So, even as a mariner, you will get that same attitude. At one point in my life, I was a Chief Mate in Drilling, working in Nigeria, making just north of $300k and living in the USA, near Washington DC. I remember going out in DC and telling people what I did, and one person actually asked me if that was a nice way to say I work at a gas station. Even though I probably made more than 99% in that place, it still didn’t matter about perception. Don’t worry what people think abut your job, White Collar-Blue Collar is all BS anymore, plenty of my friends who are what was BC jobs make more than most of my MBA friends.
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Yeah I realize I will get that same attitude as a Mariner. Even in foreign country that has a much lower average standard of living, there are will be people that are “Strata Cinco/Seis” , and elites in that country that will think I am some weird guy even if I were an officer. Heck, even for normal people I will have to be smart about answering the “What is it you do” question.
Despite this I think it’s alot better to make $300k and have to answer that question rather than be making $85k and have to answer the same question. For that same reason, I’d rather jump through hoops with someone explaining I am a mariner making $80k in Mexico/Colombia/Brasil than be a Trucker making $85k in NJ and have to answer that question. With trucking there simply isn’t anything that differentiates drivers unlike with an AB and a 3rd mate and there aren’t any long-term prospects such as becoming a surveyor or whatever else. Best I could hope for is “managing a terminal” one day or moving up in the corporate side.
Furthermore the more I save right now, the closer I get to a point where capital gains from my portfolio becomes as important to wealth creation compared to the salary I earn from employment. Hypothetically if I waited ~1 or 2 years and saved a bit more this is more or less true. My idea is that the same concept of $80k income being worth 3x more overseas than in the States applies with capital gains. A dollar of capital gains overseas has 3x the purchasing power stateside. In this scenario my thought process was that going Union, getting a AB or Engine route within 1 year and making the same money would not be too crazy of an idea.
Those days are long gone though.
You’re heart is in the right place. As long as youre good to accept the lifestyle and that youre going to take a paycut for a while, go for it. The reality is that even if go to school and get a license, you won’t sail as an 3M immediately, so even with all that $$ invested in an education, you’re still looking at 4-5 years regardless to even getting close to that amount. Have you looked at Military Sealift Command? You can probably work as long as you want to, get training on them, and bank some money. Just be aware that youre trying to work in a sector of the industry (ocean going vessels) that is highly competitive and most likely shrinking. Maritime Academies aren’t shrinking enrollment, so there are a lot of people out there with big licenses that aren’t using them/can’t find jobs.
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Yea but that’s not my point though.
The way I see it if you can make $80k and live in a 2nd-world country. (Mexico,Colombia,Argentina,Thailand,Vietnam,Brasil,etc), it’s similar to making $200k or so in the US.
There are some flaws to this for sure. There are gringos roaming around these countries acting very arrogant and not realizing there are people with real money / elites in these countries that look down on them. To those people, $80k in your country is $80k in their country. Unlike in my earlier years I’ve learned to respect the locals, culture, whatever country you are in.
However in general, I think this is a reasonable / robust idea.
It is nice in theory, you just have to be realistic on the $$ and timeframe. Union is gonna take several years of being around the hall to build seniority/make good $$. If you wanna work in the industry it can pay some decent dividends, but you have to be fully committed and be prepared to play the really long game (10+yrs), but that is just my experience.
Thank you.
I don’t know much about “MSC” though I have seen the abbreviations thrown around here and there.
“Just be aware that youre trying to work in a sector of the industry (ocean going vessels) that is highly competitive and most likely shrinking.”
^Yeah I guess that is the big “X Factor” in alot of the decisions to make here. As an outsider it is really hard to understand / get a feel for this and there is especially when it is a big commitment. The more I sense the industry is “too competitive/crowded” “has worse long term prospects” the more I will lean towards going SIU route and set my sights on an AB or non-officer Engine role. Other adjustments I can make is being more patient and continuing to save up money for a bit longer to make the jump. It kind of sucks but its reasonable for me to wait 3-4 years to go to SIU.
Yea a guy in an unrelated discord cited seniority stuff and how his sister’s ex was laid off in 2008 because he had low seniority.
I’m actually Union myself at the moment and fortunately started off in a “Bid” run rather than being a “Casual or ExtraBoard”.
I was under the impression Union route had jobs abound everywhere, hah. Guys on youtube citied making $110k first year because he chose to be on boat 11 months. Maybe I’m wrong or industry has changed in ~5year span? I wonder if I could take up Truck Driving jobs here and there while I wait to build up seniority in times if there is no work.
Living overseas, especially in some of the countries you mentioned, is not as wonderful as you may think.
