I have heard complaints from mariners stating, other mariners have a “sense of entitlement”. Since the phrase “sense of entitlement” can mean different things to different people. Question is what does it mean to you ?
I think It means a person thinks they are above doing a certain type of work, or that they’re better than others.
I hear that a symptom of this feeling of entitlement is a large ring on one’s finger.
And that should get this thread going good!
[QUOTE=Bayrunner;160287]I hear that a symptom of this feeling of entitlement is a large ring on one’s finger.
And that should get this thread going good![/QUOTE]
Sense of entitlement is when you believe you should be given things you haven’t earned. Like respect or being excused from menial tasks
I don’t think of it as a mariners view. One can be hard working or lazy.
When I hear those 3 words I think of Obama. “Gimme my free shit”.
Free house, free food, free phone, free healthcare
People who are young or entry level to the industry with little to no experience and have a false sense of confidence. They typically want to be the boss or retain a title without gaining any practical knowledge or experience. What they are missing is the fact that the best workboat crews are the ones where everyone helps out wherever they can. This starts with the captain down to the cook.
Most cadets that come on our boat roll there eyes and sigh when you ask them to help paint the boat. Theirs something fundamentally wrong with this response if they plan on coming to work on a boat after school.
I had a captain at Hornbeck that would come out and chip rust after his watch. I would never in my wildest dreams expect a captain to chip or paint but seeing him do it made me want to work harder and be like him when i got off the deck. Beat captain i ever worked for.
The one who hides out in his/her room or plays video games on their phone all day in the workshop while you are busting your hump but then complains loudly and abundantly when the OT is cut is exactly that kind of special snowflake I think of when I hear sense of entitlement.
The first thing that comes to mind is a Congressional parasite on the golf course with a lobbyist accusing welfare recipients of being parasites.
[QUOTE=Bayrunner;160287]I hear that a symptom of this feeling of entitlement is a large ring on one’s finger.
And that should get this thread going good![/QUOTE]
Although ring knockers do seem genetically predisposed to getting this disease, it is not exclusive to them. People in the same job for long periods tend to think that they can’t be replaced. People who are suddenly making more money than they used to somehow think they are better or smarter than everyone else. All of these people are susceptible to this disease.
[QUOTE=Saltgrain;160289]Sense of entitlement is when you believe you should be given things you haven’t earned. Like respect or being excused from menial tasks[/QUOTE]
Earned Respect ? Everyone deserves to be treated with respect, if for no other reason than we are human ! Then of course the higher your ranking on the vessel, the more respect you should be treated with ! Try this, call a licensed journeyman / master plumber or electrician to your home to clean, mow your lawn, and paint your house. Tell them you will pay thier normal labor charge, then post back how many of those tradesman actually show up to your home. I say none will, most will probably hang the phone up ! That is not only disrespectful, but also degrading as we’ll as rude. Entry level guys do the menial tasks, that should be a given. However operational level and management level officers, should be given some leeway. Every mariner should know vessel rank structure, and the rank structure should be clear. “What they are missing is the fact that the best workboat crews are the ones where everyone helps out wherever they can.” Professional crews also maintain rank structure ! In other words, it should never be tolerated to have an able seamen scold a licensed officer ! If an engineer were to prioritize engine room maintenance over assisting with will say " receiving groceries" then that is not for a not licensed person to question ! There usually are those that like to paint, great let them paint. Does not mean everyone has to paint ! It has been said GOM companies are sending the coordinators out to the vessels for a week or so. Why are they allowed to skate by sitting in the wheel house talking story to the captain? Is the vessel crew there to serve the coordinator ? Why not put them to work hand them a toilet brush, chipping and painting, wiping down the bilges, cleaning up the leaking mud pumps cause some GOM engineer cannot change the packing with the correct size packing, or grease them cause the zirk fitting is either inaccessible, inoperable, or missing. Bow them up 12hrs per day, how they going to know what it like if they don’t get dirty. How a coordinator going to get the full picture unless they have to paint with rags because even though the crew ordered supplies months ago the supplies are not there. Or using paper towels for racors…Wanna see a sense of entitlement, watch the coordinator’s reaction. I mean if “What they are missing is the fact that the best workboat crews are the ones where everyone helps out wherever they can.” Then why don’t the work boat captain’s prove it by putting the coordinator to work ? I mean no one is above toilet scrubbing, painting, wiping down…" Sense of entitlement is when you believe you should be given things you haven’t earned " . Like respect or being excused from menial tasks " Oh when you tell the coordinator to scrub toilets don’t hold back talk to the coordinator as though he were a knew hired ordinary seamen with zero days at sea. Don’t crawfish now and say that the crew coordinator has earned respect because he is the coordinator ! You stated before no one from the captain on down has earned respect, or is excused from menial task. As for the captain coming out to paint with the crew, that is admiral and respected. Why ? Because a captain should not be expected to do those task, and a crew that shows respect to a captain or other licensed officer is the crew that should see the licensed officers pitching in. Not because they have too either, but rather out of mutual respect. At least that is how it should work.
