That CCP pilot likely had a good instructor back when he started learning. In 1970 I was learning from an old WW II US Army Air Corps instructor. He was great. Pulled a lot of tricks on me like turning off fuel tanks while pretending to pull up his socks, just to be sure I was paying attention. He also taught me how to get out of a spin. He told me "Spins are theoretically not possible with modern planes and I’m not required to teach this but theory be damned. I will put you into one and we’ll get it out. The idea is stop spinning and level out without tearing off the wings, OK? " Needless to say I survived that lesson.
My buddy said both of them mid 30’s and mid 20’s ages, flew very well so finished early so the captain asked to set the sim up with max cross wind. nailed the line first time, my buddy was like wow…then he asked to raise the crosswind, and he nailed it again and again with one hand on the yoke and clearly teaching the FO how to do it.
My buddy then asked the interpreter to ask him, wow are you flying in these conditions every day, the pilots just turned around and smiled…
First job I had learning a skill, the old guy said only 10% of the people are really doing the job, the rest are not.
I seem to recall a story about a Continental pilot that landed at NAS Corpus Christi instead of Corpus Christi “International” Airport. . . . hang on. . . https://apnews.com/article/cc84d38b0d1d806c6cc32bfba2ac9a26
Things are getting better:
Perrow’s book Normal Accidents is good on this. I recall Puget Sound pilots not wanting a VTS but once it was established they saw the advantage. Mariners tend not to think of the parts as part of a system.
This stuff is outside most mariner’s area of expertise.
Years ago I was in Seychelles, on the satcom chatting to Perth, getting the cricket scores and other stuff.
We had an alert of the bulker in trouble south of us but too far away, gone with all hands.
Learnt from INMARSAT 100,000 tonnes goes down every month and has for years…
Aviation in the USA has had several years with no fatalities recorded.
Pretty impressive as for many countries, passenger miles flown per day in the USA is equal to the history of aviation in other countries.
Thanks for posting the quotes, I’ll get and read the book. Glad to see my ideas comparing aviation and shipping culture are not crazy LOL.
Note: All my past/future comments are specifically aimed toward US flagged vessels, USA licensing, USA aviation industry, and USA heavy industry. It is the only way to make a legitimate comparison.
.Coming from other industries into shipping, I have different experience and opinions compare to most that have spent their entire lives in shipping. It’s understandable that I’m told I’m wrong because they hopped on a ship at age 22 after maritime and have spend 20-30 years isolated at sea.
However, there is also a bit of ego involved; when you got a captain or chief making $230,000 a year, and no direct supervisor within 3,000 miles, they often feel omniscient. The arrogance to go along with ignorance is pathetic, at times. Again, “time in service” also feeds this flaw. Many of these guys would never survive in a shore job that paid $230,000.
That the current system “works” is not a valid reason to say it is “good”. It’s just that everybody accepts the flaws.
In that case I’m really happy the USCG doesn’t run things like the FAA. If they did, theoretically a person could get hired with MSC, spend 190 eight hour days on watch in the bridge, get off for a months training, demonstrate to an examiner they mastered the skill of looking out the windows & get a 3rd mates ticket.
Also, I think mariners pay & credentialing would be a lot different if we had only1 task like driving or piloting & if mariners got to go home everyday instead of being on call 24/7 for every possible scenario for months on end. My job would be so much easier (probably with a lot less pay too) if I could work on an engine for 8 hours, clock out, go home & completely forgot about the ship for days at a time. But I’m not complaining, it’s the profession that I choose. For me it has more advantages than disadvantages. Whenever the day comes when that reverses or I start complaining about all the incompetent people around me, harping about how everything needs to change I hope I still have enough sense about me to move on to something else.
I am now enjoying what I banked and invested from my years at sea. I was at an airport once with my chief engineer heading home from the oil patch. There was a bloke in a 3 piece suit striding importantly up and down talking on a cellphone. Both of us dressed in casual clothes looked at each other and the chief remarked that we were on probably twice the money he was and I thought about 5 weeks leave stretching before me.
- I said legally. The airlines (more importantly, insurance companies) obviously require more than the legal minimum.
- You’re truly undervaluing the demonstrate to examiner part. It literally means getting in a plane or simulator and proving one can fly the plane.
- How does time in service equal competence? Talented people learn faster and can become proficient must faster than incompetent. But time in service will eventually allow an incompetent to receive a license.
Exams in Simulators can and do prevent the incompetent from passing.
More applicable to flying as you can create the exact environment that exists in reality.
Simply staying alive and employed does not equal competence.
the airline industry in asia just waking up to the difference between doing it for a long time and having a skill set.
Pilots with big hours making beginner mistakes and killing everyone.
Look cheating will always be prevalent, case in point the recent cheating at the naval academy, on a physics exam, given an opportunity, people will do and risk everything. I’m sure those kids who have been dismissed would love to turn the clock back. But it’s not about the information or test they chested on, it’s about your moral ethical compass in life.
I can’t grasp that as incredibly hard it is to get into a Federal Academy, that the supposedly best and brightest that can pass these exams without cheating, cheated. I don’t feel sad for them. Had they not been exposed, one wonders what they would have done once employed by whatever branch to get ahead.
Society is ruled by oligarchs. All they do is cheat. Mankind has always reverted to feudalism. Is it a surprise that society follows the direction set by those at the top?
LOL, hard to get in. Merit based selection standards were tossed out years ago. All about quotas these days. Many cheat because they must cheat. They are incompetent, but in the position due to quotas.
Respectfully disagree. Regarding diversity quotas , l disagree they took in “Incompetent students” . USMMA took in the first females in the service academies decades ago. They are for the most part doing very well. I don’t believe those ladies cheated to graduate. I won’t do your homework if you want to check it out to discredit my statement. Merit based acceptance is alive and well, and has not been tossed . PDC hit it on the head regarding moral compass.
Regarding cheating on CG tests, I took the 3 A/E examination 7 years ago… around that time they changed the test bank questions and I had no idea if I would get the old or new test. I remember specifically the newer test almost always had 2 answers that were worded in VERY VERY similar ways, however one would be wrong, you actually had to know the material to not pick the wrong close to correct answer. I had originally intended to memorize questions and answers but when I realized that would not be possible I bought actual books on the subject as well as several coast guard exam prep softwares, the electronic books from hawsepipe.net where very helpful and locked myself away for 1 month, it literally had to be priority #1 life or death thing, I don’t see a way that cheating would have been possible in the examination room at the REC. I do remember however sitting in control rooms with Academy graduates bragging about how they cheated their whole way with their classmates to their mechanical engineering degree.
I wouldn’t say anyone who got their license from an REC likely cheated in any way though I DID hear of one guy talking of paying an examiner off not sure if this ever really did happen but the guy WAS super dumb and I did see him with his unlimited license a few years later he was an engineer at Choueat dumb like most of the engineers they had there with the DDE I must admit I was super shocked to learn he got his unlimited license he was dumb as a bag a bricks. I guess dumbness and $$$ can get you somewhere.
I also personally know people that have failed the cg engineer license about 3 times or more, if it was so easy and everyone could do it then everyone with the seatime would have a license.
Then they are extremely dumb if they can’t pass the test after multiple tries.
The USCG engineer tests are mostly useless, outdated trivia. Because knowing the inner workings of a Wheatstone Bridge is so important for operating a ship. There are also many errors. The entire testing scheme is a farce, and if one can’t figure out how to pass it, they most definitely should not be making decisions on a ship.