Need advice

Professional Mariner Forum
1

OK hive mind, I have a rather delicate situation here.

I won’t give the vessel or company.

I will preface by saying that this isca CHENG I both respect and personally like.

However I suspect strongly that he may well be suffering from alzhiemer’s or some other form of dementia.

I’ve noticed a number of disturbing signs, but it came to a head when the wiper was asking questions.

Nothing major, the wiper was just curious and trying to learn more of the plant.

The C/E became highly agitated, jumped to his feet, advanced on the wiper in a highly aggressive manner, and then assumed what can only be described as a fighting stance.

He then proceeded you yell, “this isn’t question and answer!”

He then gestured toward the 1st and shouted , “I’ve known this man, this guy…” he then looked at the first confused, and continued, “I’ve known him for…” and trailed off

He then looked around the room and said, “yes”

I will add that this CHENG iscwell into his 80’s.

Anyway, I’m just looking for advice from the collective wisdom here.

2

I can only speak with my background: non-union company , about 70 mariners in total employed, owner/ operator situation, all hiring/ firing done by port captain/port engineer.

You’ve had history with the individual, so if you think dementia is at play, at that age it is.

The big problem here IMO is blowback on the wiper for reporting the chief. So, if possible I would strive to keep their name out of it. Sometimes that’s not possible.

In my position as head of the vessel ops department, if this had been reported me I would first send a confidential email to all captains who have worked with the chief, asking them if they had heard of other similar situations with them, and if they thought the chief was competent.

If the answer was negative—that the chief was slipping— I would refer the situation to my opposite number, the port engineer. He would, at our company, gently tell the chief he was done here. I would the same.

If the captains did not report any negative situations I would then call the assistants the chief had sailed with and ask them. A touchy subject. I don’t like polling junior officers on their senior officer’s performance. But this would be one of the few cases where it would be warranted.

If several assistants reported similar behavior I would do the same as if several captains had reported the same behavior.

However, if no one else but the one wiper reported it then it’s time for talking with the chief. Which may be difficult, because in early dementia people will have good days and bad, and you may talk with them on a good day.

But usually by the time you investigate, several others will have noticed the behavior change.

And in somewhat analogous situations when I have confronted employees with health issues something like this it turns out that they welcomed it. They welcomed someone telling them that they had to move on. They were stuck in a groove and needed someone to push them out of it.

However, if talking with the chief disclosed no evidence of dementia, and no one else could corroborate it, I would also investigate the person who reported the incident if they were new to the company. It would not be the first time a new crew member was a villain trying to torpedo someone’s career.

I would avoid having a medical diagnosis made.

The legal issues around dismissing a senior officer can be overblown. When I’ve had to do it the cause for termination, if pressed, is that the officer no longer has the full trust of the company. In my state (WA) that’s enough.

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3

What is a man “well into his 80s” doing still working on a ship/boat, or anywhere else in a marine environment?
He would be qualified to be in Wasington DC, working in the the White House.
Heck, he could even be President!!!

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4

I realize this is said in jest, but it reminds me of what I sometimes feel I have to tell employees:

In business all that matters is profit and loss. Justice and tangential value don’t come into it.

Is the employee more likely to increase profit or increase loss? That’s the bottom line of employment.

Whereas with presidents (of either party) they are now tribal chiefs as much as administrators, and the tendency is to back your tribe to the hilt, because your tribe is better than the other.

Two completely different bases for considering senior staff.

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5

I can only advise you after you have had to keep a carving knife under you pillow.
Once you have reached that stage, I can offer some personal advice.

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6

The man has to love his job more than doing other things. From what I observed, most times, engineering jobs keeps the mind & body in great shape if done correctly. I used to think about retirement all the time. But once I made a financial plan for it & the pieces started to fall into to place for it to happen, I started to love my job a lot more. Hopefully that 80 yr old ch/eng is only working 3-5 months a year.

As for the supposed unfortunate incident. What freighterman1 said from the top. From the bottom, don’t depend on the rumor mill to fix it. If the company has a legitimate DPA or a tip line to call & the wiper should report it. It might blow back on the wiper but if the accusations are true then it ain’t going to end good for the wiper or anyone else if not properly caught.

7

Why is it on the wiper? Didn’t @DavidMT witness the incident himself?

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8

I did

And the matter is being handled.

Thank you for your imput

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9

The way I read it was as a report from the wiper to the captain. I apparently crossed that up.

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10

getting sued hits the bottom line

11

True. Every company has to decide what will be more costly, vessel lost or mechanical damage with ensuing loss of service, or a possible discrimination lawsuit.

In the USA one of the variables involved in avoiding lawsuits is the state the action is brought in. In my state, WA, an employer needs no reason to fire an employee.

The employee in turn can sue for discrimination for several defined bases, one of which is age. But in my familiarity with legal precedents in my state a plaintiff in a case like this would have an uphill battle.

Most trial lawyers IMO would avoid the case. No big payoff.

But in a different state it may be completely different.

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12

Because you didn’t need the job.

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