[QUOTE=acesouthcoast;160291]I had a captain at Hornbeck that would come out and chip rust after his watch. I would never in my wildest dreams expect a captain to chip or paint but seeing him do it made me want to work harder and be like him when i got off the deck. Beat captain i ever worked for.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but was he lead 2nd Captain or relief 5th Captain?
As captain, and mate, I help paint and splice. No question. Even if only an hour or two once in a while, I am not that busy or lazy.
Entitlement means someone who feels they “deserve” their position, promotions, or opportunities more than the next guy. Earning opportunities is one thing but expecting them is another.
Example is deckhand who says he will be a pilot, but is the last one on watch, hasn’t upgraded a license, and takes zero initiative in his job.
Another example is the guy who “deserves” to get a training mate’s job but won’t get his license upgrade until it happens…therefore never going to happen.
We break an entitled cadet in the first day or two, if needed. No eye rolling will be tolerated, or you can go home. The company (and crew) is doing you a favor. We have had some great ones.
If you’re so excellent, why the hell aren’t you captain? That’s my response to “entitlement.”
[QUOTE=z-drive;160320]
Entitlement means someone who feels they “deserve” their position, promotions, or opportunities more than the next guy. Earning opportunities is one thing but expecting them is another.
Example is deckhand who says he will be a pilot, but is the last one on watch, hasn’t upgraded a license, and takes zero initiative in his job.
Another example is the guy who “deserves” to get a training mate’s job but won’t get his license upgrade until it happens…therefore never going to happen.
[/QUOTE]
"Entitlement means someone who feels they “deserve” their position, promotions, or opportunities more than the next guy. Earning opportunities is one thing but expecting them is another. “
Some people really have earned thier way, paid thier dues…Other people got mom & dad to pay thier way through an academy. Or got someone else to pay thier way, and hold thier hand throughoutthe process. There are also those who are better at the job than others. I do not believe, applying one self or having confidence in one self is a sense of entitlement. If you truly are good at what you do, and possibly even rise above others then that hard work should not go unnoticed.
” Example is deckhand who says he will be a pilot, but is the last one on watch, hasn’t upgraded a license, and takes zero initiative in his job.
Another example is the guy who “deserves” to get a training mate’s job but won’t get his license upgrade until it happens…therefore never going to happen "
I do agree with those statements though
Also I add, a leader should know thier people. I don’t just mean you know thier kids and spouses names…I mean on the job you know what everyone’s strength, weaknesses, are. Then by utilizing those to the benefit of the vessel / crew you not only motivate but also inspire. What if the captain’s and chief’s evaluation was a reflection of how many mariners were run off thier vessel ? How many mariners they were able to develope. Most people can recall a place that they worked where they felt a personal desire to excel, and a place where they have worked where they felt a personal desire to we’ll just not be there. If your a captain or a chief which kind of atmosphere have you created on your vessel ? That should be in the captain’s / chief’s evaluation.
Would it be fair to say that a captain / chief who has created an atmosphere where mariners felt a personal desire to we’ll just not be there. Have a higher number of turnover than other vessels? Those same captains / chief who have created this atmosphere where mariners felt a personal desire to we’ll just not be there. Blame the high turn over rate on " sense of entitlement "
The economic effects of high turn over and loss of productivity due to those kind of atmospheres, has been studied. It costs quite a bit of money ! Wonder why companies would continue to retain those kind of piss poor captains / chiefs.
Not even close buddy. He was captain on one of there biggest tug and barge units. 7 thousand hp tug with a 140000 bbl black oil barge that we had to tow around. The guy worked new york for 30 years and could handle the boat very well.
This is a really long response but i don’t really understand the bottom line or main point you’re trying to achieve. Its ok for an officer to paint if they feel inclined and don’t think that the chain of command is being compromised by this. You sit at anchor for a week and the needle gun starts to look like fun.
