# LA/LB logjam **URL:** \ **Category:** Professional Mariner Forum\ **Created:** [December 6, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601 "2021-12-06T13:10:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/1 "2021-12-06T13:10:13Z")
A new way of counting to a hundred does not help solve the logjam off LA/LB: > **[New Counting Method Suggests U.S. Ship Logjam Is Longer Than Ever](https://gcaptain.com/new-counting-method-suggests-u-s-ship-logjam-longer-than-ever/?subscriber=true&goal=0_f50174ef03-cff8f63958-169863069&mc_cid=cff8f63958&mc_eid=4674ba0fbe)** > > By Brendan Murray (Bloomberg) — The number of container ships headed for the busiest U.S. port complex has risen to close to 100 under a new counting method, underscoring the magnitude... But it move the problem further way. Out of sight = out of people’s mind (and news): > **[Ships in California logjam now stuck off Mexico, Taiwan and Japan](https://www.freightwaves.com/news/ships-in-california-logjam-are-now-stuck-off-mexico-taiwan-and-japan)** > > Despite claims to the contrary, the ship backlog is not getting smaller. Vessels are waiting on both sides of the Pacific. It also doesn’t help that Chinese ports increase volume of trade, incl. export to USA: > **[China posts 22pc rise in total port volume in first 10 months](https://www.seanews.com.tr/china-posts-22pc-rise-in-total-port-volume-in-first-10-months/191812/)** > > CHINA's total foreign trade cargo volume in the first 10 months of 2021 increased 22 Shanghai saw the largest amount of container throughput throughout this time, handling a total of 34.8 million TEU, a year-on-year increase of 9.9 per cent. But at least the cost of shipping containers from Asia to US is falling: > **[Transpacific Container Rates Fall to Lowest Since July](https://gcaptain.com/transpacific-container-rates-fall-to-lowest-since-july/)** > > By Brendan Murray (Bloomberg) — Ocean freight rates on goods shipped to both major U.S. coasts from Asia fell to the lowest levels since July, reflecting an easing of supply strains... ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 4:56pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/2 "2021-12-07T16:56:11Z")
Maybe if the different players talk to each other things will b e better?: > **[US port envoy ‘fostering real-time conversations’ to improve operations at LA...](https://splash247.com/us-port-envoy-fostering-real-time-conversations-to-improve-operations-at-la-and-long-beach/)** > > In a recent interview on Odd Lots, a Bloomberg podcast, the White House port envoy John Porcari described the Biden administration’s approach to tackling congestion at the San Pedro Bay ports. Communication and collaboration are at the heart of the... ---
**Author:** ![jimrr](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/jimrr/32/38358_2.png) [@jimrr](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/jimrr)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2021, 6:05pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/3 "2021-12-09T18:05:52Z")
I think it’s engineered for political reasons, which i come here to generally avoid!!! ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2021, 10:10am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/4 "2021-12-14T10:10:18Z")
The LA/LB logjam is now affecting 101 ships , spread across the Pacific, along the West coast of America and into Mexico: > **[101 ships spread across 1,000 miles waiting for berth space at LA and Long...](https://splash247.com/101-ships-spread-across-1000-miles-waiting-for-berth-space-at-la-and-long-beach/)** > > Out of sight, yet growing day by day, the number of containerships straddling the Pacific shoreline waiting for berths to open up at Los Angeles and Long Beach is now in excess of 100. Spread out across 1,000 miles of North American coastline,... But at least the surfers are speared the ugly sight of container ships when they paddle out and wait to catch the next wave… ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2021, 10:14am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/5 "2021-12-15T10:14:46Z")
Not only LA/LB have problems with ships waiting on berth: > **[Port Klang and Piraeus join Ningbo and LA at the top of the congestion charts...](https://splash247.com/port-klang-and-piraeus-join-ningbo-and-la-at-the-top-of-the-congestion-charts/)** > > To familiar congestion names Shanghai, Ningbo, Los Angeles and Long Beach, other ports such as Piraeus and Port Klang can now be added. The global container port congestion crisis that has racked supply chains all year is shifting to new hot spots... Situation in some major ports around the world: ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/gcaptain_maritime_forum/original/3X/1/9/19a1a57eb71cba1fef6ad550e80218cfc945cf35.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Saltine1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Saltine1](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Saltine1)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2021, 2:34pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/6 "2021-12-15T14:34:36Z")