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Yeah good point, since this is basically why I want to make this whole change in the first place.
IDK that is what I have been craving for quite a bit of time. It’s definitely chancing it and a big life move for sure. “Grass is always greener” in some ways and I’m sure there will be aspects I regret it if do make the change.
I realize places like Argentina the government is absolutely a disaster. Colombia is slightly//definitely alot better but for sure still these countries all have problems.
Colombia, you need fluent Spanish skills for the most part. Great to visit, if you live there, definitely try and up your Spanish game before you go. I spent some time in Cali and Medellin. You should always visit, for an extended time, 4 weeks, before you decide to move.
Yea my Spanish isn’t perfect but I’ve improved alot over the past 2-3 years. Took some lessons online during covid. I’m at a low b1 level though my listening needs to get better. I don’t imagine I’d have too many problems learning the language if I ever lived there.
Two reference points regarding oceangoing ships…a really good buddy of mine graduated Cal Maritime in 2018, impeccable resume/worked on Bay Area all four years. Knew he wanted to go to Cal Maritime since he was 12years old, ie, he lives for this and knows exactly what he wants, and could not find anything oceangoing. He finally got a job in Jan of last year…working for MSC as an AB. Second reference, Mate I’ve been working with on a tug for the last year graduated from Kings Point 2016. Passionate mariner who also knew exactly what he wanted since he was a teenager was hoping to work on oceangoing as well but ended up on tugs in the Great Lakes, and then East Coast. Point being is that it is really hard. People will break through and I wouldn’t let that discourage you, but it seems like working in the maritime industry is just a means to an end for you, rather than this is what you REALLY wanna do. If that is the case, I wouldn’t go to school. I have mixed feelings about Union…when i joined IBU on the West Coast, they sure were diligent about taking my $$ but I found that the hall was a grind and rarely delivered. It seems to be cyclical, but the SIU board in the Bay Area was never very full and a lot of people sitting around… If I were you, I’d get your TWIC/MMC and try to get an OS job on a tug or ATB. Centerline is/was looking for an OS 3/3 for an ATB. Vane is/was too. You won’t have as much time off to travel, but at least youre getting paid, building seatime, and not sitting at a Union Hall. That or MSC if you want a longer rotation.
Or go and try and get into the Piney Point apprenticeship program:
a really good buddy of mine graduated Cal Maritime in 2018, impeccable resume/worked on Bay Area all four years. Knew he wanted to go to Cal Maritime since he was 12years old, ie, he lives for this and knows exactly what he wants, and could not find anything oceangoing. He finally got a job in Jan of last year…working for MSC as an AB. Second reference, Mate I’ve been working with on a tug for the last year graduated from Kings Point 2016. Passionate mariner who also knew exactly what he wanted since he was a teenager was hoping to work on oceangoing as well but ended up on tugs in the Great Lakes, and then East Coast.
-haha damn x2
but it seems like working in the maritime industry is just a means to an end for you, rather than this is what you wanna do. If that is the case, I wouldn’t go to school.
-truth
That is a great post, thank you. Clears up alot of the grey area. The last parts of the post I will have to do more research as I don’t know much about either option but generally feel like its advice that will serve me well. 
Yeah that has been #1 plan during my whole process // been my reference up to this point. Seems super solid // 1 year time frame to being an AB is something I could definitely handle.
It will give you a taste in the shortest amount of time, with out putting you in debt or extending your full outlook on the industry
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^ I’ll probably plan on that, as was the original plan. If it ends up not working out I can probably get in back with my company as we are on good terms or perhaps at another company. I’d lose my seniority but not a disaster and trucking is pretty robust job wise. 
Appears you are respected in your curent job. Do what you can do to get in to management. You apparently know the business, would that be too hard as opposed to changing careers and losing $$$. Look into what you can do to better yourself in your current industry. Maritime work treated me well, started at age 18/19. Good money did not come until my mid-twenties. I will also add I attended Nashville Auto-Diesel College on Gallatin Road in Tennessee prior to choosing to sail .Still a motorhead, it just did not work out then for a career choice. Perhaps that gives a clue as to why I have great respect for good engineers. I have half a brain what they go through.
One more thing to consider…as long as you’re a working US mariner, you’re going to have to pay US taxes. In some countries, you might have to pay in two countries. So if/and when you get there, you might actually have to run the numbers and see how much you’re saving by relocating to another country. Some bigger companies will pay for travel within the us, others wont, so airfare will likely be on you. When all is said and done, you might not actually be banking a significant difference. As a mariner, though, you can easily relocate to a low tax state like Wyoming or something, or not even have a permanent residence, just a PO Box. Regardless, sometimes the grass isn’t always greener…
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