[QUOTE=Johnny Canal;131054]Familiarity breeds contempt.
30-45 seconds of this guy is great, but would it seem so great for 12hrs a day?![/QUOTE]
CONTEMPT! How can you have contempt for a man “who’s beard alone has experienced more than a lesser man’s entire body”? I should be so lucky for my beard to have lived such wonderment! I’ll take the “Most Interesting Man in the World” for unlimited hours over some cretin from Thibodeaux any day!
[QUOTE=Johnny Canal;131045]At the very least, if 4 guys are standing 12 hour bridge/DP watches, shouldn’t 2 guys be on the 12-12 shift and 2 on the 6-6 shift?
At least one guy will be 6 hrs fresher than the other. Do many 4 mate boats work this way? They don’t where I work, and the concept seems lost on them.[/QUOTE] Or. 4 guys 12 hr. each watches fresh guy every 6 hrs.
[QUOTE=sailcapt;131062]Or. 4 guys 12 hr. each watches fresh guy every 6 hrs.[/QUOTE]oops…
[QUOTE=Johnny Canal;131046]Seriously? Totally dead?
Tell that to the thousands of mariners employed by MMP, MEBA, SIU, SUP, MFOW, OSG, ATC, Polar, AMHS, AMO, Crowley, just to name a few.
US shipping is not relevant on a global scale, I agree. However, that is because US manufacturing is barely relevant.
You are off the mark by at least a ship length.[/QUOTE]
Youre not looking at it on the global stage…sure its relevant to the guys shipping lol. Now look into the percentage share the US has on shipping vs what was out share 50yrs ago. The drop is mind boggling. DOA.
AS for the watches…Id much rather have 0000-1200 or 1200-0000 than even consider 1800-0600 lol. Never really heard any body on an OSV complain too much about our watch structure and Ive never really felt that after 11 hrs, I couldnt make it through one more…thats just me. The only time honestly a 12 hr watch felt overwhelming was taking an osv inland along the ICW…I can understand why the tug guys dont pull 12 hrs.
[QUOTE=rigdvr;131080]
AS for the watches…Id much rather have 0000-1200 or 1200-0000 than even consider 1800-0600 lol. Never really heard any body on an OSV complain too much about our watch structure and Ive never really felt that after 11 hrs, I couldnt make it through one more…thats just me. The only time honestly a 12 hr watch felt overwhelming was taking an osv inland along the ICW…I can understand why the tug guys dont pull 12 hrs.[/QUOTE]
I don’t think many guys complain about working the 12 hour watches either but various studies claim that most marine related accidents happen after the officer being on watch past 8 hours. But you know how studies and survey work, you can make them say whatever you want if you know what you’re doing. I know that after a super hectic day I’m burned out by 5-6 pm, or 8-9 hours, and that’s in an office, behind a computer, etc… and not handling a $35MM piece of equipment, next to a $400MM rig, with numerous peoples lives and well being at risk.
I just think by having a rested officer come on the bridge every 6 hours it breaks up the normal routine where people may get too relaxed. Now it may not work in reality but sounds great on paper.
One guy 6-12 , another 12-6, and the others 9-3 , and 3-9 Would make for the most alert bridge crew. No one on over 6 hours, backed up by a guy that has only been on for three hours.
What are the tugs in BC doing now? They use to have two mates that stood 6 and 6 with the master floating. I have done that a few times instead of 4 and 8, and it worked really well. Of course I was floating.
If I had to work 6/6 I would never sleep. As master you are sometimes required to stay up and take care if business, add that to the coffee intake and we have a very tired bunch … By the way, with two in the bridge you should be swapping out every hour, no one should be on the sticks all watch, if you were you might as well get the AB up there with you
On Norwegian PSV’s the watches is split in the Captain’s watch and the Chief Officer watch.
Captain + a 1st Officer 06:00-12:00 18:00-24:00.
Chief Officer + a 1st Officer 00:00-06:00 12:00-18:00.
And if the vessel has a deck cadet 08:00-20:00
This way no one has command of the DP for more than 6 hours a watch. And if the vessel is steaming from base to the field the watches is split 1st Officer + a lookout from 00:00-04:00 Chief Officer + a lookout from 04:00-08:00.
That way all bridge crew are getting at least 8 hours rest one or two times a week.
I can say with experience that a 6/6 schedule out right sux and is downright dangerous. You never get an appropriate amount sleep with this schedule.
Any other schedule not using either noon or midnight as a base point for the crew goes over like a fart in a space suit when drills come up.
It is hard enough getting them to try new things (newbies), willingly participate, and pay attention, then you want to cut into their sleep time?
The so-called Swedish system (three man) is based on sleep research.
0000-0600 Second mate
0600-1000 Chief Mate
1000-1200 Second mate
1200-1400 third mate
1400-1800 Chief mate
1800-2400 third mate
There are variations of this.
[QUOTE=Emerald Shellback;131153]I can say with experience that a 6/6 schedule out right sux and is downright dangerous. You never get an appropriate amount sleep with this schedule.
Any other schedule not using either noon or midnight as a base point for the crew goes over like a fart in a space suit when drills come up.
