Increase pay, hire more mariners, work them even-time. Yes, it will cost more. But, their ships will be crewed, and sailing, and mission effective. Until MSC does this, it will be tough sledding for them.
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While I agree with the fact that MSC/Navy needs to pull their head out of the sand, this article seems a little misleading just as I find most of the tweets from our two leading USMM unofficial spokespersons are.
The EPF’s are useless for their current missions unless they’re operating in confined waters where there’s swells less than 4 ft. MSC/Navy has been talking about laying those shit boxes up for a while or finding a new mission, I’ve even heard rumors of putting conmars on them. So to say they’re losing 12 of those isn’t really a surprise.
Same with the Puller/Williams. Those missions aren’t critical or used much anymore. I know the USMC has harped on wanting to use the amphibious ops more but they retired the Glenn, and the Montfort Point is doing a new mission that frankly a lot of other ships could do, she’s just in the right place at the right time and it has nothing to do with what she was built for.
The two Lewis & Clark class ships not named are most likely the Lewis and Clark and the Sacagewa. Both of which have been on the chopping block for years. I think they’re mostly floating parts warehouses at this point. First time I got to Diego in 2018 they were talking about retiring those floating dumpsters.
The other unnamed ship is 1 T-AO. They just built 3 brand new ones. So we lose one and gain 3? Math seems ok on that one.
All seems like fear mongering to me. Personally I’d rather everyone be worried about the fact that we’re laying up sealift capacity with nothing to replace it. MARAD buying piece of shit ARC ships and smaller foreign hulls while laying up SL7’s and LMSR’s that are in just as good if not better shape seems counterintuitive.
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I thought since the Puller and the Williams were under USN commission, they were 100% USN staffed with no civmars aboard.
I think it’s like the Mount Whitney, a blend with a Navy Capt.
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When MSC lays up ships like this, is it like the covid style layups where they still had a crew on them?
I would not say no to being put on a ship in Apra Harbor that doesn’t go anywhere, doing beer on the pier every night. Shit, I might even do that in Norfolk too. Is there a chance these laid up ships could appear on AMO’s job board?
They’re not manned by conmars, so unless they change that, no.
EPFs are a complete waste. Good lobbying by Austal. How they convinced the Navy to build hospital variants is beyond me. The ships cant go to shallow drafts much more than a larger ship due to the fact that the jets will suck up mud and overheat the engines. How are you going to perform surgery or other complicated medical procedures when the ship rolls if a security boat passes by doing its rounds?
MSC has an office problem. They need an investigation on their practices. Start there and thin the herd. Lots of people with jobs sucking up a nice paycheck that really shouldnt be there. Streamline the office and make those who are left do work. The ship culture is a disaster. Give the ships the power to cut the lazy fat on ships. Increase time off. Give those on forward deployed ships much more leave accrual than those who sit in Norfolk the entire year. Give an incentive to deploy on forward deployed ships.
MSC has created an awful situation in almost every aspect of their organization. I could not imagine sailing with them today.
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In other words, MSC is a typical government program boondoggle.
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They are part of the greatest military in the world ! Everyone knows the US spends more on ‘defense’ than the next 8 or 9 countries combined. Been in a few 3rd world countries where government expenditures and waste like this is known to be due to corruption. Hard to investigate though when everyone in charge is on the take.
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MSC will receive my resignation in September after 21 years. I stuck it out, made it through COVID, and hung in there hoping for improvements. Nothing will get better for years to come, if ever.
As a 2/O Navigator/Operations Officer I am constantly being used to fill vacant 3/O watch billets. My predecessor on my current ship resigned after working frequent 16 hour days. No thank you MSC.
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I had a young Third Mate onboard last year. He had previously sailed with MSC. He didn’t like the cramped quarters on tugs or that he had to actually do a little work. He went back to MSC because they were offering a big sign on bonus and he wanted to be able to get Second Mate without a tonnage limit.
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Puller and Willaims are assets that I dont think CENTCOM or EUCOM will want to give up unless they are getting replacements.
EPFs have always been a ship in search of a mission and mainly life support for Austal.
The T-AO is probably Lenthall. The first three Lewis oilers all have issues that are preventing them from being fully operational.
I agree that the state of the Sealift fleet is getting worse with the lay up of some of the conversion LMSR, the old MPS and now the FSS.
The goal with MSC is to use the 700 mariners to improve leave rotation and morale.
None of this helps senior mariners who are working so much their pay is hitting the federal limit.
Sal
USMM Unofficial Spokesman:wink:
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This action is about 3 years too late. They should have started this during COVID, maybe even before when they were several hundred mariners short of what they needed. Better yet, take some action to treat their people like human beings. It’s been a downward spiral, as many more got burned out and bailed, that may have stuck around if conditions were better. Count me as one of them, pulled the plug after 20+ years.
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That right there is a big reason some people love MSC. And a big part of the reason I left. Working with, and carrying the weight of, shitbags gets old. Especially when they are actively protected by the lack of consequence in federal employment
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Someone once told me you had to essentially murder an Admiral or highjack a ship to get fired from there — and added (sarcastically) even that might only result in a letter of warning.
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You know what MSC rewards hard work with? More hard work. I retired before the protected group became such a thing. The stories I hear are insane. The inmates are running the show. If I was in a supervisory role today, I would think about my safety before taking disciplinary action.
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On a related note, there’s also a solicitation floating around looking to have all the new tug/salvage ATS boats contractor run. It looks like MSC is focusing on CIVMARs only doing UNREP (hospital ships and hybrid aside). While I disagree with a lot of the opinions here on the other platforms, this may be a smart move. Between the EPFs and the tugs, there are a good number of CIVMARs who aren’t experts at UNREP. This would bring it closer to having everyone with the same skillset.
All that said, I think MSC stands to lose a large percentage of the people it’s trying to free up with these changes. This may turn into yet another embarrassment as they see a wave of resignations from guys who have been sailing on EPFs for the last 10 years.
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Should contract it all out . UNREP skills aren’t hard to learn and the schedules the unions offer clearly work better for most mariners.
People absolutely will quit. EPFs are cake jobs with the highest pay scale. The new tugs were keeping people on the hook but have been delayed so long many have left.
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The navy never wants to give up assets because that means they’re gonna lose the funding and they never want that either.
So nothing to freak out about considering the program has been a disaster since the get go.
Pretty standard for government new builds. They’re still operational. The Milk was just offshore for 10-12 days.
So it feels a little disingenuous to act like the loss of these 17 ships is a massive loss to the readiness and logistical prowess of MSC/Navy. We’re losing one T-AO, 12 ships that don’t unrep with warships, and two prepo AKE’s (that are floating dumpsters).
That’s been a problem for 50 years with MSC. Real issue is that those “senior mariners” never leave MSC and just keep complaining to people who don’t give a shit because they have enough man power to keep the fleet moving.
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I have a couple friends there and they tell me they are done when leave rolls around. Not to put too fine a point on this, but there is a geographic area that has infiltrated MSC and turned parts of it into a very “Balkanized” operation. Discipline is very difficult to enforce effectively because no one wants to risk a lawsuit/termination over harassment or discrimination. Sad.
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