I have worked with Norwegian-Americans that were trained in Norway. Mostly good guys, but a couple of bad apples. My impression is that the Norwegian smaller vessel training is much better than ours. I don’t know about very large ship training, but I expect its about the same as ours. I don’t believe that STCW raised standards in the US or Norway.
The last time I talked to a Transport Canada Inspector, he was of the opinion that STCW had dragged Canadian standards down.
STCW is MINIMUM standard. It only drag the overall standard down if you do not add anything over and above that.
@tugsailor already described to you the differences in wording.
Claiming a license that doesn’t require ANY STCW KSAs be met, either through approved classes or onboard assessments, is “based on STCW” is ludicrous.
You are a few posts behind. We got on to something else. (See posts from 103 onwards)
The Maritime Education and Licensing system in USA and most other countries are different. Taking short courses piecemeal as required for Domestic Licenses and STCW certification is not common in the rest of the world. STCW standard apply for all, except maybe for inland waters.(Rivers, Canals and Lakes) and for smaller Fishing Vessels.
In some countries Special licenses applies for Yachts, but large Yachts and Fishing Vessels will mostly require the same licenses as other vessels, based on tonnage and trade.
The more common Maritime Education system is to attend schools (or “academies” in your terms) for the require Nautical Education to STCW standard, or above.
Since there are few jobs available as “Ratings” in most developed countries, a system of “Apprenticeship” or as “Cadets” are established to earn seatime as required to obtain the first license.
Additional short courses and training, depending on requirement for the type of vessel and trade each individual wants to pursue are available from private and public institutions.
Many of those are mandatory and need to be repeated at prescribed intervals. (This also apply for US Domestic licenses, I believe?)
I read all the posts before commenting.
That’s definitely a problem in a system where companies are allowed to hire inexpensive foreign labor.
Yes, just like the American Owners, most Shipowners in other high cost country register their ship where they can hire qualified crews cheaper.
The difference is that some Owners take on apprentices and cadets to to ensure a future supply of qualified Officers. For ships under national flag the Maritime Authorities can mandate that a certain number of such positions be made available.
Even the hard pressed Offshore Vessel Owners are taking on apprentices and cadets.
Maritime professionals will still be needed, even if some ships become crewless. It’s called future planning.
I started as an OS in those “oil and mineral” days, 1978. I was one of the good ones which meant I worked on uninspected supply boats and “flew solo” on my wheel watches. Most of the captains had 300 ton licenses but a few had no license whatsoever. One particular captain had a radar endorsement which got him 500 tons. He thought he was badass.
Later, when I got my AB ticket, I worked on the Moon Tide. Those guys had 1,000 Ton freight and towing licenses.
Seems like this is what we have been talking about in a recent thread
I never sailed on the SUN TIDE or MOON TIDE, But I worked off the same dock as one of them (not in the Gulf). It was run by Capt. Ed from NY; I later sailed with him at a different company. These were impressive boats. Back in those days 1000 GRT was the breakpoint for an unlimited license.
I also use to see the BIEHL TRADER or BIEHL TRAVELER around. They were owned by the US branch of a Dutch company, something like 1200 GRT, and therefore they were fully crewed with unlimited license guys.
The boat itself was pretty cool, but I didn’t like it much. After being the de facto mate on uninspected vessels, the Moon Tide had us in the role of chambermaid peons. Years later, during a summer break from school, I was again briefly assigned to it. It wasn’t any better.
But you can get a Mate OSV Unlimited?
“Mate (OSV) of Self-Propelled Vessels Not Including Auxiliary Sail of Unlimited Tonnage
Upon Near Coastal Waters (Or Upon Oceans -As appropriate).” Quoted from the USCG Checklist.
§ 11.497 the cfr doesnt mention anything about tonnage, and the STCW reference is 500GT or more.
So you would go from unlimited tonnage, trade restricted to limited tonnage, trade restricted?
Or have things changed since the original thread?
All OSV licenses are restricted to at most 10,000 GT, regardless of whether they mention tonnage or not, by the fact that the definition of an OSV requires them to be under 10,000 GT.
It’s not what STCW says alone. It’s what our regulations implementing STCW say. And testing is for the national endorsement (license) not STCW. STCW is not relevant to testing.
See 46 CFR 11.910. There is stuff on the Master OSV exam that is not on the Master 1,600 exam. In part, this is because there is no test to go from Master OSV Less Than 1,600 GRT/3,000 GT to Master OSV for over 1,600 GRT/3,000 GT. If some were allowed, it’s probably in the past and because they were eligible for the grandfathering that ended on March 24, 2019 (applications submitted before that date could be valid for testing under the old rules for one year fater approval. So it;s possible that some who submitted applications before March 24, 2019 are styill being tested undewr the old rules.
