# Local 333 to MM&P **URL:** \ **Category:** Professional Mariner Forum\ **Created:** [August 18, 2014, 6:03pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222 "2014-08-18T18:03:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![tugnutts28](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@tugnutts28](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/tugnutts28)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 6:03pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/1 "2014-08-18T18:03:54Z")
Does anyone have any good info on local 333 joining Masters, Mates and Pilots? What companies are included? I know reinauer and Moran but who else? How are the benefits with MM&P? What’s the medical like and how’s the pension work? I heard they’re starting a whole new division in MM&P not joining the inland or offshore group and any info would be appreciated. ---
**Author:** ![jrock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7cd45c/32.png) [@jrock](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/jrock)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 11:40am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/2 "2014-08-19T11:40:21Z")
[QUOTE=tugnutts28;142558]Does anyone have any good info on local 333 joining Masters, Mates and Pilots? What companies are included? I know reinauer and Moran but who else? How are the benefits with MM&P? What’s the medical like and how’s the pension work? I heard they’re starting a whole new division in MM&P not joining the inland or offshore group and any info would be appreciated.[/QUOTE] Sorry to here your still with 333. Why don’t they answer those questions for you. The best thing I’ve ever did was get far away from them. ---
**Author:** ![tugnutts28](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/db5fbb/32.png) [@tugnutts28](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/tugnutts28)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 12:03pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/3 "2014-08-19T12:03:48Z")
I was looking more for an insider opinion and if you were in 333 then you should know why I can’t get any good answers from them. ---
**Author:** ![NYBoatman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/41988e/32.png) [@NYBoatman](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/NYBoatman)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 1:55pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/4 "2014-08-19T13:55:10Z")
I thinks theres another thread on this ---
**Author:** ![yeahoner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ea666f/32.png) [@yeahoner](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/yeahoner)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 10:23am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/5 "2014-08-21T10:23:52Z")
> [@"tugnutts28"](#): > > I was looking more for an insider opinion and if you were in 333 then you should know why I can’t get any good answers from them. 333 essentially doesn’t exist any more ---
**Author:** ![NYBoatman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/41988e/32.png) [@NYBoatman](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/NYBoatman)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2014, 3:37pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/6 "2014-08-22T15:37:48Z")
[http://333andmmp.org](http://333andmmp.org) Check this out ---
**Author:** ![OBXmariner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d9b06d/32.png) [@OBXmariner](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/OBXmariner)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2014, 10:38pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/7 "2014-08-22T22:38:46Z")
Just received a text from Ron. It says to make my way on over to [333andMMP.org](http://333andMMP.org). Here we go! Anything is better than an organization named after a road in disrepair on S.I. ---
**Author:** ![anchorguy33](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c2a13f/32.png) [@anchorguy33](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/anchorguy33)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 8:03am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/8 "2014-08-25T08:03:59Z")
Staten Island Ferry guys lose in this deal we want out of 333 and no to MMP ---
**Author:** ![jrock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7cd45c/32.png) [@jrock](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/jrock)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 8:11am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/9 "2014-08-25T08:11:46Z")
[QUOTE=anchorguy33;142889]Staten Island Ferry guys lose in this deal we want out of 333 and no to MMP[/QUOTE] Why are they saying no to MMP? What other alternatives are there? ---
**Author:** ![NYBoatman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/41988e/32.png) [@NYBoatman](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/NYBoatman)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/10 "2014-08-25T14:58:10Z")
MMP is the best thing for 333. Hows that bad for the ferry guys? Maybe ferry guys should go DC-37 but then theres no more 32 hour/4 day work week. And no reduction pay. ---
**Author:** ![jrock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7cd45c/32.png) [@jrock](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/jrock)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:46pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/11 "2014-08-25T15:46:39Z")
[QUOTE=NYBoatman;142909]MMP is the best thing for 333. Hows that bad for the ferry guys? Maybe ferry guys should go DC-37 but then theres no more 32 hour/4 day work week. And no reduction pay.[/QUOTE] I agree with you boatman… I believe that would be a positive move for them. In my opinion, the 4 day workweek, and reduction days are a thing of the past. What the ferry guy’s have given up for that “four day work week” is ridiculous. They don’t get paid for it. No work no pay. The only benefit was “IF” you worked the fifth day it was time and a half. They work the City of NY and have to pay a separate rider, out of pocket for prescription medication. Ridiculous. The point is, the guy’s at DEP don’t, because there represented by DC 37. If I remember correctly, there was a Ferry guy a few year back who saw the “writing on the wall” and had all the Decertification petitions ready, risking his own neck, he even made the calls to the president of DC 37 Lilian Roberts, but the Ferry guys didn’t have any real “BALLS” for lack of a better term to sign or back him up. Bunch of Princesses. I strongly doubt if they have any real guts now. Sorry for them, they can keep there 46,000 dollar a year job, with a residency requirement. After your astronomically NYC rent cost, the $15.00 dollar a day Bridge Toll, out of pocket drug plan, and union dues, believe me you’ll be in the red. ---
**Author:** ![OBXmariner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d9b06d/32.png) [@OBXmariner](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/OBXmariner)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 9:59pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/12 "2014-08-25T21:59:20Z")
As for the other UMD Local 333 members a switch to a more powerful union sure wouldn’t be the worst thing that’s happened. Forcing members to go RTBU was a disgrace to the whole institution. ---
**Author:** ![yeahoner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ea666f/32.png) [@yeahoner](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/yeahoner)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 2:55am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/13 "2014-08-26T02:55:12Z")
I’m curious, it says we would all get mm&p books. Does that mean I could go bid for jobs at a union hall for a different division? ---
