Anybody looking to join AMO better run the other way. They have killed the pension plan. If you dont have twenty years in by 2010 you have to sail until you are 65 years old. Yes, that means the hundreds and hundreds of members that are below 20 years by a month or several years are holding a goose egg. Remember though the AMO Administration got their buyouts and matching 401K,s and double digit MPB.
If you have 5 years or less to go this administration has cost you and your family hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars.
There will be two kinds of people on the AMO ships, buy out millionaires or people hoping their bodies hold out so they can get that used double wide when they are 65.
I am in their system as waiting for work which is the entry level position. They have not even taken my money yet. I wonder if I should start looking into MMP or other options to sail deep sea.
Listen, if they did this to members with just short of 20 years do you really think they will take care of you?
If you want deep sea, keep looking. No future with AMO. I thought people went to sea for the wages and the retirement security. AMO will cut your wages without any notice or reason other than thats what the company wants. Dont take my word, ask around.
I was hearing 5 months ago the AMO pension was only 30% funded.
25 years ago I was torn between going MEBA or SIU. The SIU contract I was working on kept me on shorter rotation which I needed at that time. Later, some friends tried to get me to go AMO. I mulled that as I had 10 years with the SIU. As it worked out, the SIU wage-related pension worked out well for me. I was able to retire with a livable pension @ 55.
I was concerned about the SIU pension funding. At the nadir of the stock market, the SIU fund was at 110%.
That’s the great thing about gossip. It’s fun, but most of it is BS. I’d like to know where you heard the AMO Pension was 30% funded. It was also at 110% at the height of the market. Right now, it’s something like 65% or 70%. They lost there ass, as has everyone. It’s the way of the world right now. Some guys at Bethlehem Steel got zip after 29 years service. I believe the United Airlines guys are getting something like 15% of what they expected. That number may not be right, but it is low. Point is, it’s every man for himself. By that, every need to do what’s best for them. Union pr non-union, each has to decide. Is it wages? Benefits? Pension? Time off? Advancement? So put it away while you can, and look for property in Thailand. Cause that’s all any of us will be able to afford. Unless you get your million dollar bonus for AIG for doing a crappy job.
Geeze there 173…Don’t get your panties in a wad. You can bet your a$$ I didn’t opt out at 55 without checking funds in this market. I had a long discussion with the SIU pension board members, union officials and company reps. I’ve been on committe for 5 contracts in the last 24 years and have a pretty good track record. I don’t feel it’s every man for himself. My traditional IRA took a 50% hit but came back to 80%. It’s still moving.
I’m enjoying what we bargined for. The PPO is still better than most.
If seamen would stick together, this would be a moot point. But it would be easier to heard cats.
[QUOTE=injunear;20696]Geeze there 173…Don’t get your panties in a wad. You can bet your a$$ I didn’t opt out at 55 without checking funds in this market. I had a long discussion with the SIU pension board members, union officials and company reps. I’ve been on committe for 5 contracts in the last 24 years and have a pretty good track record. I don’t feel it’s every man for himself. My traditional IRA took a 50% hit but came back to 80%. It’s still moving.
I’m enjoying what we bargined for. The PPO is still better than most.
If seamen would stick together, this would be a moot point. But it would be easier to heard cats.[/QUOTE]
When I said it’s every man for himself, I meant that every individual has to decide on his own. Pension or not, I’m staying where I am for now. I have a job I like with a good wage. And as you said, the PPO is better than most. It’s not all bad.
We dont have to look at AIG, it happens right in AMO. There are big problems with AMO, its the “whats good for me and my buddys” decisions made by the administration.Here are some of their public written reasons for doing away with the defined benefit plan.
In December of 2008, the DOW was at 9000 and the pension was fine. Now its at 10,000 and the pension is bust. So much for the market being an issue.
They blame the Pension Protection Act, well guess what your political action money went to these same politicians that voted for the Act. So, by all rights we funded our own downfall under the administration that hands out the PAC funds. I certainly didnt hand out the money. But thats right I dont have a buy out.
3.They blame the large number of members taking buyouts, what, they dont have records of how old and how much time people have in? They couldnt see this and make plans years ago? It smells like poor management to me. Imagine keeping records like this when the ABS or USCG show up.
So, who benefits from the death of the defined benefit? The guys with buyouts, which is almost the whole top level of the administration. Now they can collect a whole other pension, the defined contribution where because of their age and time will reap thousands and thousands from the dues paying membership.
One thing about the other pension plans around the country that have serious problems, airlines ect… they tens of thousands employees. We have about 6500 total including pension collectors. The airlines and such also allowed the companies to forgo payments to the pension plans over the years for huge salaries and such. I know that hasnt happened in AMO.
Also alot of these unions will grandfather and apply a tier syetem for people based on time in service, not change the rules on a twenty year run at 19-3/4 years which will happen to many people on 12/31/10
Hey if you have ten years or less you have some time. 10 to 19-3/4 you are paying with your working life. Think about it all these past years are gone they cant be relived.
