[QUOTE=dsmith;36097]" Edit: That would mean the reason they are running inclinometers every day is because they are concerned about the whole well head collapsing & the zone flowing out of a crater about 30’ in diameter. At least it would get over sooner. "
Has this ever happened to a well on dry land?
Thanks alvis, your link to the wiki on BOP’s straightened me out.[/QUOTE]
That’s what I would be using the inclinometers for. To monitor movement of the BOP in particular.
(Note under normal drilling conditions, the BOP and WHD are always run with inclinometers/“bulls-eye’s”, so any movement can be monitored on a daily basis).
Will it fall over?.. a lot depends on how soft the seabed is around the wellhead and how much vibration is generated from the flowing oil???. I don’t see sea water currents being an issue as the ROV’s seem to be moving around easily.
Land wells are somewhat different in that the wellheads and BOPs are smaller and therefore a lot lighter. Land well BOP… perhaps around 30-40 tons. Subsea BOP 200+ tons and bigger and bulkier.
I believe the BOP link alvis posted showed diags of land BOP’s? Check them against the pictures from the ROV’s for a comparison.
[QUOTE=dsmith;36097]" Edit: That would mean the reason they are running inclinometers every day is because they are concerned about the whole well head collapsing & the zone flowing out of a crater about 30’ in diameter. At least it would get over sooner. "
Has this ever happened to a well on dry land?
Thanks alvis, your link to the wiki on BOP’s straightened me out.[/QUOTE]
If you’re interested in a 45 minute video answer, #2372 on page 95 will answer your question affirmatively.
So it was you that I saw in the movies when I was a youngster. You were the one with that big top hat![/QUOTE] I’m really not THAT old. But you guys are right. I highly doubt this ultramodern bohemoth would have an antique like a kelly on board.
[QUOTE=Alf;36096]A difficult one in my opinion. The BOP weighs over 200 tons, when it wants to move or sway it will do and the momentum is difficult to stop. The protective structures that surround the BOP would likely rip apart if something was attached to them in an attempt to hold the BOP. Applying tension from the top is the best method.
I have seen BOP’s gyrate around… the only real solution we had was to pull more tension and keep pouring cement around the base of the BOP, ie around the wellhead and gyration crater, and hope it soaked down enough to help. (50/50).
From the poor pics that I have seen, there is a crater around the WHD right now. , some of it may be from the earlier drilling of the top hole sections of the well, some maybe sand and rock debris coming up with the gushing oil and settling out. There also appeared to be a smaller gyration cone/crater around the WHD.
The weak points are likely to be the 36 & 28" casings and whether they can stand up to the gyrating loads and not fatigue fail. Also, the 18.3/4 WHD Housing will be under a lot of lateral strain.
A big factor in all this is temperature effects. Bottom of the hole is around 260F, seabed around 42F. With the high flowrate the BOP and casings are getting hotter. I believe they may have placed a temperature sensor down there the other day?[/QUOTE]
The normal procedure when running and landing the BOP is to set down the entire weight of the BOP. The LMRP and Riser are supported by the Tensioners and a 25% LMRP overpull is applied. Therefore the wellhead is supporting 200 metric ton. This is normal and if weather changes the LMRP can be disconnected leaving all the weight of the BOP on the WH. My experience suggests that all is well if BOP movement is less than 0.75 degrees.
Obviously, there is more movement from the Flex Joint, but 10 degrees is rather excessive.
The problem with latching on BP’s latest oil capture tool means that we always have to have weight set down on the ‘cut’ LMRP outlet. There are currents and some rig movement which may affect the weight set down. Therefore, there is constant flexing of the retrieval string. It may be that the ROVs are constantly checking inclination in order to provide information for best ‘capture’ and therefore the best seal.
On the other hand, if the BOP is swaying dramatically we could break the supporting casing with considerable potential for an increase in flow.
[QUOTE=alcor;36105]My experience suggests that all is well if BOP movement is less than 0.75 degrees.
Obviously, there is more movement from the Flex Joint, but 10 degrees is rather excessive.
Therefore, there is constant flexing of the retrieval string. It may be that the ROVs are constantly checking inclination in order to provide information for best ‘capture’ and therefore the best seal.
On the other hand, if the BOP is swaying dramatically we could break the supporting casing with considerable potential for an increase in flow.[/QUOTE]
I’ve seen them sway way way more than that.
I don’t have any spec to hand on the NL States Flex jt. The +/- 10 degrees is quoted from a Cameron flex jt manual.
I’m sure the ROV’s will be monitoring inclinations so the surface vessel can remain in the best position… but that BOP has at least a 5 degree lean on it (ref my earlier post to the other website http://www.doomers.us/forum2/index.p…8178.5730.html) There are some informative pictures and discussions showing angles beyond 1 degree.
Would bp drill it that way ie over 1 degree? Well given everything that we have seen here so far over the last month… probably yes. I know for a fact that their policies say differently.
It’s likely that the 5000ft of riser bent the wellhead/casings over when it fell to the seabed, or they fluidised the seabed around the well during the top-kill job, or its now moving/swaying due to vibration and squatting a top hat on it.
Very likely, it’s a combination of all of them… but it’s definately leaning.
[QUOTE=HellSD;36080]Looks to me like there is some kind of rectangular pattern evident in the right half of your second image. I don’t have a clue if it is the right scale to be a mud mat or if it is just an artifact of the image compression, but there’s definitely a rectangular crisscross there.
