The above is a tribute to the power of the right wing neo-fascist propaganda machine. The cruelest irony is that the staunchest supporters of this latest version of 1930s Europe and Japan are those who stand to lose the most and have already lost access to the “American Dream” of their fathers.
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A few foreign owners? Does BAE still run some US yards? KeppelAMFELS, Philly. . .
Three of the four yards that build large commercial vessels in the US is foreign owned and all are dependent on foreign designs, machinery and other main equipment.
Here is an article in The Hill from 2016:
https://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/transportation/282455-are-jones-act-ships-really-made-in-the-usa-well-sort-of
PS> Since then Keppel Amfels has got into the commercial shipping market as well.
Their conclusion:
Excellent response and educational facts.
Correct!
Another fact everyone misses. Land is expensive on an island(PR & Hawaii). Containers come off a ship, go directly on to street chassis’ and parked in terminal a couple hours at most. A truck takes it directly to a retail store, NOT a warehouse! There are no Warehouses in Hawaii to store anything. SHIPS are floating warehouses that control a retail stores inventory.
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I’m not sure how your reply and his comment go together. He was talking about a one time (per vessel) 5 year Jones act waiver to allow a company to reflag an existing ship and run it in a Jones act market to test the economic viability. Then, if the business model looks like it will work they would build a new vessel in America.
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“… ship users can all buy the best-made products at the best prices …”
Those are two different things.
China builds some real crap and does crap quality work. But hey, its’ cheap! Thus, the best price.
I’m not adamantly opposed to the concept, but lets look at “everything” and not just the Jones Act and shipping. You see, when people start looking around and seeing where we can employ foreigners and use foreign equipment, the issue starts getting close to home, eh? Why stop at the maritime industry?
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That billboard is a joke. A good, conniving lie needs some sort of skill behind it at least, but that is not even a good lie. Our little Tweety Bird Grabow meanwhile resorts to lame memes and Khrushchev style propaganda online like a hormonal teenager. Dog cunts like Cato are only able to operate within the confines of the uninformed and yes, this is our problem. We are unknown. This is where they hit us.
People may say Cato are shrewd tricksters, but it doesn’t take much to sway the stupid. I am worried in general, but this Gato connivery is so weak, people like Grabow should be fired for their laziness. You got all those disgusting amounts of money and that is all you can do with it? WEAK!
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China are able to build quality ships, with the latest and best of machinery and equipment to Owners that is willing to pay for it. They can also build low quality ships at cheap prices if that is what is wanted.
What they don’t do is building low quality ships at ridiculously high prices.
They haven’t become among the top shipbuilders in the world by competing on price only. Low quality can only bring you low quality customers. Have a look at who is ordering ships, rigs and specialised marine and oil field equipment from Chinese yards. It is not fly by night operators but major companies that know what they want and how to get it.
Like anywhere else, if you don’t have good design, detailed material and equipment specifications, capable and uncorruptible building supervision, the end result will not be the best.
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Being in the middle of the Pacific Ocean I have seen a wide variety of Chinese ships being ‘delivered’ to new owners while they stop in Honolulu for fuel in transit.
Trust me when I say, what I’ve seen are largely low quality work. Not just my opinion but the opinion of many masters on those very ships. I’ve heard the comment repeated more times than I care to remember by masters of other ships in transit thru Hawaii.
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Thrust me I have seen the low quality ships, boats and rigs built in China, as well as some very good quality ones as well.
I have also seen boats and rigs built at US yards that could not have passed muster anywhere else. One brand new rig in Argentina, but built in the US, developed cracks in main beams on the jacking structure. When gauged up we found welding rods used to fill up gaps between ill fitting beams and covered by weld, which had passed yard, class and owners rep inspection. But that was in the past, I hope that has changed now.
It used to be that some Owners ordered OSVs from Chinese yards based on cheapest price only, then leave supervision to under paid, under qualified and over worked local consultants. That was when the market was booming and anything that could float got work.
Not any more. When major operators order ships, boat or rigs in China today they make sure they get what they want and pay for.
Of course, if you want cheap, China can still build that too. My last job in China was at a small yard in Taizou to approve a self-propelled hopper barge for tow to the Middle East. It was crude and cheap, but good enough to carrying stones over short distances for a port project in UAE. Not suitable to sail there on her own though.
PS> This rig was build in China:
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Was that ‘self-promotional’ video suppose to impress me??
It doesn’t.
We could go round and round in circles. To no end. But one thing that hasn’t been mentioned is that both Chinese shipyards and Chinese shipowners have enjoyed billions of dollars of cash subsidies to remain afloat in recent years. Western shipyards and fleet owners have not. They tuff it out in the free market.
That’s the beauty of communism and Chinese pride. China will never allow themselves to lose face in a race against western nations. They’ll always throw money at their yards and fleets, even if losing money, to stay ahead (in the long run) of the west.
It’s what they’ve always done. It’s what they’ll continue to do. Nobody, anywhere, can compete against that.
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Sounds good on paper, but so far I haven’t seen a single chinese ship that was built to the same standards as one built in a US (or most western, for that matter) yard. At all. They have all been turds wrapped in a gift wrap and they seem to range from worse to the worst.
I actually just got off a chinese built ship. Looks alright on the outside until you dig deeper. I have sailed on american built ships from the 70’s that were far superior than the one I just got off of, which was only approaching 7 years. Getting any sort of maintenance done on it is like battling with a windmill. Reflagging these pieces of shit is a complete nightmare.
Sure, they all float and they do their job, depending on the quality of mariners doing work on them of course; question is, for how long.
If it is cheaper for companies to buy disposable shit and just buy new every few years, then that’s what it is, but let’s not pretend this garbage is of any worth long term.
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We have been down this road before. First it was Japan, then Korea and now China. Unfortunately if you order a vessel at a far cheaper price than a Korean or Japanese yard could build it for, do little research on the yard that builds it, fail to supervise the new build properly and don’t particularly care how easy the ship is to operate you will get nothing that you would be proud to sail in.
The Chinese do not intend to remain the bargain basement of industrial production and there are yards which will emerge to challenge the best of those operating anywhere.
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That’s the first I’ve heard of it.
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Oh we have been there and back. Many times over.
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To be truly quixotic you must “tilt” at those windmills. Just saying…
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I’m sure it is nice and comforting to think that because China used to produce low quality products, incl. ships, they will NEVER be able to do anything else.
China is just getting started to compete in the high tech market and high end shipbuilding, but they are making strides in both right now.
They are aiming to overtake Korea and Japan, both in mass producing simple ships at competitive prices and to build complex specialised vessels of high quality in competition with anybody.
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