Next step, 200 Ton


#1

I took the 100- 200 Ton Master upgrade course this past week…I haven’t heard much mentioned about this step, here on G captain , so I thought I would share a few things that I came away with…

For one, ships’s stability plays a much bigger role in this course, than I previously thought…

Principles of ship construction
Ship stability theory
Draft marks
Calculating the center of gravity ( very cool)
Calculating free surface corrections ( also very cool)
Deck general

Chart Navigation

This isn’t the 100 Ton course , where you got away with sloppy charting and piloting …This was a no nonsense course where you had to be dead on, to get the correct answer…the answers are within 2 or 3 degrees so attention to detail and accuracy counts big time…I thouroughly enjoyed this class as it’s finally allowing me to get into some of the real meat and potatos of this industry…


#2

Where did you do the class?


#3

I love meat and potatos.


#4

I went through Columbia Pacific Maritime, in Portland ,Ore

The neat thing about this school is they operate 7 days a week…If you need a class that they offer and your short on time, they can be pretty accomodating by working a schedule that works for you…They focus on 200 Ton and below ,radar and celestial…


#5

Very nice! I have been to one school that almost goes out of their way to teach the bare minimum (just enough to pass the test) rather than teaching the subject. Every time I asked a question, the answer was, “Don’t worry about that it’s not on the test.”


#6

Ya certificate centers…I hear you…

I have gone to 6 different schools so far, from San Diego to Seattle and have ran into a few like the one you describe…

It’s pretty sad when you are spending this kind of money and the only vested interest the instructor has, is cashing your check…:cool:

I attended one last fall in Seattle that was so pi$$ poor that it was all I could do to just keep my mouth shut, then on the last day these two guys actually went up and thanked the instructor…I couldn’t believe it…They left with no useful knowledge except for what was taught for the test…


#7

I couldn’t help but laugh when I was doing my Radar Observer Unlimited Class, the instructor used a pack of cigarettes to plot the targets on the scope. Never underestimate the accuracy of a Marlboro!


#8

I encourage anyone coming up through the limited tonnage licenses to take the exam at the Coast Guard. You’ll learn the material for one thing, but it’s practice for when you reach 500T or better where you have to take an real exam. The license mills do a disservice by cranking out people who don’t know anything.

Taking the exam at the Coast Guard has risks too. When I upgraded from 100 to 200 T they mistakenly gave me the deck general exam for second mate unlimited. I missed one too many, but they corrected the mistake and gave me the right one. The problem was the test number the computer spit out used a “#” to denote a space between two sets of numbers and the exam numbers (on the actual exams) used an actual space. It mattered in this case.

But overall I recommend people NEVER go to license mills/certificate centers. They don’t teach much, and they cheat. The cheating helps the students, so nobody ever complains. They aren’t in the business of failing students.

Good luck,
-dennis


#9

Thats pretty funny.
When I was in the Navy the Officer and junior officer of the deck used tongue depressors, as their straight edge for their radar targets…One night we are steaming along and the JOOD says out loud

" This thing has a chunk missing, Boat s’mate, send the messenger down to sick bay and get some radar targeting sticks "…

We all just stood there for a second and then the whole bridge watch, busted up laughing…


#10

I have to say that at Down East Maritime Acadamy in Maine they went way beyond what the test was going to ask me. My instructor Lindsay was a Maine Maritime Graduate and spent years abroad before teaching the classes.
I have been going offshore as a commercial fisherman for 20 years and can
smell someones bull$#!* a mile away. When we left the class we were given homework and it was substantial. The people in the class that went out drinking and didn’t study and the one guy that said listen to me they don’t let you fail these things well guess what? She failed them and they had to come back to test and not just in the required 24 hrs. They had to come back the next week. Lindsay was a true teacher and had seen alot of stuff happen and was not going to let anyone
just slip by like it was a joke.I am sure there’s acadamy’s out there that pump them through but not Down East Maritime and they are better for it. Bottom line is there are alot of people getting into the industry and the Coast Guard would be overwhelmed if they had to test everyone. I hope that I am onboard with people who earned the license and didn’t just buy one. Regards Captain Robert Freeman
Portland Maine


#11

Where did you take the 100 ton course? Some of the differences might be due to differences between schools.


#12

This is correct. We have recently increased our auditing and oversight program to keep all schools operating at a miniumum standard. Part of this new program includes unannounced visits to schools for “survey testing” – on the day(s) of the exams the Coast Guard can show up at a school and instruct them to give a Coast Guard prepared test instead of one from the school. If the school did a good job of teaching ther material it should be no probl;em. If the school only taught to their test, students might experience difficulty.


