Rumor mill has started again about money in the gulf. What have you heard and while we are at it, with all these new boats coming out where are we going to get all these licensed personnel to crew them up?
Let’s here about it.
Excellent point. Let’s consider the new DP “rules” (we can’t call them regulations) for time/experience, too. Where are the mates/masters coming from for the new-builds or to backfill existing hulls?
It doesn’t seem many companies are pushing AB’s to upgrade and, to be honest, when an AB looks at the cost/time away from family to get STCW completed on their own dime, it is unlikely they would want to. Yes, I understand that the $ is better in the wheelhouse but family time has a cost too.
Engine room crew is another issue; larger, more complex boats are requiring more licenses and ratings. Same issue as above.
The exodus from deep draft shipping to the GoM is providing some people but are they ready for the change to the oilfield? Some are, some aren’t. The same can be said of recent academy grads; nothing there really prepares you for jumping in with both feet and standing a watch shuffling around Fourchon or running down Tiger Pass and backing into slip 2.
Any bets on when you will be “asked” by HR to work ovef a few weks on another boat to cover?
What Im scared of is a lot of companies going back to 2/1 schedules. Hopefully enough of us will take a stand and refuse to.
It seems like there are new rumors everyday. Personally, I won’t believe it until I see it. But I know from what Ive been hearing is that the more money they start paying, the more people want to go even time. That could hurt the companies even more because then they have to hire more people and pay more for benefits packages. I think it would be in their best interest to maybe start paying for travel or compensate more for travel considering people are having to come from further destinations to fill all of these positions. My airline tickets have risen around an average of $200 over the last 2-3 years. Add flight changes to that, and you could be out $500 just by having a messed up crew change.
On my boat, we’ve had a lot of interest from the ABs and QMEDs to upgrade and too their credit they are taking the initiative, but like kzoo pilot mentioned, some are running into finical difficulties trying to fit their classes in. Most of the time their time off doesn’t line up with the classes offered by the company, which forces them to go to private schools or take extra time off.
Some companies have been heavily recruiting at the maritime academies, and I agree, as an academy grad that there are things that you are not familiar with when you get out here, but thats nothing a few hitches with a good chief can’t fix as long a the grad isn’t hard headed. It will be interesting to see how things play out over the next few years with these aggressive new build plans.
I’d like to get to an even time schedule, it’s originally what I got hired for.
Patiently waiting to see what happens. Will make the jump down that way as an experienced boatman (yet young enough) if they get desperate enough. It will be all in the timing. That’s all assuming plan A doesn’t work out on my end. Personally think some of it is smoke and mirrors and once it’s all said and done they will end up with less hulls, more newer tonnage. But that’s just galley talk.
Remember the Reinauer sign on bonuses of years ago…
This topic is not really beating a dead horse because it is always being updated.
That said, the rumors are astounding. The pay rumors that I hear about Is getting outrageous. Having lived through booms, I dread the days of companies not being able to find relief or
always being asked to stay later on a hitch and after a few days off “hey please comeback”. Anyway, what’s going on is interesting and promising.
Yep, everyone’s talking. Something seems to be in the works at several companies.
That’s why you get everybody’s number in your cell phone and never pick it up if they call when you’re off. Hell any 985 number for that matter.
If they are dumb enough to fire you because you didn’t answer your phone it’s not like you can’t find something else as everybody else is hurting for guys just as bad.
Hornbeck will pay for upgrades. We have two AB’s on my boat in the process now. There’s a catch to upgrading. You can’t be a half ass AB with bad evals and expect the company to invest in your upgrades. Then they spent money to get a half assed mate. If you’re a good hand and have fantastic evals the opportunity will be presented to you.
As for working over occasionally I won’t have a problem with that. I have a leadership role to fulfill as part of my normal duties. If I have to put in some extra time to train new guys so be it. Right now HOS is in the beginning of a huge fleet expansion. There will be growing pains most assuredly. The good thing is if I work over I’m still getting paid. The inevitable slow down will happen years down the road and I will be thankful for the extra scratch I stashed away. I enjoy my family time as much as the next man. In order for them to have all they need I have to keep my job. So an occasional work over wont be a problem. I will not change my schedule to 2/1 unless a gun is held to my head.
I cannot wrap my head around the GOM mindset of ABs NOT paying for their own classes and upgrades. That mentality is preposterous. Until I joined this forum, I had no idea that companies paid for you to upgrade. Waiting for your employer to send you to classes is a joke, barring a company required class/cert. Where is your motivation?? I am out $30k and 700 hours of classroom time for my 3M unlimited. MY MONEY. I owe nobody. This doesn’t make me any better than the next guy…it makes me more motivated and hungry. So to all of you lazy ass ABs, stay lazy.
