[QUOTE=“jdcavo;111651”]You do not need time on a towing vessel to renew. 46 CFR 10.227(d)(8)(vi)(B) only specifies “:ongoing training and participation in drills.” It doesn’t say they have to be on a towing vessel.[/QUOTE]
That’s good to know. I was afraid I was going to lose my towing endorsement in a few years.
What no centifuges and fuel filters on a $68m vessel…really?
[QUOTE=tugmstr;111808]What no centifuges and fuel filters on a $68m vessel…really?[/QUOTE]
$68M? I thought the AIVIQ cost over $200M to build!
[QUOTE=c.captain;110269]everything looks wrong in the video. The wire looks small, there are no tow pins up, no chafe gear in place, the rig looks way too close and the wire almost appears to tightline in the second before it breaks. Why is the wire not leading downwards as it crosses the roller? I believe there is no surge gear at all in place, the rig was too close and the AIVIQ pulling too hard! POP GOES THE WEASEL![/QUOTE]
Tow pins should not be up.
Here is a link to video of the tow wire parting.
My general experience with wires parting, if the wire parts quickly it will “jump” as the energy stored as a result of being stretched out is released.On the other hand a wire can part over a relativity long period of time, several seconds or even minutes. If you’ve watched a wire part sometimes first a single strand parts. I assume that if a wire parts slowly it will have less energy stored and will just more or less go limp when the last strand finally lets go.
.If a shackle lets go I would think the line would jump. I would guess that a shackle would part after a few overloads would bend the pin.
Newill called the weather “moderate” on Dec. 27 and said everything seemed normal before a shackle failed and was lost at sea.
What about, McTaggart asked, the numerous alarms that morning from a Rolls Royce monitoring system that indicated too much tension on the tow line?
“Do you recall receiving these alarms while you were standing watch?” McTaggart asked.
No, Newill answered. “I’ve been asked this question before, and I still say my answer is I did not receive a tension alarm for the tow drum.”
Tension alarms had been going off frequently for a different piece of equipment, the starboard anchor drum, but that was due to a faulty sensor, Newill said. That equipment wasn’t even being used during the transit. Repair parts have been ordered from Norway, he said.
The alarms emit an ear-piercing sound and must be addressed with four steps, not like a snooze button on an alarm clock, he said.
“I attended to every alarm,” Newill said. “You can’t brush it off.”
Newill offered up his own piece of evidence, a video he said he shot on his phone earlier on the morning of the grounding to share with his wife later.
“If it pleases you guys, I did make videos from time to time,” he said.
McTaggart conferred with others on the panel and decided to allow the video, which had a time mark from Newill’s phone of 9:47 a.m. on Dec. 27, less than two hours before the tow line broke for the first time.
Newill narrated as his minute-long video played. Investigators also played a five-minute video from the closed-circuit television system of the Aiviq that captured the moment of the tow failure.
The “tensile strength overload” alarm was set to sound if the pull topped 300 tons – half the tow wire rating of 600 tons, Newill said.
His video showed the monitor flashing readings that showed the tow line tension fluctuating dramatically, from a low of 20-odd tons to a high of 227 tons. He contended the average was 100 tons, well within the equipment’s strength.
McTaggart said that still was a lot of fluctuation.
The other video didn’t show the console but provided a view of the Kulluk under tow. The seas were as others had described – giant swells but not fast hard waves. At the end, the Aiviq seems to ride way up, and then the line snaps and whips back.
Over reliance on the tension alarm in fast changing sea conditions?
[QUOTE=Kennebec Captain;115874]From ADN
Over reliance on the tension alarm in fast changing sea conditions?[/QUOTE]
We all know how reliable these alarms are. It sounds like they got used to the other False Alarms and missed the Real Alarm when it went off. I am sure that all of us have been in a situation where we are constantly getting False alarms, it gets to the point where you just hit the acknowledge button without even looking at what alarm is sounding because WE JUST KNOW THAT IT’S A FALSE ALARM and that is when we get bit in the Ass.
[QUOTE=Tugs;115882]We all know how reliable these alarms are. It sounds like they got used to the other False Alarms and missed the Real Alarm when it went off. I am sure that all of us have been in a situation where we are constantly getting False alarms, it gets to the point where you just hit the acknowledge button without even looking at what alarm is sounding because WE JUST KNOW THAT IT’S A FALSE ALARM and that is when we get bit in the Ass.[/QUOTE]
Speak for yourself; that’s not acceptable - just hitting a button like that. I did not read that above, if the mate was cognizant enough to even make a film before hand, and differentiated between alarms - knowing the meaning of each, he was doing what he should. I’m sure the panel had the alarm history and trends which led to the questioning. Or, better yet, they did not have anything (my opinion), by the line of questioning.
I only question - at this point - some of the quoted terms. (The “tensile strength overload” alarm) there is no such term on a winch. What were the settings? Was the output data accurate? How is this verified? Where you towing on the brake, or dynamic mode? The tension, was that from the motor pressure transducers or the load cell on the brake? Were they compared shortly after scoping wire? What immediate action is taken by the watch officer if there is a high tension alarm? Does this mean the tensile strength just overloaded as you describe what this alarm dictates? Why was the wire the consideration for setting the alarm set-points, why not the rigging, or designed weak-link? If you were getting alarms from a drum not in use, what was the alarm? Does that drum share common sub-systems with the one in use?