Also, wouldn’t a mud mat (or anything else) be pretty covered in mud/sediment by now? Seems like everything else is.[/QUOTE]
The person that posted the pics wants to argue symantecs. The fact is heavy mats to cover the mud around the well head are in fact mud mats. I don’t know if/ why they would be offended by the term unless they’re an attorney. That does not cange the fact mats have been laid around the well bore at the surface of the gulf. What you call/ describe them as is irrelevant. Why they are there is relevant. For anyone to defend that the flow rate has gone down or not increased from this well Or in any way to say the numbers were ever less than 20,000 BPD is absolutely ludicrous.
[QUOTE=company man 1;36072][QUOTE=Alf;36056] I’ve seen a lot of top drives with kellies on the floor. Of course that was back in the day when I rode my horse to the dock.[/QUOTE]
Seems to be becoming increasingly rare. We still have it on our list of things to check, but It has been a few years since I have seen a kelly on a deepwater semi or drillship. Every now & then I will spot an old kelly bushing laying around in the rig’s heavy tool store. Makes me realize how old I am getting when I ask an young AD or driller if they have a kelly onboard & they give me a blank look & then say they have heard that people used to drill with a kelly, but they have never actually seen it done. On the other hand, many of the land rigs we inspect have a kelly on hand as a backup in case their top drive fails.
There’s an interesting section in this article (there’s also a lot of BS)…
…"At the hearing, Amos was followed by David Rainey, BP America Inc.'s vice president for Gulf of Mexico exploration.
Rainey didn’t have anything to say about Montara, but he said releases from oil and gas are rare, and technology such as blowout preventers, new and improved well control techniques that maintain constant control of fluids in the well bore, sensors that monitor for sudden changes in well pressures [B]and a fiber optic network that allows BP officials in Houston to monitor well pressures in real time[COLOR=Black] [/B]have made drilling safer[/COLOR].
“[B]Any release of hydrocarbons from our operations into the environment is unacceptable[/B], and we continue to invest in research and technology to drive us to our ultimate goal of zero discharge,” Rainey testified. “While our intent is to prevent all accidental discharges, we conduct regular emergency drills with local, state and federal agencies. All of our production facilities have contingency plans that identify the procedures, response equipment and key personnel needed for responding to incidents.”
Again it is a news report… But these are words from a VP.
It’s just a pity he didn’t talk to the drilling guys.
Seems to be becoming increasingly rare. We still have it on our list of things to check, but It has been a few years since I have seen a kelly on a deepwater semi or drillship. Every now & then I will spot an old kelly bushing laying around in the rig’s heavy tool store. Makes me realize how old I am getting when I ask an young AD or driller if they have a kelly onboard & they give me a blank look & then say they have heard that people used to drill with a kelly, but they have never actually seen it done. On the other hand, many of the land rigs we inspect have a kelly on hand as a backup in case their top drive fails.[/QUOTE]
The quote…
[I][B]“I’ve seen a lot of top drives with kellies on the floor. Of course that was back in the day when I rode my horse to the dock.”[/B][/I]
… wasn’t mine… but never mind.
In my roughnecking days we used kellies, and spinning chains and… and… … I like to think now that the technology we have is safer and better despite the fact it’s getting more complex.
Last time I saw a kelly in use was about 4 years ago on a Croatian land rig op. I think they must have got a job lot from somewhere, including the crews…!
if I remember correctly… the horse that’s mentioned in the quote … looked more like a donkey… but I could be wrong.
[QUOTE=lfgd521rc;36085]For what it’s worth here is a link to NOAA’s position on Hurricanes and Oil Slicks. http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pdf/hurricanes_oil_factsheet.pdf[/QUOTE]
Well it’s nice to see NOAA’s stance that there will be no damage since the spill is tiny. Who wrote this, Tony himself? I don’t know, but it looks to me like this spill is becoming about as big as amedium size hurricane & growing, not counting the monsterous underwater plumes that don’t exist. Naturally the government has the real data locked away in a drawer for release about a week before the devastation occurs so political leaders will have time to position themselves & say they told us this could happen.
[QUOTE=Alf;36108]I’ve seen them sway way way more than that.
I don’t have any spec to hand on the NL States Flex jt. The +/- 10 degrees is quoted from a Cameron flex jt manual.
I’m sure the ROV’s will be monitoring inclinations so the surface vessel can remain in the best position… but that BOP has at least a 5 degree lean on it (ref my earlier post to the other website http://www.doomers.us/forum2/index.p…8178.5730.html) There are some informative pictures and discussions showing angles beyond 1 degree.
Would bp drill it that way ie over 1 degree? Well given everything that we have seen here so far over the last month… probably yes. I know for a fact that their policies say differently.
It’s likely that the 5000ft of riser bent the wellhead/casings over when it fell to the seabed, or they fluidised the seabed around the well during the top-kill job, or its now moving/swaying due to vibration and squatting a top hat on it.
Very likely, it’s a combination of all of them… but it’s definately leaning.[/QUOTE]
The fact that they have to set weight down to overcome the forces from the well means that there will be large angles created on the Flex Joint. It would be impossible to hold it steady. Normally, the Flex Joint is held in tension. This may well create a new flow path when the ball joint wears out due to the downward force/friction created by the movement.
No big surprises really.
With 3 rupture disks in the 16" rated at (correct me if I’m wrong…) 500-600psi based on a pressure value of ? over a baseline of…??
Well, they were pretty much guaranteed to put holes in your casing! The more you pump, the bigger the holes.
Yet strangely (no that’s a lie…) none of this was made readily available to the public from their crisis centre over the last weeks.
It’s just yet another example of this puppet amusing the crowds, and occasionally it farts with a bit of info…
but don’t tell the crowds out in front because… they are having fun…!