Greetings All,
I have several questions to ask in regards to life as a civilian mariner and I have visited this forum from time to time and found great advice, so I am going to throw some questions out there to gain some more insight.
My background is Engineering, I have currently served 20 years Active Duty USN as a Gas Turbine Senior Chief, I am currently working on my Engineering License, I am assuming 3rd or 2nd A/E range before I get out in February 2013.
MEBA Union is it worth it or not? Also how do those big retirement annuities work they almost seem to good to be true?
What is the highest endorsement I can probably test for with 13 years of documented Sea Time on 4 different ships (3 CG’s and 1 DDG) all over 80,000 HP, and I have EOOW letters from all four?
Is MSC my best option right out of the gate?
Is it hard to get into MODU’s and is the pay as good as MSC? The MODU rotation of 21 or 28 on and 21 or 28 off is pretty attractive to me and is making 150k a year at either one of these ventures feasible?
With your background you should be able to sit for your original 2nd A/E, Unlimited HP. Be sure and get the Gas Turbine endorsement. Are you sitting for both steam and motor? I’d advise it if you are so inclined. MSC has some fine opportunities. I’m a retired MEBA engineer so I highly recommend you join the Union PLUS the MEBA has the Calhoon MEBA Engineering School, an excellent opportunity for further training and advancement. One use to be able to join the MEBA if actively sailing with MSC, don’t know if that is still current. The Union has halls in most major port cities. You might consider to pay a visit. I feel you would enjoy deep sea sailing with MSC and I wish you the best.
Some while back I sailed at MSC with a fellow that took his Navy time to USCG and sat the Unlim CE Stm & Mtr, being licensed for both in short order. Great fellow. The rules may have changed over time, and obviously the evaluators will have the final say.
With so much at stake, you might want use one of the licensing consultants referred to in other threads to get the best possible consideration. Some of the evaluators might not understand finer points. My last renewal at NMC was smooth enough in the end, but in speaking to them, it seemed they didn’t understand some of time submitted.
My thoughts … Go for it !
As for working, MSC will be more familiar to you, and if you need government pension credit time it may add to whatever you have or what you have from the Navy may add to a future MSC pension credit - so look into that before deciding.
Apart from that, drilling or offshore likely provides less adventure, but definitely more time at home. One exception is if you already live near the Norfolk or San Diego based MSC ships. While not predictable, there are often have nearby yard periods or other times where you can basically be local up to 4 or 5 months.
MSC might be a good transition for you since it is quasi-navy and will be a somewhat familiar environment. Think of it as an extended TAP class. I am pretty sure though, that you will have to forgo your AD pension while working for MSC as you cannot be a government retiree and employee at the same time. You will walk in with 20 years government service however so you will jump to the head of the class in terms of vacation time you earn and such.
To me the only downside to sailing out of the union hall is the uncertainty. You never really know when that next job is going to come down the way. If your Navy retirement is enough to live on while you wait then you are ahead of the game. It does give you the freedom to work when you want and how much you want which is pretty nice in my opinion.
Since I have a family, the uncertainty of the hall is why I went to tug/barge outfits. It isn’t as much money as drilling but it works well for me and my family. The 21 day hitches and only working 6 months of the year are the key thing for me.
[QUOTE=KPEngineer;80056]MSC might be a good transition for you since it is quasi-navy and will be a somewhat familiar environment. Think of it as an extended TAP class. I am pretty sure though, that you will have to forgo your AD pension while working for MSC as you cannot be a government retiree and employee at the same time. You will walk in with 20 years government service however so you will jump to the head of the class in terms of vacation time you earn and such.[/QUOTE]
Excellent advise
[QUOTE=KPEngineer;80056]To me the only downside to sailing out of the union hall is the uncertainty. You never really know when that next job is going to come down the way. If your Navy retirement is enough to live on while you wait then you are ahead of the game. It does give you the freedom to work when you want and how much you want which is pretty nice in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
True, the shipping card may need to be explained, and the permanent and temp positions, but I feel it can wait for the time being.
