NPR's story on the US shipbuilding boom this morning

not bad except for that EFFING BOOB named William Gray they interviewed who wanted to piss all over a very positive parade for the United States of America. He obviously believes that US coastwise ships should be built in Korea!

[B]A Boom In Oil Is A Boon For U.S. Shipbuilding Industry[/B]

by Jackie Northam March 14, 2014 3:25 AM

Scott Clapham peers down into a cavernous dry dock at the Aker Philadelphia Shipyard. He points to massive pieces of steel, some covered with a light dusting of snow. When assembled, they will form a 115,000-ton oil tanker.

It’s one of two oil tankers being constructed for SeaRiver Maritime, a subsidiary of Exxon Mobil, costing $200 million apiece. It takes roughly 1,000 workers more than a year to build, and the shipyard already has orders for four more tankers and two container ships, says Clapham, the senior vice president of Aker Philadelphia. He says orders for large vessels have shot up in the past year.

“We’ve seen, since 2013, just a steady increase in demand for the ships, both here in Philadelphia and other shipyards across the country,” Clapham says.

The energy boom in the U.S. is having a knock-on effect on the country’s shipbuilding industry. Matthew Paxton, president of the Shipbuilders Council of America, says there is a relative boom in the construction of larger vessels at major shipyards across the country, especially oil tankers. He says three years ago, the tanker market wasn’t even on the screen, but shale formations in North Dakota and Texas have changed that.

“All this oil is coming down to the Gulf Coast and we’re going to need to move that oil around the United States to refiners,” he says.

There are more than 15 oil tankers, along with hundreds of smaller tugs and barges, on order at U.S. shipyards across the country, according to the American Maritime Partnership. But it will take months, if not years, to build them.

In the meantime, the domestic energy supply is booming, yet oil companies cannot bring in foreign ships to help move the oil and gas around the country thanks to a 1920s federal law called the Jones Act. Tom Allegretti, the chairman of the American Maritime Partnership, says under the Jones Act, you can only move cargo between two ports in the U.S. under certain conditions.

“You need to do that on a vessel that is flagged under U.S. law, that is crewed by American citizens and that is built in a U.S. shipyard,” Allegretti says. He says the Jones Act helps create jobs and keeps U.S. waterways in the hands of Americans.

But others say the Jones Act is pure protectionism for shipbuilders and unions. William Gray, an expert and consultant in shipbuilding, operations and regulations, says a lack of competition means the U.S. shipbuilders became less efficient and not as technologically advanced as builders in other parts of the world.

After A Downturn, Global Shipping Bets Big On Everything “The designing of ships and the engines for ships and the equipment for ships; the United States was not very good at figuring out how to do that,” Gray says.

Gray says shipbuilding in the U.S. has declined dramatically since World War II, and that there are only a handful of major shipyards now. A good percentage of those vessels being built are ordered by the Navy. Gray says the industry cannot keep up with the demand for merchant ships at an affordable price.

“We have very few of these shipyards that we used to have that made the larger ships: tankers, bulk carriers and container ships,” he says. He says the cost is about three times as much as you find in shipyards in China, Japan and South Korea.

Aker Philadelphia Shipyard’s Clapham agrees the Jones Act allows U.S. builders to capitalize on the surge in domestic oil and gas. He says without that federal law, ships would more likely be built overseas.

“The Jones Act, with its requirement to be built in the U.S., greatly helps support the manufacturing facility that you see here,” he says.

But until more tankers come on line, energy companies may have to rely more on rail, pipeline and road to transport the glut of domestic oil and gas.

WHAT THE FUCK WAS HIS FUCKING POINT? WHO THE FUCK IS THIS CLOWN ANYWAY? WHAT THE FUCK QUALIFIES HIM TO BE REFERRED TO AS AN EXPERT? THE MAN IS AN IDIOT AND NOT WORTHY OF THE VALUABLE AIR HE CONSUMES!

