Limited - unlimited Licenses

I have just been rated for Master of Inland waters not to exceed 4000 GRT, however it seems most vessels in the unlimited class are rated in GT. The limited level has equivalent ratings but what about the unlimited? Has anyone figured this out?

Licenses (national endorsements) are all in GRT, STCW endorsements are all in GT. See 46 CFR Part 11. The only exception is OSV licenses for Chief Mate and Master which use both, e.g. 1,600 GRT/3,000 GT.

The GT rating is higher than GRT for most limited licenses (1600GRT=3000GT) what would the GT equivalent be for a 4000GRT ?

Well if it doesn’t have a GRT measurement, you get to count the GT as GRT for purposes of sea service. So I would suspect the GT equivalent for 4000 GRT would still be 4000 GT. But I’m guessing and look forward to JD’s response.

46 cfr 11.211 (h) Tonnage. When determining sea service credit for officer endorsement applicants under subpart D of this part, the tonnage of a vessel solely admeasured using the Convention measurement scheme under 46 U.S.C. Chapter 143 will be credited as Gross Register Tonnage. This paragraph does not apply to those vessels measured under the optional regulatory measurement provisions of 46 U.S.C. 14305.

Why would you be worried about GT? You said inland waters so as far as my knowledge no vessel would be admeasured in GT. Hence International Tonnage Certificate ITC GT.

I don’t believe there would be a GT equivalent for an inland license…

@Tcaptain does your inland boat have a GT and GRT ?

But it’s the opposite for sailing. If your license only has GRT and the vessel only has GT then your GRT license has to cover the GT of the vessel.

That was my interpretation. I.e., if a vessel is only admeasured in ITC, then you have to treat the GT as GRT. But I could not find anything in the CFRs to support this. It also seems like a rare situation where a vessel only admeasured under ITC doesn’t require STCW.

It’s not necessarily a matter of needing STCW though. Example, a lot of times when you get an unlimited license with a tonnage limit they only use GRT even though it’s fully STCW compliant.

Cavo on top of this. Wait for it.

Yes, but if you are sailing on a vessel requiring STCW, I was under the impression that it doesn’t matter what limitations are on your national endorsement. It is your CoC that takes precedence. Is this not correct?

Not my area, and if I am not absolutely sure of the answer, and can cite something to support it, I avoid muddying things with a less than authoritative answer. And I can’t walk down the hall to find someone who knows like I usually would as most of us are working from home. I can speak to the credentialing parts, but not the manning. This all notwithstanding, I haven’t read anything here that doesn’t seem accurate.

Your national endorsement is your CoC and you are always bound by any restrictions on there even if sailing on foreign flag vessels.

Poor wording on my part. And yes, some restrictions on your license would apply no matter what. But I’m talking about if you have tonnage restrictions on your national endorsement but are unlimited on your STCW endorsement. If this is the case and you are sailing on an STCW vessel, I can’t see how a limitation in GRT would also apply. You would be compliant based on your II/2 endorsement, even if the vessel also had been admeasured in both GT and GRT.

That’s not how the USCG thinks when issuing licenses though. There are numerous licenses issued without any restrictions on the STCW side but they have restrictions on their domestic side (either tonnage or trade). That doesn’t mean they are actually unrestricted if that person is sailing on an STCW vessel, it just means the NMC is lazy about printing restrictions.

There is nothng in 46 CFR 15.401 that would waive having to comply with any limitations on your national endorsement eif you are subject to STCW. It might, however, pass a foreign port state control officer not a familiar with our national credentialing scheme who only looks at the STCW. That doesn’t mean the issuing country (U.S.) considers your service to be authorized by your credentials (all of them).

If a vessel is only admeasured in GT and you are sailing on a voyage requiring STCW, then any limitation on domestic tonnage means nothing, provided you have the appropriate USCG issued STCW endorsement. But are you saying that if the same vessel is also admeasured in GRT, now the mariner has to comply with any domestic tonnage limitations? This doesn’t make sense to me.

Actually, there is:

(f) Every person employed on a vessel with dual tonnages (both domestic and international) must hold a credential authorizing service appropriate to the tonnage scheme under which the vessel is manned and operating.

This statement must be there for a reason. If a vessel is manned and operating under the STCW scheme, then an STCW unlimited endorsement is appropriate.

I don’t think so based on this.

What I was saying was that having an STCW endorsement without a limitation does not mean that when you are operating subject to STCW, any limitation on your license (national endorsement) doesn’t apply. E.g. if your national endorsement is Master (OSV) Less Tan 1,600 GRT/3,000 GT, and you cannot work on a vessel other than an OSV at any time your even if your STCW endorsement is Master Less Than 3,000 GT and does not have a limitation to OSVs. The limitation on the license still applies.