[QUOTE=KPEngineer;80056]Since I have a family, the uncertainty of the hall is why I went to tug/barge outfits. It isn’t as much money as drilling but it works well for me and my family. The 21 day hitches and only working 6 months of the year are the key thing for me.[/QUOTE]
Good decision - I lived in New Orleans so it wasn’t much of a problem, plus I finally hired on as permanent First. That may be problematic today until one has a C/E License and the company can still hire you if you are current with the Union. Things change and I’ve been retired for some time now. I still hear from former shipmates but now even they are retired. Are you still able to attend the Union School?
One more item, in addition to your DD214 see if you can obtain your complete military record, which has the dates of all your responsibilities, positions, ect. I believe your Commanding Officer can request these documents or you might need to contact BuPers yourself. The CG can study your record and you may be surprised what they come-up with (for example your GT endorsement). I know, lots of hoops, but it’s worth it.
Go for it !!
Our advise to go MSC seems to be best info so far. I’m pleased we are trying to help.
Some of the contract operated LMSR ships are gas turbine. Nice ships. I do not know who has the contract to operate them at the moment, company or union-wise.
Also, do not forget with GT experience, there is a lot of demand out there for qualified service technicians.
Also, talk to your NC before you get out. There was a program about 5 or 6 years ago where the Navy and CG signed an MOU where certain Navy qualifications would be accepted prima facia for certain CG licenses and endorsements. I think it was called COOL or was part of COOL or something like that. If you can find out what documents you need from the Navy before you get out you will have a better chance of actually getting those documents.
Yeah sailing out of the hall has its uncertainty, but when I joined I did it for a couple years as I wanted to experience different ships and work on my own time. Once I started to have kids I took permanent jobs. Right now I sail 1 AE for APL and can tell you that there are still a lot of jobs out of the hall. Right now a lot of guys with their time in have retired and left quite a few vacancies. Especially for 1AE and Cheng. People complain about not getting work out of the halls, but it seems that more often than not we have open board jobs.
[QUOTE=brjones;80070]Yeah sailing out of the hall has its uncertainty, but when I joined I did it for a couple years as I wanted to experience different ships and work on my own time. Once I started to have kids I took permanent jobs. Right now I sail 1 AE for APL and can tell you that there are still a lot of jobs out of the hall. Right now a lot of guys with their time in have retired and left quite a few vacancies. Especially for 1AE and Cheng. People complain about not getting work out of the halls, but it seems that more often than not we have open board jobs.[/QUOTE]
WOW!!
That is good news, been quite a spell since open board jobs were seen (or so I’m told). Before I took a permanent job I would take any ship, any company, the dispatchers loved me as they knew when I showed-up the open job would get filled. One of my finest runs as 1st was a 4 month open board job on the SS Adabelle Lykes back in 1981. It was a wonderful voyage to South Africa, plus a few other near by countries, and back to New Orleans. The ship stayed in Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, and Durban for at least a week or more. Great sailing days! Never could figure out how that job went open. I sailed other open board jobs and knew why no one took it but hey, I made my money and time. Never minded getting dirty and the heat was ok too.
[QUOTE=Sweat-n-Grease;80072]WOW!!