Gray’s words are hard to swallow, I admit, but he’s also right. I have been preaching for years now that American shipbuilding is the biggest obstruction to a popular and productive Jones Act. I’m not saying we have to throw out that part of the act, although that would probably make a lot of American shipping companies and their mariners happy, but if our shipyards had to compete internationally in order to stay afloat then we would see great efficiency, decreased costs, and a stronger U.S. Merchant Marine. $200 million for a single ship? That’s not an accomplishment, it’s an EMBARRASSMENT. Our shipbuilding is the laughing stock of the entire maritime world. I’m not saying the quality is any worse than anyone else’s, it probably isn’t, but the fact that we pay dozens, if not hundreds, of times more for ships than anyone else does only serves to demonstrate the feebleness of the United States Maritime Industry.

I don’t blame the politicians in Puerto Rico and Hawaii for disliking the Jones Act one bit. I don’t agree with them, we do need a strong Jones Act, but I don’t blame them either. Why should they have to pay so much for goods that come from the mainland? Shipping always adds cost, like any other middle man, but does that cost need to be so high? NO. It doesn’t. Our shipyards need to wake up and smell the 21st century. They need to streamline, cut down waste, prune the bushes, and get to work. There is no reason that the United States cannot be the single strongest shipbuilding power in the world. Korea should be coming to US to build ships, not the other way around. Our folly is all by the backwardness of our domestic shipbuilding industry and but for the Jones Act it would simply shrivel up and die. Instead, it just shrivels up and lays in its bed, on life support.

This recent shipbuilding boom is nothing but an apparition of success. Growth, yes, growth is good and American shipbuilding is experiencing growth right now. The trouble is that the game hasn’t changed at all. What we’re seeing now is the same cycle of boom and bust that this industry has seen many times over since World War II. Sure, there is more petroleum production now than ever before, and that has contributed to the recent excitement, but that is not a lasting platform for the acceleration of growth in our industry. Once we have built a dozen or so new tankers to meet the needs of the petroleum industry the growth cycle will level off and we will return to the old template of retiring a few ships a year, and replacing them with even fewer new-builds. Real long-term growth would be to see our domestic shipbuilding industry more competitive over time so that companies WANT to build ships here rather than HAVING TO because of federal law. Right now the only ships that are built in the United States are the bare minimum, the ones that absolutely MUST be built to comply with law. Anything else that a company wants is built overseas and used strictly in the foreign trade. Well, I ask you, why can’t those American companies build ships here and use them in the foreign trade? Only the shipyards can answer that question, and the answer isn’t a pretty one.

did a search to see if I could find out anything about this BOZO and using his name turns up NOTHING!

all there is is this guy who is not even involved in commercial shipbuilding

Bill Gray

Nuclear Chief Test Engineer at Puget Sound Naval Shipyard

if it is the same CLOWN, he is not in any way qualified to be consider an expert and I am appalled that NPR would go to such a NOBODY to comment on something he is so far removed from. Interview Tim Colton if you want an expert on US commercial and naval shipbuilding…he is the most knowledgeable man anywhere you can ever hope to find to have well based insight into this critical industry!

FUCKING NPR…I’MMA SENDING THEM AN EXPLODING POINTY STICK TODAY!

Did anyone catch the maritime executive magazine interview on the Colbert Report? It was painful to watch… They blatantly trashed the American maritime industry and messages like that contribute directly to things like the anti-Jones Act frenzy we just experienced in New Jersey a few weeks ago. Welcome to the world of the Main-Steam Media: “Reporting the news even when it’s factually incorrect because it just sounds so gosh-darn good to our audience!” :smiley:

The Colbert Report is considered real news??

It is now. More and more people are turning to the informative comic relief of the Colbert Report and the Daily Show just to get away from the propaganda of CNN, MSNBC, et al. Comedy Central isn’t much better in the propaganda area but the fact still remains: they are a primary news source for millions of Americans, whether anybody likes it or not.

[QUOTE=PaddyWest2012;132887]It is now. More and more people are turning to the informative comic relief of the Colbert Report and the Daily Show just to get away from the propaganda of CNN, MSNBC, et al. Comedy Central isn’t much better in the propaganda area but the fact still remains: they are a primary news source for millions of Americans, whether anybody likes it or not.[/QUOTE]

I find Fox and MSNBC to be funnier than Comedy Central !