Situation isn’t going to get any better anytime soon. While a large focus is on the port itself most people don’t take into count everything else going into the problem due to COVID delays. New equipment to help with backlog have long lead times, not enough trucks and truck drivers in the market, the end receiver or distribution center is short staffed and can’t turn around cargo fast enough, labor shortages everywhere, delays and shortages with rail lines, etc… The ports are out of room and have been for quite some time. Lots of smaller ports are waiving the flag to be a relief valve but they are not of any real help at all. Would costs lots of extra money to divert ships and the logistics from the “new” port to the end customers would all have to be rethought and shifted, which is no easy task. As a person in the stevedoring business, but not at the major ports, yes container business is crazy busy but breakbulk figures are up tremendously and warehouse space is an issue in our market too. The demand is simply too much for the logistics supply chain for the foreseeable future. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2021, 3:11pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/7 "2021-12-15T15:11:22Z")
Short sea container feeders with gear could move cargo from major ports with STS cranes to smaller port without much facilities, but closer to the consignee’s warehouses. It would reduce the road/rail transport distance and the concentration of requirement in a few areas + road congestion for the rest of road users. That could also help in reduce the storage problem, both for loaded and empty containers, at the main terminals. There is not a lot of suitable vessels in the JA fleet. nor many foreign flag vessels available that could be re-flagged to US to relieve the congestion. (They would not be JA compliant anyhow) ---
**Author:** ![Saltine1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Saltine1](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Saltine1)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2021, 6:30pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/8 "2021-12-15T18:30:39Z")
Agreed. On the Mississippi River there is an outfit that is building a few vessels now to take discharged containers from larger vessels and move them up into the central part of the US. I think this is long overdue and could help to some degree but won’t solve all of the problems on the west coast. Just too expensive to send a vessel from Asia thru the panama canal into NOLA for further transit. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 12:56pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/9 "2021-12-17T12:56:50Z")
Blame the shipping lines for all ills in LA/LB and everywhere else: > **[The embarrassment of riches - Splash247](https://splash247.com/the-embarrassment-of-riches/)** > > I stole that title from a book by Professor Simon Schama, who, before he was famous, was one of my supervisors at Cambridge. It’s a jolly good book, as are his other books. Professor Schama has a giant brain and a good sense of humour. This one is a... ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2022, 12:41pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/10 "2022-01-03T12:41:23Z")
Since the foreign container lines can’t be charged for container not being picked up by US consignees why not charge them for empty containers that linger at the terminals?: > **[Port of Los Angeles Plans Fees to Encourage Clearing Empty Containers](https://www.maritime-executive.com/article/port-of-los-angeles-plans-fees-to-encourage-clearing-empty-containers)** > > In the latest effort to clear some of the congestion at the container terminals, the Port of Los Ang... ---
**Author:** ![freighterman1](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/freighterman1/32/11176_2.png) [@freighterman1](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/freighterman1)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2022, 10:17pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/11 "2022-01-04T22:17:03Z")
I haven’t seen any new reports on the number of container ships stacked up at LA/LB. Last report I saw was from a week before Xmas. What are the numbers now? ---
**Author:** ![Kennebec\_Captain](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/kennebec_captain/32/13_2.png) [@Kennebec\_Captain](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Kennebec_Captain)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2022, 11:10pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/12 "2022-01-04T23:10:55Z")
> ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2022, 9:25pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/13 "2022-01-18T21:25:51Z")