It is hard enough getting them to try new things (newbies), willingly participate, and pay attention, then you want to cut into their sleep time?[/QUOTE]
I agree 6-6 sucks ass, but I don’t won’t to be stuck in the DP chair 12 hours straight. At least with the 6-6 you got the possibility to split the night watch when you’re not on DP.
KC,
That looks interesting. Have you ever seen or heard it was used?
I have seen 06-14 + 14-22 + 22-06. The crew kept it for about 5 years and it worked for that boat, in port & underway.
6/6 blows. I don’t think I have EVER slept the same since.
[QUOTE=Kraken;131140]On Norwegian PSV’s the watches is split in the Captain’s watch and the Chief Officer watch.
Captain + a 1st Officer 06:00-12:00 18:00-24:00.
Chief Officer + a 1st Officer 00:00-06:00 12:00-18:00.
And if the vessel has a deck cadet 08:00-20:00
This way no one has command of the DP for more than 6 hours a watch. And if the vessel is steaming from base to the field the watches is split 1st Officer + a lookout from 00:00-04:00 Chief Officer + a lookout from 04:00-08:00.
That way all bridge crew are getting at least 8 hours rest one or two times a week.[/QUOTE]
In Norge, what is a 1st officer?
Most of us in America would consider the Chief Mate to be the 1st Officer. Here we would expect a ship to have a Captain, and a Chief Mate, and then depending upon size perhaps a 2nd Mate, and one or more 3rd Mates.
And I thought it was Captain Captain, 2nd Captain, 3rd Captain, 4th Captain, Trainee Captain and Observer Captain…
[QUOTE=+A465B;131168]KC,
That looks interesting. Have you ever seen or heard it was used?
I have seen 06-14 + 14-22 + 22-06. The crew kept it for about 5 years and it worked for that boat, in port & underway.
6/6 blows. I don’t think I have EVER slept the same since.[/QUOTE]
Never tried it. The other variation is the 2nd mate goes 00-06 the c/mate from 06-08 then the 2nd mate finishes his day with 08-10. Then he has 14 hrs off.
It seems right to me because if I have to be up during the night I have a short cat nap then get up a go back at it till I run out of steam.
why on earth do not people ever run this rotation 4/4/8/8?..I have and it is wonderful
A] 1200-1600
B] 1600-2000
A] 2000-0400
B] 0400-1200
or you can reverse it
A] 0000-0400
B] 0400-0800
A] 0800-1600
B] 1600-2400
or get crazy and run this
A] 1000-1800
B] 1800-0200
A] 0200-0600
B] 0600-1000
or this
A] 0200-1000
B] 1000-1400
A] 1400-1800
B] 1800-0200
the possibilities are almost endless!
[QUOTE=tugsailor;131170]In Norge, what is a 1st officer?
Most of us in America would consider the Chief Mate to be the 1st Officer. Here we would expect a ship to have a Captain, and a Chief Mate, and then depending upon size perhaps a 2nd Mate, and one or more 3rd Mates.[/QUOTE]
Captain = Top dog
Chief Officer = Chief mate
1st Officer/Navigational Officer (Captains watch)= 2nd mate
1st Officer/Safety Officer (Chief Officer watch) = 3rd mate
Deck cadet = Coffee brewer
[QUOTE=c.captain;131181]why on earth do not people ever run this rotation 4/4/8/8?..I have and it is wonderful
A] 1200-1600
B] 1600-2000
A] 2000-0400
B] 0400-1200
or you can reverse it
A] 0000-0400
B] 0400-0800
A] 0800-1600
B] 1600-2400
or get crazy and run this
A] 1000-1800
B] 1800-0200
A] 0200-0600
B] 0600-1000
or this
A] 0200-1000
B] 1000-1400
A] 1400-1800
B] 1800-0200
the possibilities are almost endless![/QUOTE]
Its the best watch schedule ever. We did it on my harbor tug and everyone loved it. You always had plenty of sleep. Im on a towboat now and we are doing 6/6, its straight murder.
[QUOTE=c.captain;131181]why on earth do not people ever run this rotation 4/4/8/8?..I have and it is wonderful
A] 1200-1600
B] 1600-2000
A] 2000-0400
B] 0400-1200
or you can reverse it
A] 0000-0400
B] 0400-0800
A] 0800-1600
B] 1600-2400
or get crazy and run this
A] 1000-1800
B] 1800-0200
A] 0200-0600
B] 0600-1000
or this
A] 0200-1000
B] 1000-1400
A] 1400-1800
B] 1800-0200
the possibilities are almost endless![/QUOTE]
I’ve never even heard of that before but I love it!
[QUOTE=c.captain;131181]why on earth do not people ever run this rotation 4/4/8/8?..I have and it is wonderful
A] 1200-1600
B] 1600-2000
A] 2000-0400
B] 0400-1200
or you can reverse it
A] 0000-0400
B] 0400-0800
A] 0800-1600
B] 1600-2400
or get crazy and run this
A] 1000-1800
B] 1800-0200
A] 0200-0600
B] 0600-1000
or this
A] 0200-1000
B] 1000-1400
A] 1400-1800
B] 1800-0200
the possibilities are almost endless![/QUOTE]
Worked that schedule on a coastal steamer and it was wonderful. I wish someone could make a study on the best possible watch schedule on a OSV.