[QUOTE=PaddyWest2012;132887]It is now. More and more people are turning to the informative comic relief of the Colbert Report and the Daily Show just to get away from the propaganda of CNN, MSNBC, et al. Comedy Central isn’t much better in the propaganda area but the fact still remains: they are a primary news source for millions of Americans, whether anybody likes it or not.[/QUOTE]

How did you manage to leave FOX news out of the list of propaganda spreaders?

[QUOTE=PaddyWest2012;132867]Gray’s words are hard to swallow, I admit, but he’s also right. I have been preaching for years now that American shipbuilding is the biggest obstruction to a popular and productive Jones Act. I’m not saying we have to throw out rt of the act, although that would probably make a lot of American shipping companies and their mariners happy, but if our shipyards had to compete internationally in order to stay afloat then we would s ee great efficiency, decreased costs, and a stronger U.S. Merchant Marine. $200 million for a single ship? That’s not an accomplishment, it’s an EMBARRASSMENT. Our shipbuilding is the laughing stock of the entire maritime world. I’m not saying the quality is any worse than anyone else’s, it probably isn’t, but the fact that we pay dozens, if not hundreds, of times more for ships than anyone else does only serves to demonstrate the feebleness of the United States Maritime Industry.

I don’t blame the politicians in Puerto Rico and Hawaii for disliking the Jones Act one bit. I don’t agree with them, we do need a strong Jones Act, but I don’t blame them either. Why should they have to pay so much for goods that come from the mainland? Shipping always adds cost, like any other middle man, but does that cost need to be so high? NO. It doesn’t. Our shipyards need to wake up and smell the 21st century. They need to streamline, cut down waste, prune the bushes, and get to work. There is no reason that the United States cannot be the single strongest shipbuilding power in the world. Korea should be coming to US to build ships, not the other way around. Our folly is all by the backwardness of our domestic shipbuilding industry and but for the Jones Act it would simply shrivel up and die. Instead, it just shrivels up and lays in its bed, on life support.

This recent shipbuilding boom is nothing but an apparition of success. Growth, yes, growth is good and American shipbuilding is experiencing growth right now. The trouble is that the game hasn’t changed at all. What we’re seeing now is the same cycle of boom and bust that this industry has seen many times over since World War II. Sure, there is more petroleum production now than ever before, and that has contributed to the recent excitement, but that is not a lasting platform for the acceleration of growth in our industry. Once we have built a dozen or so new tankers to meet the needs of the petroleum industry the growth cycle will level off and we will return to the old template of retiring a few ships a year, and replacing them with even fewer new-builds. Real long-term growth would be to see our domestic shipbuilding industry more competitive over time so that companies WANT to build ships here rather than HAVING TO because of federal law. Right now the only ships that are built in the United States are the bare minimum, the ones that absolutely MUST be built to comply with law. Anything else that a company wants is built overseas and used strictly in the foreign trade. Well, I ask you, why can’t those American companies build ships here and use them in the foreign trade? Only the shipyards can answer that question, and the answer isn’t a pretty one.[/QUOTE]

How many US flag from the start ships have been built in either Japan or Korea after the US Lines econ class container ships were built at a Daewoo yard? I can only think of one. Only US drilling contractors are building overseas, and they certainly arent building in Japan.

we’re having a hard enough time competing against foreign mariners in our own backyard. While I would like too see something done to alleviate problems for shippers, tinkering with the jones act is a slippery slope that might lead to wang chung and taco air fyling usa domestically and us being replaced by STCW credentialed filipinos and mexicans with work visas.

the owners of the pumpkin patch and the smurf fleet will still be rakin it in while they pay for cheaper labor.

and we’ll be hanging out at Home Depot trying to get hired for somebody’s yardwork.

the US flag is never really going to grow that much, and yes I generally agree on the point that the only ships being built here are done so out of legal obligation.

US shipbuilding will remain irrelevant until a steady stream of foreign operators WANT to build here. US yards will never be able to compete against a billion plus discount labor force of the PRC, unless the US govt is willing to subsidize our yards.