Maybe there is a silver lining (for some) in the present logjam?: > **[US importers using box ships to store cargo – cheaper than...](https://www.seabaycargo.com/resources/US-importers-using-box-ships-to-store-cargo---cheaper-than-warehouses_37603.html)** > > US importers using box ships to store cargo – cheaper than warehouses\_US-importers-using-box-ships-to-store-cargo---cheaper-than-warehousesThe combination of congestion at US west coast ports and low interest rates is allowing US importers to use... > **[Everett Washington port enjoys calls from ships fleeing congestion](https://www.seanews.com.tr/everett-washington-port-enjoys-calls-from-ships-fleeing-congestion/192186/)** > > WASHINGTON state's Port of Everett is enjoying greater patronage thanks to multipurpose/heavy-lift (MPV/HL) and container carriers seeking to avoid congested US west coast ports, reports IHS Media ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2022, 5:48pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/14 "2022-01-23T17:48:00Z")
A side effect of the LA/LB logjam: > **[Videos show LA train lines strewn with thousands of looted packages as...](https://www.yahoo.com/news/videos-show-la-train-lines-113712470.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAEQSNi5S0BidBQjUY_yGQrcMjR3YbTrwIo3rPcBXFKpgvo3cxZoty13Sbr7ow6AcSsrncG2o0wcHMkIQkhjNL-L0aXUyCo-GZI0EqnO648zkKgjWUURK89OoSUi7HUHSI6gZUWQVwRX8ms_huik0yDzY8pIlvDBcqJFj4dE618Ie)** > > Thieves are taking advantage of slow-moving and stopped container trains and easy to cut locks to steal thousands of packages, local news reports. > **[Newsom compares train looting site to ‘third world country’ as he joins clean up](https://news.yahoo.com/newsom-compares-train-looting-third-223137552.html)** > > ‘I’m asking myself, what the hell is going on?’ ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/15 "2022-01-27T21:54:35Z")
Now it is a change from punishment to incentive. Maybe that will wortk better?: > **[Ports of Los Angeles, Long Beach looking at new carrier incentive to clear...](https://splash247.com/ports-of-los-angeles-long-beach-looking-at-new-carrier-incentive-to-clear-empties/)** > > Along with John Porcari, the Biden administration’s port envoy, the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach are exploring a new strategy to move empty containers – which comprised 47% of containers at the Port of Long Beach on January 25 – off their... ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 9:32pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/16 "2022-02-02T21:32:45Z")
A side effect of the logjam??: > **[Press release | Rise in differing cargo theft types driven by conditions at...](https://www.ttclub.com/news-and-resources/news/press-releases/2022/rise-in-differing-cargo-theft-types-driven-by-conditions-at-congested-us-ports/)** > > Third quarter cargo theft data in the US shows storage facilities targeted in 45% of reported cases; up from 20% of recorded cases in the same quarter in 2020. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2022, 12:56pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/17 "2022-02-20T12:56:58Z")
NIMBY syndrome?: > **[LA Wilmington residents fuss over container storage](https://www.seanews.com.tr/la-wilmington-residents-fuss-over-container-storage/192505/)** > > LOS ANGELES residents are raising hell about a proposed container storage yard not far from the harbour police station in San Pedro, bordering Wilmington district, reports the Long Beach Daily Breeze 'The burden of the supply chain and port expansion... ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2022, 10:13am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/18 "2022-05-26T10:13:24Z")
> **[Maersk warns that LA, Long Beach ports may implement long-delayed container...](https://splash247.com/maersk-warns-that-la-long-beach-ports-may-implement-long-delayed-container-dwell-fee/)** > > Maersk said this week that it foresees the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach soon implementing the container dwell fee, announced in October and since delayed week after week, as the ports continue to tackle congestion. The company said in a rate... > [@](#): > > According to Maersk, “the relevant Port Authority will be charging the fee and submitting the bill to Ocean Carriers to act as collection agents to charge and invoice those with a cargo interest in the laden import containers.” The company noted that it **“will collect any amounts due from cargo owners (or their designated demurrage payer) before releasing the cargo.”** ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2022, 12:29pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/la-lb-logjam/61601/19 "2022-06-19T12:29:21Z")
An alternative to LA/LB for containers bound for San Diego, New Mexico, or Texas?: > **[​OOCL launches new service to link China with West Coast South America -...](https://container-news.com/%E2%80%8Boocl-launches-new-service-to-link-china-with-west-coast-south-america/)** > > OOCL has announced the introduction of a new Transpacific Latin Pacific 6 (TLP6) service to enhance its Asia - Latin America network.