There are AMO union election in 2010, don’t vote for anyone who has a buyout or " shelved pension" they don’t have the same interest as all the members who have gotten the " sorry, but you have to work till you are 65 and maybe we will buy out your defined plan with our formula made up by the people who ruined yours and your families future in the first place"
Meanwhile the administration gets huge pension contribution for a lousy job. When the administration wants more money they just up the dues and take in more applicants.
Don’t reward failure!! Vote them all out. They will say they are the only ones with experience, some experience, how could anyone do worse? Besides maybe Senators and Congressmen along with shipping company reps would actually like to deal with people that have actually gone to sea in the last 20 years.
If you think this AMO “pension crisis” has hit rock bottom so far, your going to love the new “defined Contribution” plan schedule of funding for pensioners with the buyout.
the AMO plan will make contibutions of 40% starting in 2011, percentage of base, gross ? no one seems to have the answer on its calculation however, if you dont fall into the 20 and out category or have the lump sum your looking at a contibution of 3.6% , if you have your buy out and are 50+Y/O your second retirement plan contribution will be around 6%.
when the plan is 100 % funded (good luck with all the 20 and out guys leaving) say 5 years hypothetical, the percentages change considerably.
the 3.6% increases to 10.8% and the 6% jumps to 21.25%.
So whomever has the buy out has hit the lottery yet again!
whatever happened to take the lump sum and not accumulate another
pension? this would solve the pension plan underfunding in one year.
Once again the administrators have handed the prize to a select few. Those with the buyout will be able to score big. And we are to believe that all of this is a result of the decline in the market. Hasn’t the pension fund recouped some of the money YET?
So 2010 will see no contributions to anyone except the fund (that is if the companies agree to chip in more). 2011 will bring a contribution of 40% of base wage(?) to members. So if your daily wage is low,…you get the drift?
So I’m wondering what my fifteen years of service is worth now. And who determines that figure. When will I possibly get my money. Or will they find some way to shaft me again?
There are still many unanswered questions. But the handwriting on the wall doesn’t inspire me.
These guys must be voted out in 2010. If you listen to the B. S. That the administration will spew to get elected you will be sorry. They will paint a rosy picture to get elected then oops sorry you don’t get it, tough luck . It’s been done before with MPB and dental benefits. The membership most vote in people that have no buyout or shelved pension . The amount of members that are being screwed far out number the buyout millionares. Hey, let’s face it the guys with buyout got their money, their contributions were supposed to shore up the rest of our pensions. But guess what the administration had to figure out a wY to get more money in their greedy pockets. Their matching 401k and huge MPB isn’t enough. Ask yourself why the administration’s pension formula isn’t disclosed. Because it is way above and beyond sea going members, a AMO secretary’s pension is better than ours. All financed with our dues, new building, no pension. New Toledo housing, now empty, no pension. Hundreds of thousands of dollars spent on lawsuits we won, but forgiven by the administration, no pension. 7 million dollars loaned to a small basically non existant union, only 50,000 dollars paid back in 7 years, with no interest, no pension. I think you all get the picture, what is the comman denominator? The AMO administration, almost the same people, different positions.
Look in the faces of your family, look in the mirror, do you deserve this treatment? VOTE THEM OUT!!
[QUOTE=Pensionless;22940]These guys must be voted out in 2010. If you listen to the B. S. That the administration will spew to get elected you will be sorry. They will paint a rosy picture to get elected then oops sorry you don’t get it, tough luck . It’s been done before with MPB and dental benefits. The membership most vote in people that have no buyout or shelved pension . The amount of members that are being screwed far out number the buyout millionares. Hey, let’s face it the guys with buyout got their money, their contributions were supposed to shore up the rest of our pensions. But guess what the administration had to figure out a wY to get more money in their greedy pockets. Their matching 401k and huge MPB isn’t enough. Ask yourself why the administration’s pension formula isn’t disclosed. Because it is way above and beyond sea going members, a AMO secretary’s pension is better than ours. All financed with our dues, new building, no pension. New Toledo housing, now empty, no pension. Hundreds of thousands of dollars spent on lawsuits we won, but forgiven by the administration, no pension. 7 million dollars loaned to a small basically non existant union, only 50,000 dollars paid back in 7 years, with no interest, no pension. I think you all get the picture, what is the comman denominator? The AMO administration, almost the same people, different positions.
Look in the faces of your family, look in the mirror, do you deserve this treatment? VOTE THEM OUT!![/QUOTE]
I hear you loud and clear. The more AMO Currents I read, the more pissed off I get.
so what are you going to do, ignore it? we need to band together and set up a lawsuit against the current administration for breach of contract. read the offshore shipping rules and the constitution, what they propose to do is directly against it.
pass this web forum along to anyone you know in AMO,maybe a little information might spur the membership into action instead of discussion.
Is Capt Jack Hearn still around? You guys missed an opportunity not getting him in after the Mckays took the big walk. The best man, and skipper, I’ve ever known in the maritime industry. I would have gone to hell and back with him, and he would have easily thanked me for taking the ride, just as easily as he would thank you for a job well done taking your turn at the helm.
In China, Cuba and Venezuela - they have very good social, medical, dental and retirement program, with benefits to seamen. Try to apply for their citizenship.
Our system is not made to suit working class needs. Its so obvious, that even mentioning this on forum, can be considered as spamming.