#13

In 2004 I took the RYA (royal yachtmaster association) offshore class. It was two weeks and cost $3,000. The written test was short answer - no multiple choice.

Why do I mention this? Because this particular course had an automatic crossover to the 200-ton US license (edit addition: if you already had a US 100-ton license). I went on to get my US 1600-ton mate license under the new system, so I have taken about every course imaginable.

The RYA offshore course, which required only 55 days as sea (to get an RYA license) - yes, only 55 days - was far superior to any other STCW course I took, other than shiphandling,which was an extension of the RYA course.


#14

[quote=fourdegreesc;15964]I encourage anyone coming up through the limited tonnage licenses to take the exam at the Coast Guard. You’ll learn the material for one thing, but it’s practice for when you reach 500T or better where you have to take an real exam. The license mills do a disservice by cranking out people who don’t know anything.

But overall I recommend people NEVER go to license mills/certificate centers. They don’t teach much, and they cheat. The cheating helps the students, so nobody ever complains. They aren’t in the business of failing students.

Good luck,
-dennis[/quote]
Agreed. When I sat for my 500 ton, I studied at home on my own, using the books from Marine Education Textbooks.
http://www.marineeducationtextbooks.com/index.html


#15

Would you care to comment, Mr. Cavo?


#16

Not without more information. There are no “automatic crossovers” from foreign licenses to U.S. licenses. Without more information, I can’t even guess as to what went on here.


#17

Mr Cavo., i thought with the STCW in place, for example a 500 ton masters U.S license can cross over to a red flag license with the same license size without further testing, also a red flag 500 ton should be able to cross over to a U.S. license with the same tonnage
???:confused::confused::confused:


#18

This was a cross-over to the 200-ton license taught at Martime Professional Training in Fort Lauderdale. The cross-over was approved for their particular course.


#19

The cross-over to the 200-ton license was for a specific RYA course taught at Maritime Professional Training. It was not a blanket cross-over for any/all RYA licenses.


#20

This is the problem with these MCA issued “yacht limited” licenses. The MCA, or one of its storefront training school franchises, will issue a 200 ton and up to 3000 ton “license” that is limited for use on yachts. The Red Ensign Group of flags allow for commercial registration of pleasure yachts and issue yacht limited licenses for service on private or commercial registered yachts. Those licenses are not valid for service on any kind of vessel other than a yacht. There is no USCG equivalent and a yacht license is useless for anything other than yacht service.

The sad fact is that anyone can obtain a 200 ton master of yachts license and carry passengers for hire (though they call them guests) on an international voyage after having accumulated a grand total of 55 days seatime. And that “seatime” for yachts does not mean time at sea, standing a watch or working on an underway vessel. Wearing a yacht T-shirt is good enough for most of their license time. Simply being “signed aboard” fulfills most seatime requirements for an MCA yacht license. Somehow, the IMO has signed off on this scam and the “guests” don’t know any better. The MCA issues these licenses up to 3000 tons. It takes more real seatime and training to obtain a USCG AB unilimited than it does to get an MCA 3000 ton yacht master ticket. This begs the question, who bought off the IMO?

What is really amusing and tells something about the quality of the certification is that even the MCA will not accept one of its yacht licenses for coastal service on the same size vessel in UK waters. It is a document designed to market the Red Ensign flag to foreign yacht owners. Again, how the IMO accepts these things is beyond my comprehension.

It is possible for a USCG license holder of 500 tons or more to apply to the MCA for a Certificate of Equivalent Competence (CeC) for their merchant marine license. Depending on the CeC applied for the MCA may require testing on the UKLAP or UK law and procedures. Except for occasional events in Fort Lauderdale, that requires going to the UK for testing. What most yachties don’t realize and the MCA doesn’t talk about is that unless you plan on sailing on a UK flagged commercial ship, you don’t need a CeC or MCA yacht license. Since most yachts are flagged in Caymans or another of the Red Ensign group flags and those maritime administrations recognize a real USCG or other STCW white list license, they will issue their endorsement at the same or often higher license level for service onboard yachts. A 3rd assistant engineer can sail chief on a large yacht.

The USCG might accept the coursework for one of the RYA or IYT licenses as meeting that required for a USCG near coastal or inland license to 200 tons but there is no way that even an MCA 3000 ton yacht master’s license approaches the training and seatime requirements to serve as a USCG AB.

The whole MCA yacht license thing stinks and it is amazing the IMO has given it approval and the USCG allows those holding one to carry charter “guests” in American waters.