That is good news, been quite a spell since open board jobs were seen (or so I’m told). Before I took a permanent job I would take any ship, any company, the dispatchers loved me as they knew when I showed-up the open job would get filled. One of my finest runs as 1st was a 4 month open board job on the SS Adabelle Lykes back in 1981. It was a wonderful voyage to South Africa, plus a few other near by countries, and back to New Orleans. The ship stayed in Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, and Durban for at least a week or more. Great sailing days! Never could figure out how that job went open. I sailed other open board jobs and knew why no one took it but hey, I made my money and time. Never minded getting dirty and the heat was ok too.[/QUOTE]
Yeah I took nothing but open board jobs the first couple years. Sailing on the West coast meant it was hard to get out on a box boat since the group 1’s always took them. I took Liberty, tankers, car carriers, whatever was available. I shipped out in the summer and around the holidays so I could move up fast as I could. By the time I got group 1 I was sailing permanent. Most of the open board jobs I seen were on the tankers. Also have been a few open board firsts jobs on the containers lately. Nobody wants to sail 1 AE
[QUOTE=brjones;80074]Yeah I took nothing but open board jobs the first couple years. Sailing on the West coast meant it was hard to get out on a box boat since the group 1’s always took them. I took Liberty, tankers, car carriers, whatever was available. I shipped out in the summer and around the holidays so I could move up fast as I could. By the time I got group 1 I was sailing permanent. Most of the open board jobs I seen were on the tankers. Also have been a few open board firsts jobs on the containers lately. Nobody wants to sail 1 AE[/QUOTE]
Why - No one wants to pull pistons any more?
The First was the job I liked the best. Chief was OK but you had to deal with the office boys and with my personality it sometimes got hot.
If you are wondering why I’m on the forum on a Summer Sunday it’s due to the fires and smoke. The Bitterroot valley is socked-in. Been so for a week.
Thanks to all for sharing this information and also the sea stories, I am sure I will have some more questions in the future. I currently have my sea service letter documenting all of my sea time, TWIC completed and I have completed the BST class and Medical Provider class at Mid Atlantic Maritime Academy, I just have to finish the Advanced Firefighting and Lifeboat Class and do my physical then I am submitting my application to Coast Guard to sit for test, I also secured the services of Andy Hammond a few months ago when I started this process and he has been right on the money so far. As far as MSC and still collecting Navy retirement, I have heard it will not affect your retirement unless you choose to roll the navy retirement into their retirement plan, which I don’t plan on doing cause I will just invest my own money instead. Thanks again to all who chimed in.
[QUOTE=KPEngineer;80087]Maaaaan … I love the Bitterroot valley. That’s where my wife and I honeymooned. I’ve been dying to go back for 15 years.[/QUOTE]
NEAT
Don’t visit in Aug.
Here are two shots taken yesterday at sunset. The smoke is still here.
[QUOTE=+A465B;80041]
As for working, MSC will be more familiar to you, and if you need government pension credit time it may add to whatever you have or what you have from the Navy may add to a future MSC pension credit - so look into that before deciding. [/QUOTE]
I would NOT recommend toying with your Navy retainer and trying to buy into Civil Service FERS. But each to his owm, if you start with MSC it will all be explained to you at New Employee Orientation and you can make an informed desicion.
Actually, it’s the opposite.
A Navy [U]retiree [/U]earns leave as if they have no active duty service at all. There is some credit given for certain campaign awards, but it doesn’t add up to a lot. (Military veterans that are [U]not retired[/U] do earn vacation time from an accelerated point.)
And, You CAN collect your Navy retainer pay and Govt civil service pay at the same time. Aint life grand?!
Google the latest copy of the USCG Marine Safety Manual “COMDTINST M16000.8” and get hip to Ch 2 for military sea service credit.
[I]Originally Posted by KPEngineer
"MSC might be a good transition for you since it is quasi-navy and will be a somewhat familiar environment. Think of it as an extended TAP class.[U] I am pretty sure though, that you will have to forgo your AD pension while working for MSC as you cannot be a government retiree and employee at the same time. You will walk in with 20 years government service however so you will jump to the head of the class in terms of vacation time you earn and such."[/I]
THAT is correct. I collect my monthly Navy Retainer AND draw a Federal, Civil Service paycheck. In MY case I am over half way to “buying” my time back so I can retire on the Federal system (God willing) with 40+ years. At THAT point I lose my retainer but NOT my VA disability. I earn 4 hours of leave every pay period that will jump to 6 hours at the three year mark next may.