[QUOTE=RubberRhib888;101759]I cannot wrap my head around the GOM mindset of ABs NOT paying for their own classes and upgrades. That mentality is preposterous. Until I joined this forum, I had no idea that companies paid for you to upgrade. Waiting for your employer to send you to classes is a joke, barring a company required class/cert. Where is your motivation?? I am out $30k and 700 hours of classroom time for my 3M unlimited. MY MONEY. I owe nobody. This doesn’t make me any better than the next guy…it makes me more motivated and hungry. So to all of you lazy ass ABs, stay lazy.[/QUOTE]
To my recollection, my previous employer didn’t really pay for any upgrades before 2005. There were a handful of guys that started with the company as a DH and worked their way up over several years with the company helping sparingly along the way. Almost 99.9% of the guys came to work with a license/certificate in hand for the job they were applying for or wanting to move into. So in a sense you are right because the payment for upgrades by an employer seems to have exploded in the last 8 years or so.
Why should an employer pay for it? Well there’s 2 ways of thinking in my book in which both have proved me wrong at some point or another. First, because you sometimes think that someone has been a great employee and you would like to reward them and expect them to stay longer. Second, because everyone else is doing it and you have no choice. I have hired guys and given them no help with upgrades and there are others we seemed to pay for everything and the results were mixed. Some guys looked at it as that was their reward and they were free to go elsewhere and others appreciated it and stayed around. And it was mixed between guys who paid for it themselves and vice versa. It didn’t take me very long in the business to learn that you should treat people how you want to be treated and everything else will fall into place. Sure, some guys are given the world and leave anyway but for the most part they stay loyal as long as things are on the up and up.
My personal opinion is that the market had such a strong uptick that there weren’t enough Mariners to fill positions. So companies were hiring guys with no experience and fast tracking them to meet all of their needs. And that’s not such a bad thing as it changes up the make up of an industry and you get some “new blood” in. This field is hard to entice young folks into because of the time away from home, thats just the unfortunate reality. All the creature comforts in the world don’t make up for being home and watching your kids grow up. Also, some companies pay high day rates but may not help you with training, benefits, etc… Contrary to popular belief, no company can pay the highest wages, all travel expenses, all training, 100% of your benefits, matching 401k, etc… and remain competitive or stay ahead of others.
You have to make a conscious decision about what company is right for you and why. If you are young and looking to move up then going for a company that pays for all of your training will probably be a good decision. If your at the top of the totem pole and nearing retirement, then benefits like health insurance and 401k are probably more important as well as even time. There is no “perfect” company out there no matter what the recruiters tell you.
1 Like
[QUOTE=“Saltine;101761”]
To my recollection, my previous employer didn’t really pay for any upgrades before 2005. There were a handful of guys that started with the company as a DH and worked their way up over several years with the company helping sparingly along the way. Almost 99.9% of the guys came to work with a license/certificate in hand for the job they were applying for or wanting to move into. So in a sense you are right because the payment for upgrades by an employer seems to have exploded in the last 8 years or so.
Why should an employer pay for it? Well there’s 2 ways of thinking in my book in which both have proved me wrong at some point or another. First, because you sometimes think that someone has been a great employee and you would like to reward them and expect them to stay longer. Second, because everyone else is doing it and you have no choice. I have hired guys and given them no help with upgrades and there are others we seemed to pay for everything and the results were mixed. Some guys looked at it as that was their reward and they were free to go elsewhere and others appreciated it and stayed around. And it was mixed between guys who paid for it themselves and vice versa. It didn’t take me very long in the business to learn that you should treat people how you want to be treated and everything else will fall into place. Sure, some guys are given the world and leave anyway but for the most part they stay loyal as long as things are on the up and up.
My personal opinion is that the market had such a strong uptick that there weren’t enough Mariners to fill positions. So companies were hiring guys with no experience and fast tracking them to meet all of their needs. And that’s not such a bad thing as it changes up the make up of an industry and you get some “new blood” in. This field is hard to entice young folks into because of the time away from home, thats just the unfortunate reality. All the creature comforts in the world don’t make up for being home and watching your kids grow up. Also, some companies pay high day rates but may not help you with training, benefits, etc… Contrary to popular belief, no company can pay the highest wages, all travel expenses, all training, 100% of your benefits, matching 401k, etc… and remain competitive or stay ahead of others.
You have to make a conscious decision about what company is right for you and why. If you are young and looking to move up then going for a company that pays for all of your training will probably be a good decision. If your at the top of the totem pole and nearing retirement, then benefits like health insurance and 401k are probably more important as well as even time. There is no “perfect” company out there no matter what the recruiters tell you.[/QUOTE]
Very well said! I get bent sideways with what I perceive as laziness that’s all. Thanks for the well thought out opinion.
[QUOTE=RubberRhib888;101762]Very well said! I get bent sideways with what I perceive as laziness that’s all. Thanks for the well thought out opinion.[/QUOTE]
I understand where you’re coming from though. There are a ton of guys who walk in the door with no experience and want the keys to the biggest boat in the fleet on the first day and the pay to go along with it on the second day. Just have to chuckle and explain the ropes to them.
The hardest part for me to accept was that my company has two fleets per say and only provides help with upgrades to the one I dont work with. Im happy now though that all I have left to do is test for my upgrade and think I am even more proud of it because its my accomplishment and not my comanys.
