Won’t know if there is tech until someone tries to r and d it.
1 Like
Check out nbc news 1 30 23 Tesla catches fire 6000 gallons of water to put the fire out
Then you’ll see what I mean lithium ion is not where it’s at!
I lived in California for 35 yrs I’ve seen this before
1 Like
EV fires have caused drought in SoCal…
2 Likes
My boat is composite (fiberglass) and is 50 years old. This is not a new idea in the USA even when she was new, let alone now.
Getting back to batteries, conventional fiberglass boats burn very fast, a battery fire would not be fun at all.
Composite just means “made up of several parts or elements”. It certainly isn’t a new idea, in the USA or other places:
History of Composite Materials | Mar-Bal, Inc..
The type of materials and method used by Brødrene Aa AS to build Fast Ferries and other High Speed Commercial Crafts using these materials and methods are fairly new however. (since 2002)
I agree, this is too far OT and a useless conversation, since you cannot compare fiberglass and conventional construction methods with how they construct their vessels, using carbon fiber intrusion and sandwich construction.
I’m not able to explain this any clearer, but maybe someone with more expertise on the subject could do so in a new thread?
1 Like
Its solid glass or has foam, its not normal practice to call a solid glass boat composite.
Nor would I call a mast made from carbon prepreg composite
( I can see it has fibre and resin so it is 2 parts)
not carbon but suspected battery fire as there was someone working in the aft of the boat at the time, fire came from inside.
Insurance companies are starting to raise premiums on boats with lithiums
The article you supplied does not mention batteries at all. Why would you claim Lithium batteries are at fault here? Fiberglass boats are rather flammable and hard to put out on their own.
There are almost zero articles on lithium fires in boats but in the last several years many boats have gone up in smoke that had lithiums.
That boat in Singapore was brand new, nobody cooking, no phones on charge, just a guess at what happened.
The evidence is gone in most cases.
That article is a mass of innuendo and allegation and rather light on actual facts (something which they do bemoan!).
One thing missing here is any mention at all of THE CHEMISTRY INVOLVED. As several have brought up in this discussion, there are a number of different chemistries of “lithium ion” batteries, and these chemistries have vastly different characteristics in terms of starting fires. I note that the lead vessel fire mentioned in that article stated that the suspect ignition source was NOT the vessel’s own batteries, but rather the battery of the owner’s “water scooter” (whatever that is) and/or the charger for it, which had previously “scorched” the power outlet it was connected to.
Lithium-ion chemistry is VERY popular, on many scales, from pocket electronics (where they are now ubiquitous), larger rechargeable electronics such as dive lights, laptops, drones and musical amplifiers to various “toys”, such as ebikes, scooters and outboard motors, to serious battery banks in yachts and on up to really big things like ferries and buses. It seems unlikely that the world is going to go back to the weight and inefficiency of older battery designs & chemistries and until one of the “maybe someday” technologies that gets bandied about actually achieves usability, they’re going to be around us. What we need to be doing is identify the failure modes, the chemistries that are more dangerous than they are worth, and what needs to be done to mitigate the hazards. Railing about the “dangers” of lithium-ion without a clear understanding of the realities is a waste of time, IMHO.
2 Likes
If only it was as simple as saying “lithiums”.
The are many types of Lithium batteries for different usage and with different characteristic:
There are also many different types of electrolytes used in lithium batteries:
PS> Plenty of scholarly and more popular articles on the subject to be found for those who are interested.
It is as simple as saying anything lithium is a fire looking for a reason to burn and you cant put it out
Phone batteries banned from being flown as they have crashed a few aircraft…
Regardless of the technology they all create oxygen in a fire so how to put them out?
Earl
1 Like
E-Cigarettes, mobile phones, chargers and power banks are obviously dangerous. They have been causing fires on planes and in other places for years.
But what are the risks from a well designed, correctly installed, well maintained and operated battery system commonly used as main or hybrid power source on vessels today?
Here is a study carried out by SINTEF on behalf of DNV:
Car fire on board a ferry:
A car caught fire on board the ferry between Hareid and Sulesund on Friday morning. Two passengers acted quickly and extinguished the fire.
Source: smp.no today
PS> This time it was NOT an EV, but it is bound to happen sooner or later.
Will this do the trick, or too little, too late?
1 Like
Just in from local news joint unfortunaltely in polish. 21 hrs to kill the fire and only after bringing special container filled with water . Now imagine You have 1000 of this baybies o/b and one only starts burning .
Tuchom: 21 godzin akcji, specjalny kontener. Strażacy gasili elektrycznego mercedesa - RMF 24
1 Like
An excellent document, sir! I wish they had done further investigation of the relative risks of the different chemistries involved in “lithium ion” batteries, but perhaps that will appear in the later parts of their series.
1 Like