[QUOTE=acesouthcoast;160324] Its ok for an officer to paint if they feel inclined and don’t think that the chain of command is being compromised by this. [/QUOTE]
I guess you did not read the whole response or at least the last part that reads " As for the captain coming out to paint with the crew, that is admiral and respected. Why ? Because a captain should not be expected to do those task, and a crew that shows respect to a captain or other licensed officer is the crew that should see the licensed officers pitching in. Not because they have too either, but rather out of mutual respect. At least that is how it should work."
I have seen unlicensed tell a licensed officer to get out on deck and help with chipping / painting ? In those situations, the chain of command will be compromised if the officer follows the unlicensed orders.
Not a sense of entitlement for a licensed person to expect an unlicensed to be reprimand for that kind of insubordinate conduct. Point of the long post, more than one. One of which, don’t hire a chief engineer to paint the boat, and don’t hire a captain to change the oil in the main engine.
Man what the fuuugg are you talking about?
Go to work, do your job well and shut the hell up. Respect will come naturally if you follow these simple rules.
Every captain should I do all the time and I’m a “ring knocker” respect is earned not given!
[QUOTE=pwrmariner;160318]Earned Respect ? Everyone deserves to be treated with respect, if for no other reason than we are human ! Then of course the higher your ranking on the vessel, the more respect you should be treated with ! Try this, call a licensed journeyman / master plumber or electrician to your home to clean, mow your lawn, and paint your house. Tell them you will pay thier normal labor charge, then post back how many of those tradesman actually show up to your home. I say none will, most will probably hang the phone up ! That is not only disrespectful, but also degrading as we’ll as rude. Entry level guys do the menial tasks, that should be a given. However operational level and management level officers, should be given some leeway. Every mariner should know vessel rank structure, and the rank structure should be clear. “What they are missing is the fact that the best workboat crews are the ones where everyone helps out wherever they can.” Professional crews also maintain rank structure ! In other words, it should never be tolerated to have an able seamen scold a licensed officer ! If an engineer were to prioritize engine room maintenance over assisting with will say " receiving groceries" then that is not for a not licensed person to question ! There usually are those that like to paint, great let them paint. Does not mean everyone has to paint ! It has been said GOM companies are sending the coordinators out to the vessels for a week or so. Why are they allowed to skate by sitting in the wheel house talking story to the captain? Is the vessel crew there to serve the coordinator ? Why not put them to work hand them a toilet brush, chipping and painting, wiping down the bilges, cleaning up the leaking mud pumps cause some GOM engineer cannot change the packing with the correct size packing, or grease them cause the zirk fitting is either inaccessible, inoperable, or missing. Bow them up 12hrs per day, how they going to know what it like if they don’t get dirty. How a coordinator going to get the full picture unless they have to paint with rags because even though the crew ordered supplies months ago the supplies are not there. Or using paper towels for racors…Wanna see a sense of entitlement, watch the coordinator’s reaction. I mean if “What they are missing is the fact that the best workboat crews are the ones where everyone helps out wherever they can.” Then why don’t the work boat captain’s prove it by putting the coordinator to work ? I mean no one is above toilet scrubbing, painting, wiping down…" Sense of entitlement is when you believe you should be given things you haven’t earned " . Like respect or being excused from menial tasks " Oh when you tell the coordinator to scrub toilets don’t hold back talk to the coordinator as though he were a knew hired ordinary seamen with zero days at sea. Don’t crawfish now and say that the crew coordinator has earned respect because he is the coordinator ! You stated before no one from the captain on down has earned respect, or is excused from menial task. As for the captain coming out to paint with the crew, that is admiral and respected. Why ? Because a captain should not be expected to do those task, and a crew that shows respect to a captain or other licensed officer is the crew that should see the licensed officers pitching in. Not because they have too either, but rather out of mutual respect. At least that is how it should work.[/QUOTE]
My point was that the OS doesn’t come on and think he should run the boat. Or a newly minted captain shouldn’t expect to waltz in and run over every one. You yourself give examples of respect being different at different ranks.
There is a difference between being civil and respecting a human and the chain of command and experience related respect I was referring too.
[QUOTE=Saltgrain;160332]My point was that the OS doesn’t come on and think he should run the boat. Or a newly minted captain shouldn’t expect to waltz in and run over every one. You yourself give examples of respect being different at different ranks.
There is a difference between being civil and respecting a human and the chain of command and experience related respect I was referring too.[/QUOTE]
Agreed . Just wanted to get the thoughts of other mariners. Thank you for your input