The fact remains however, that “Failure to train is training to fail”, and with an industry in a dire shortage of qualified personnel, training is simply no longer a one way street.
[QUOTE=RubberRhib888;101762]Very well said! I get bent sideways with what I perceive as laziness that’s all. Thanks for the well thought out opinion.[/QUOTE]
How does taking advantage of a company program paying for your upgrade come close to translating as laziness. Sounds financially responsible to me. Why pay $30k+ to upgrade if your company will pay it for you… “Should I refuse my company sending me to my Chief Mate courses and pay it on my own so I’m not Lazy”
[QUOTE=“youngpup;101805”]
How does taking advantage of a company program paying for your upgrade come close to translating as laziness. Sounds financially responsible to me. Why pay $30k+ to upgrade if your company will pay it for you… “Should I refuse my company sending me to my Chief Mate courses and pay it on my own so I’m not Lazy”[/QUOTE]
I think your way off point. The guy has a point in that WAITING for a company to pay your way to the bridge is PURE lazy.
[QUOTE=“youngpup;101805”]
How does taking advantage of a company program paying for your upgrade come close to translating as laziness. Sounds financially responsible to me. Why pay $30k+ to upgrade if your company will pay it for you… “Should I refuse my company sending me to my Chief Mate courses and pay it on my own so I’m not Lazy”[/QUOTE]
Re-read my post. I am referring to ABs not a potential Chief Mate.
$30k is cost prohibitive to 90% of the guys out there. Im fortunate that my company has a pretty good policy on paying for your classes or else I would have been able to afford to upgrade. Paying a mortgage, utility bills, and gas is hard enough plus most people have car loans, credit cards, etc.
Plus you have the home factor, guys who are away from their family for 14+ days a month dont want to have to be gone any more than that even if it means more pay. Its a double edged sword for most of us out there. Again im lucky that there is a top notch maritime school 15 minutes away from my house.
1 Like
BULLSHIT!!!
I did it on my own, working 28/14 and making $225-$272 a day with rent, car note, and all everything else that goes with life. If you’re hungry enough you’ll find a way. 90% of the guys on deck say they want to be in the wheel house, but only 1% of them ever do it. Life’s about sacrifice and hard work to get the good things in life, but most want everything handed to them on a silver platter with no effort put into it.
How hard is it to take 2 weeks and at least get your 100 ton if you don’t want to deal with the hassle of getting your mates license? Hell most already have their BST, AB, Lifeboat, and RFPNW, which I did not have so it was even more of a burden on me.
That just leaves; Medical Care Provider, Advanced Fire Fighting, Flashing Lights, BRM, Radar and you can test for your 500/1600 with just that. That’s only 4 weeks of classes right there. If you don’t live in Louisiana but you’re working for a company out of Louisiana set it up with your company so that Fletcher can bill them so you get the in state rate, and you just pay back your company and that can save you a lot of money.
Then your left with VSO, ARPA, GMDSS, and with just your VSO I can point you to several companies with boats under 300 GRT that will hire you. Spend another 3 weeks and get you’re GMDSS and ARPA and the world is your oyster.
It’s even less of a hassle to get your DDE4000 no ARPA, GMDSS, BRM, Flashing Lights.
So explain to me how a guy who for the most part has already spent 3 weeks getting his AB can’t spend another 4 weeks and minimum getting the rest of his base classes done not being lazy? Especially when he can get a sizable pay increase and a chance at working even time so he can now really spend some quality time with his family.
The fact of the matter is that most of they guys know they cant pass the test, but it doesn’t stop them from dreaming of being the guy in charge.
As for $30 grand for an AB to get his mate’s license you guys must be adding the cost of snorting coke off of hookers tits in there somewhere. With just MCP, VSO, Flashing Lights, BRM, Fire Fighting, and Radar I am at $2000 using the instate rate for Fletcher for everything but VSO and BRM which I got from other schools.
Now Room and Board is where it starts to add up, but with Claudette offering rooms at $60 a night with a good breakfast a man can easily live on $75 a day, so for 28 days away from home that adds up to $2100
So now we are at a total of $4100. Still not an insurmountable sum. Especially when you spread it out over a year or two. How many of us have deckhands with rims and stereo’s worth more then that in their cars? If you want GMDSS and ARPA you will have to double that number.
If it’s a money thing, then they need to prioritize about how they spend their money. Hell even financing it with a credit card makes sense as the rewards are worth it, if they can get a credit card.
Now if you want to come up the way I did from 100 ton boats, pay out of state tuition or insist on using Houston which is even more expensive, and pay for every single class on your own including you’re two DP classes and Celestial, then yes you are looking at $30 grand including room and board.
Also between Youngs memorial and Fletcher who are constantly running classes eventually something will line up with you’re schedule so you don’t have to take much time off if any. Young’s sucks about posting their schedule but Fletcher is really good and they post them in 6 month interval’s giving you plenty of time to line stuff up. So you take a year or two to get everything done, but they key is to look at things in small chunks, not one huge bolder.