**Author:** ![NYBoatman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/41988e/32.png) [@NYBoatman](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/NYBoatman)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 6:47am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/14 "2014-08-26T06:47:29Z")
> [@"yeahoner"](#): > > I’m curious, it says we would all get mm&p books. Does that mean I could go bid for jobs at a union hall for a different division? Yes u can jump divisions. If your up on all your dues. As for the guys working in 333 companies who never paid dues or initiation when 333 becomes a division of MMP they will have to rejoin. Paying initiation at the MMP price. Which is alot more then 333 initiation. And then there going to have to pay dues, which is good. ---
**Author:** ![tugsailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@tugsailor](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/tugsailor)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 8:07am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/15 "2014-08-26T08:07:25Z")
[QUOTE=NYBoatman;142950]Yes u can jump divisions. If your up on all your dues. As for the guys working in 333 companies who never paid dues or initiation when 333 becomes a division of MMP they will have to rejoin. Paying initiation at the MMP price. Which is alot more then 333 initiation. And then there going to have to pay dues, which is good.[/QUOTE] That is too bad. It would be much better if MMP was one union where everyone had the same opportunities and similar compensation (depending on their credentials). Instead MMP is a deep sea union, with its name on a redheaded stepchild joke of union, MMP Inland. Now MMP seems posited to add 333 as another lowly paid bastard child that they never let into the house. ---
**Author:** ![z-drive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c37758/32.png) [@z-drive](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/z-drive)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 11:25am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/16 "2014-08-26T11:25:56Z")
Regardless it’s still a hell of a lot better of a deal than staying with 333. The guys at Weeks seem to have made out pretty well so far. In this case at least they will have access to more union benefits than they ever would have with the old regime. I don’t see why they need separate divisions either, but unfortunately sometimes you have to choose between the lesser of two evils. Love 333 or hate it, it played a big roll in the industry wide wage increases in 2005-2012 ---
**Author:** ![50thState](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/a6a055/32.png) [@50thState](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/50thState)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/17 "2014-08-26T18:53:03Z")
[QUOTE=yeahoner;142941]I’m curious, it says we would all get mm&p books. Does that mean I could go bid for jobs at a union hall for a different division?[/QUOTE] Not a chance. No way they’re going to let you walk into the real MMP hall and take a job off the board. It’s just like tugsailor said, you’ll be like the current United Inland Group guys out on the West Coast, separate and not equal. ---
**Author:** ![LeakyBrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@LeakyBrain](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/LeakyBrain)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 9:37pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/18 "2014-08-26T21:37:19Z")
[QUOTE=50thState;142984]Not a chance. No way they’re going to let you walk into the real MMP hall and take a job off the board. It’s just like tugsailor said, you’ll be like the current United Inland Group guys out on the West Coast, separate and not equal.[/QUOTE] I’m an A book in the Offshore Division. Everybody gets a square deal, if you have an unlimited 3rd mate (or higher) license you can join, even right off the street. There isn’t a shortage of jobs either. Everybody, even Applicants new to the union can get 180 days of employment and with vacation 300+ days of pay every year. June, July, and December ALWAYS have plenty of open jobs, even Applicants can 120 day jobs on good contracts. If you have the license you can join the Offshore Division, just go to an Offshore Hall and say you want to, it isn’t complicated. If you show up during Christmastime and especially during summer there will be good paying jobs available to you. Get the license, show up, and work hard and you will be successful. Everybody gets a square deal, even the few knuckleheads we have get a fair deal and make a good living. If you don’t have the license, go do what it takes to get it, and then show up and work hard, and you will be successful. If you don’t want to go through the effort to get the license, or can’t be bothered to show up, . . . . well then you won’t find the solution to your problems on internet forums. ---
**Author:** ![tugsailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@tugsailor](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/tugsailor)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 11:39pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/19 "2014-08-26T23:39:49Z")
There are plenty of tugboat captains and mates that hold third mate or second mate. I have not met a lot of chief mates or unlimited masters on tugs, but I have seen a few. If a guy has been paying dues to 333 for years and then the membership of 333 votes to merge 333 into MMP, and then the guy becomes a dues paying member of MMP, the guy should be treated as a real member of MMP with all the rights and obligations that any other member has. He should not be treated like some guy that just walked in off the street to join. The MMP reminds me of the story of Animal Farm: “all pigs are equal, but some pigs are more equal than other pigs.” - - - Updated - - - There are plenty of tugboat captains and mates that hold third mate or second mate. I have not met a lot of chief mates or unlimited masters on tugs, but I have seen a few. If a guy has been paying dues to 333 for years and then the membership of 333 votes to merge 333 into MMP, and then the guy becomes a dues paying member of MMP, the guy should be treated as a real member of MMP with all the rights and obligations that any other member has. He should not be treated like some guy that just walked in off the street to join. The MMP reminds me of the story of Animal Farm: “all pigs are equal, but some pigs are more equal than other pigs.” ---
**Author:** ![z-drive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c37758/32.png) [@z-drive](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/z-drive)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2014, 11:58pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222/20 "2014-08-26T23:58:47Z")
[QUOTE=tugsailor;142992] If a guy has been paying dues to 333 for years and then the membership of 333 votes to merge 333 into MMP, and then the guy becomes a dues paying member of MMP, the guy should be treated as a real member of MMP with all the rights and obligations that any other member has. He should not be treated like some guy that just walked in off the street to join. [/QUOTE] I agree, I don’t see why it even needs to be a different whole division. I hear they’re going to be keeping a bunch of the 333 bozo’s too. [Next page](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/local-333-to-mm-p/13222.md?page=2)