewal. If I happen to get a job soon, I will apply for renewal and upgrade. Thanks for all the help. I find the gcaptain Forum a great resource and I lurk regularly.
Assessments have to be done in addition to classes? We’ve already had problems with the CG not accepting signatures from some of our chiefs. How are you supposed to get these done then?
[QUOTE=catherder;179265]Assessments have to be done in addition to classes? We’ve already had problems with the CG not accepting signatures from some of our chiefs. How are you supposed to get these done then?[/QUOTE]
You can do assessments in lieu of the one day, operational level class. (The one for mates and assistant engineers.)
What’s the NMC’s reason for not accepting signatures? I hope you people are fighting it.
[QUOTE=Capt. Phoenix;179266]1) You can do assessments in lieu of the one day, operational level class. (The one for mates and assistant engineers.)
What’s the NMC’s reason for not accepting signatures? I hope you people are fighting it.[/QUOTE]
Looks like you have to apply to be an approved signer. Maybe that was the issue. It wasn’t me with the rejected assessment so I don’t know the rationale.
I’m going to pick through the NVICs for info. Looks like my answers are there.
[QUOTE=Capt. Phoenix;179280]The NMC has been known to be wrong. That’s why it’s important to fight bullshit rulings.[/QUOTE]
Yep, they are. At first they wouldn’t accept my sea time as a Ocean Operator, a license that died in the '80s. Even the evaluator’s supervisor didn’t know what it was.
[QUOTE=water;179300]Yep, they are. At first they wouldn’t accept my sea time as a Ocean Operator, a license that died in the '80s. Even the evaluator’s supervisor didn’t know what it was.[/QUOTE]
New update from 85TJ: I do have the time for 2nd’s. More than 180 days from OSV’s and DSV’s in the GOM. The rest is a brown water boat inside the line. Do I need to do any firefighting or STCW refresher to renew/upgrade?
I took Management and Leadership at MTI in Jacksonville and am signed up for ERW for last week of March. They just got this course approved. I am taking their first class.
[QUOTE=85TJ;177362]I am a 3rd assistant engineer, steam and motor, unlimited and need to renew by July 11. I will have 360 days at sea soon and have been training and drilling on-board.
Do I need advanced fire fighting refresher 2-day class? My advanced fire fighting was completed on March 18, 2011.[/QUOTE]
Not if you renew before January 1,2017. The first time you renew after that you will need it.
[QUOTE=85TJ;177362]2) Are they picky about exact dates?[/QUOTE]
Yes. I’m not sure what you are asking about, but the expiration date of your MMC, the 360 days in five years, and the January 1, 2017 date are all firm, as is the March 24, 2014 date for being eligible for grandfathering.
[QUOTE=85TJ;177362]3) When I upgrade to 2nd (motors) and Chief OSV I think I will need gap closing of MEECE, Engine Room Resource Management and Leadership and Management Skills, correct?[/QUOTE]
You need Engineroom Resource Management for your current OICEW endorsement to remain valid after December 31, 2016. If you upgrade your national endorsement (license) to Chief Engineer OSV, you will need to meet the requirements for STCW as Chief Engineer. Whether that can be limited to OSVs, and what you need to do will depend on when you began the service you will use for the upgrade.
[QUOTE=catherder;179268]Looks like you have to apply to be an approved signer. Maybe that was the issue. It wasn’t me with the rejected assessment so I don’t know the rationale.
I’m going to pick through the NVICs for info. Looks like my answers are there.[/QUOTE]
Assessors have to be approved after December 31, 2016. Until then, assessors do not have to be approved, but must have the endorsements and experience described in the applicable NVIC. Look at Enclosure 2 of the applicable NVIC, it’s on the bottom of the first page under the heading “Qualified Assessors.”