More MMP/AMO BS

Scuttlebutt
22

It was pretty CASUAL my thesis was basically how many coors light fit in a thermos

23

Because their pension is shit.

I didnā€™t pay into the MEBA pension all these years to merge with MM&P. I get the sentiment but Iā€™m not really in a position where merging has any upside. What can they offer me that I donā€™t have now?

24

Chenganator,

Unfortunately, I have to agree on most points. MMP never had the shrewd, calculating type of president that MEBA had in Jesse Calhoun. We also never had our own school cranking out cadets on a license track. Stacking ships through the 70s with MEBA cadets no doubt helped out your pension. MMP pension will never recover to the level it was before the tanker strike, not even to include the damages done to the pension fund by horrible decisions like porno satellite, dude ranches, and that stupid cruise ship.

I can say Iā€™m okay with it at the end of the day because when you add it up with company IRAP contributions itā€™s not bad. Itā€™s certainly not MEBA, but then again, I dare say you guys very likely have one of the most generous and most healthy pensions in all of privatized America. So you guys are definitely a huge outlier amongst the few private pensions that still exist. Seriously, Good for you guys. I wish MMP had somebody more like CALHOUN through the 70s/80s, but we had that arrogant, unyielding LOWEN who really did a lot of long term damage because he wasnā€™t willing to compromise with the operators when doing so WAS in the best interest of the MMP.

I have always been a big believer that MMP and MEBA would never merge simply because of the pension plan complexities, and that was BEFORE we stopped paying into the old plan and created the new APP.

One side question for you, are the SEACOR ships (GREEN ETC., and the OCEAN ETC.) contributing to the MEBA pension plan? They donā€™t for us, just a very large IRAP contribution.

25

They do not. At least currently. There is a push by MEBA to negotiate this but I donā€™t know how successful this will be.

I do not hold any animosity towards MM&P or any other union or their members. I think any progress in strengthening the Mariners position to attain better wages or any improve quality of life at sea, benefits all and we are literally, all in the same boat. I just do not want to risk something as substantive as my retirement without any clear upside.

2 Likes
26

Agreed, there is no clear upside whatsoever.

27

Iā€™d really like to hear more about this

28

Sorry, but youā€™ll have to exhume Lowen to get the real scoop on that. It definitely happened, just before my time.

1 Like
29

They really did some funky stuff. The AHL thing too was sketchy as can be. Iā€™d love to hear about the satellite/ranch etc too.

30

How about when Horner ran the Company into the ground with poor decisions and Brown was left holding a less full retirement bag of money for itā€™s members. Thats right up there with the Passenger Ship deal Brown did. ā€œNothing to see here, just move alongā€.

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31

I can think of at least one way to easily harmonize the retirement plans between the unions so it wouldnā€™t jeopardize the higher MEBA pension.

32

and many ears are burning in anticipation of this Disneyesque proposal to flow from your keyboard. Bring itā€¦

33

You make it sound like major complex national corporation mergers arenā€™t something that happens all the time. Itā€™s not rocket science, legacy benefit plans for the pre-existing employees with the better plan are a standard thing. Harmonization can take years or even decades, and itā€™s usually the people hired after the merger date that get the least favorable retirement plan of the three.

34

so sorry i used a little tongue in cheek language on GCaptainā€¦..god forbid.

I am HONESTLY curious as to the harmonious proposal. None of the mariner unions are COMPLEX NATIONAL CORPORATIONS

35

The current MEBA pension becomes the default for all new members of the joint union.

Members of MM&P keep their existing pension but their payout is increased based on the number of years they work after the union merger with us subsequent higher company pension contributions. They are also given an option to buy in to the legacy MEBA pension with payroll deductions based on how many years they have in the MM&P pension (having fewer years in the MM&P pension would require less of a buy in). They could also be offered to have their MM&P pension converted to legacy MEBA pension without paying out of paycheck by reducing credited years. Example: you have 15 years of pension credit with MM&P, you can continue to earn time towards that pension and retire with those payments or you can accept 10 years of pension credit with the legacy MEBA pension and retire with that one.

Members of AMO will have the value of their Defined Contribution and Money Purchase Benefit plans added up and converted to years of pension credit in order to buy in or they can choose to keep going with those plans if they donā€™t want to buy in. Newer members would be better off buying in, older members wouldnā€™t.

36

Yeah dude, that was kinda my point, complex mergers happen every day, unions arenā€™t complex, ergo not some difficult mystery to figure out. Iā€™ll be sure to elaborate in all caps next time so thereā€™s no confusion.

1 Like