We spent $78 billion in 2011 or 2012 on EBT and SNAP (or possibly just EBT), but yet how much went to US shipyards for an endeavour that actually creates jobs and a payback in taxes and will also help our global image as a manufacturer of large-scale durable industrial goods.

US shipbuilding (just as you said) will rise and fall with the construction of jones act trade vessels for the forseeable future. I would wager that after the next round of tankers, hawaii, and puerto rico trade ships get built, no US flag operator will need to build another US hull for 15-20 years.

The big builders will be dependent on USN and USCG contracts.

without a big chunk of uncle sam cash behind them, US yards will continue to stumble along.

Amen, brother.

I think you’ll find that I did not list every single news network in existence. I mentioned the two examples that happened to pop into my mind first and carried on with “et al.” to include the rest. The fact that you’re fixated on Fox is somewhat revealing about your preconceived notions in the area of television propaganda. Are MSNBC and CNN less propaganda because Fox fell into the “et al.” category, rather than getting a mention of it’s own?

[QUOTE=PaddyWest2012;132911]I think you’ll find that I did not list every single news network in existence. I mentioned the two examples that happened to pop into my mind first and carried on with “et al.” to include the rest. The fact that you’re fixated on Fox is somewhat revealing about your preconceived notions in the area of television propaganda. Are MSNBC and CNN less propaganda because Fox fell into the “et al.” category, rather than getting a mention of it’s own?[/QUOTE]

No, not fixated. Even as a fairly consistent republican voter (even though they are no better than democrats), it’s blatantly obvious which way Fox and MSNBC fall. Neither even bother leaning anymore.

It was just a joke; yes, I saw your etc reference. The two I mentioned jump to the forefront of bias.

I realize this especially now that I’m in the oil patch and so many guys I work with think Bill O’Reilly is Christ returned to Earth (and the LSU tigers his disciples) and Obama is literally a Muslim Lucifer.

I’m not positive but I believe at my current employer changing the mess hall TV from Fox news to another news station is grounds for immediate termination and forfeiture of all company 401k contributions.

[QUOTE=Johnny Canal;132905]How many US flag from the start ships have been built in either Japan or Korea after the US Lines econ class container ships were built at a Daewoo yard? I can only think of one. Only US drilling contractors are building overseas, and they certainly arent building in Japan.[/QUOTE]

Off the top of my head Liberty Maritime is the company you are referring to (US flag from the start foreign built ships) when they used Section 615 of the Merchant Marine Act to build a number of ships in Korea.

NBC containerships?

[QUOTE=Chief Seadog;132939]Off the top of my head Liberty Maritime is the company you are referring to (US flag from the start foreign built ships) when they used Section 615 of the Merchant Marine Act to build a number of ships in Korea.[/QUOTE]

When were those built?

Ship I was referring to was Overseas Joyce built in Japan 87.

      • Updated - - -

[QUOTE=+A465B;132944]NBC containerships?[/QUOTE]

WHO???

[QUOTE=Johnny Canal;132945]When were those built?

Ship I was referring to was Overseas Joyce built in Japan 87.

      • Updated - - -[/QUOTE]

Bulkers:
M/V Liberty Glory delivered 2001, built by Oshima Shipbuilding Co., Japan
M/V Liberty Grace delivered 2001, built by Oshima Shipbuilding Co., Japan
M/V Liberty Eagle delivered 2004, built by Oshima Shipbuilding Co., Japan

Believe the M/V Liberty Pride delivered 2009, built by Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering, Korea M/V Liberty Promise delivered 2010, built by Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering, Korea may have been reflagged upon delivery and therefore not necessarily US flag from the start foreign built ships.

Are those Jones Act? I thought they just brought stuff overseas, not between US ports.

No they are not Jones Act qualified ships. The ships listed had to do with the post relating to US flag from the start foreign built ships.

They arent much better these days. They are to statist RINOs what PMSNBC is to progressive commies.

[QUOTE=Chief Seadog;132970]No they are not Jones Act qualified ships. The ships listed had to do with the post relating to US flag from the start foreign built ships.[/QUOTE]

Not sure those were US from start; will have to dig deeper.

i thought you were referencing original liberty bulkers. Don’t know anything about them.