[QUOTE=“anchorman;115887”]What were the settings? Was the output data accurate? How is this verified? Where you towing on the brake, or dynamic mode? The tension, was that from the motor pressure transducers or the load cell on the brake? Were they compared shortly after scoping wire? What immediate action is taken by the watch officer if there is a high tension alarm? Does this mean the tensile strength just overloaded as you describe what this alarm dictates? Why was the wire the consideration for setting the alarm set-points, why not the rigging, or designed weak-link? If you were getting alarms from a drum not in use, what was the alarm? Does that drum share common sub-systems with the one in use?[/QUOTE]
I wish I could work on an anchor boat with you. You sound like an excellent person to learn that industry from.
Half the alarms didn’t work. General alarm only worked on half of the vessel…when word was given to have all hands ready on deck to launch life capsules if needed…alarms didn’t work…deck crew had to go door to door… just giving an example of things that didn’t work.
[QUOTE=alabamasugarbear;115894]Half the alarms didn’t work. General alarm only worked on half of the vessel…when word was given to have all hands ready on deck to launch life capsules if needed…alarms didn’t work…deck crew had to go door to door… just giving an example of things that didn’t work.[/QUOTE]
To have one little ounce of credibility, were you there first of all?
[QUOTE=“anchorman;115887”]
I only question - at this point - some of the quoted terms. (The “tensile strength overload” alarm) there is no such term on a winch. What were the settings? Was the output data accurate? How is this verified? Where you towing on the brake, or dynamic mode? The tension, was that from the motor pressure transducers or the load cell on the brake? Were they compared shortly after scoping wire? What immediate action is taken by the watch officer if there is a high tension alarm? Does this mean the tensile strength just overloaded as you describe what this alarm dictates? Why was the wire the consideration for setting the alarm set-points, why not the rigging, or designed weak-link? If you were getting alarms from a drum not in use, what was the alarm? Does that drum share common sub-systems with the one in use?[/QUOTE]
Do u honestly think there was anyone on the panel who had any experience towing let alone knew to ask those questions, let alone wanted to embarass Shell or Chouest? If the USCG wanted those answers that board would have had u or at least somebody with experience on it.
However, I guarantee that if u do a freedom of information request that SECTOR Anchorage personnel are getting medals for their response. Some may have even done something other than watch in horror from the hotel room command center as it went agroubd. FAIL!!! I will put a days pay on that.
[QUOTE=BMCSRetired;115897]Do u honestly think there was anyone on the panel who had any experience towing let alone knew to ask those questions, let alone wanted to embarass Shell or Chouest? If the USCG wanted those answers that board would have had u or at least somebody with experience on it.
However, I guarantee that if u do a freedom of information request that SECTOR Anchorage personnel are getting medals for their response. Some may have even done something other than watch in horror from the hotel room command center as it went agroubd. FAIL!!! I will put a days pay on that.[/QUOTE]
Do you really think by me posting those questions I was alluding to the fact that the UCSG should have asked them? Yeah right. That is basic stuff that the company would have asked - outside that dog and pony show hosted by the USCG.
[QUOTE=“anchorman;115898”]
Do you really think by me posting those questions I was alluding to the fact that the UCSG should have asked them? Yeah right. That is basic stuff that the company would have asked - outside that dog and pony show hosted by the USCG.[/QUOTE]
Do u think that I am alluding to the fact that u know more about this than the so-called experts and should have been asking those questions? I know those questions have been asked and answered in the white palace on the bayou. I am also sure YOU will get those answers but the USCG never will because they would not know whst to do with answers without somebody telling them.
They don’t want answers, they just someone to blame other than NOBLE, CHOUEST or SHELL. My guess is human error and not anyone in those three places, other than the Master.
What on earth do you mean when you say…?
[QUOTE=BMCSRetired;115904]My guess is human error and not anyone in those three places.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely the human error lay in each of them and in their people! Do you really think it was “bad juju, sun spots and space aliens”?
[QUOTE=c.captain;115905] Do you really think it was “bad juju, sun spots and space aliens”?[/QUOTE]
What else could it possibly be? There haven’t been any changes at CG headquarters or any of the companies involved so it has to be bad juju, sun sports or space aliens, right?
[QUOTE=“anchorman;115895”]
To have one little ounce of credibility, were you there first of all?[/QUOTE]
My old man was. So yes there is some creditable accounts. And its quite disturbing to say the least.
[QUOTE=c.captain;115905]What on earth do you mean when you say…?
Absolutely the human error lay in each of them and in their people! Do you really think it was “bad juju, sun spots and space aliens”?[/QUOTE]
No I think they will blame anyone but themselves or big business. If they could blame “bad juju, sun spots and space aliens”, or pfm (pure effing magic) they would. They r gonna pound it up the master onboard’s ass. Is that literal enough?
Who else do u think I was referring to?
I blame Obama
[QUOTE=“anchorman;115895”]
To have one little ounce of credibility, were you there first of all?[/QUOTE]
Were you there good sir?