# Helge Ingstad - Salvage Operation **URL:** \ **Category:** gCaptain\ **Created:** [December 30, 2018, 3:44pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141 "2018-12-30T15:44:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Heiwa](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/heiwa/32/1054_2.png) [@Heiwa](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Heiwa)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/41 "2019-03-09T13:26:19Z")
No, the HI wreck has just been removed from the bottom of the sea at a cost of NOK 640 million and put on a barge. For some reasons the structural damages _above_ waterline in the starboard aft ship are covered up. The only structural damages below waterline are in the fwd engine room caused by the bulbous bow of the tanker and I am mystified how it could sink the ship. I assume progressive flooding took place and the crew didn’t know how to stop it and how to start bilge pumps, etc. To salvage the warship it has to be inspected and all components be repaired and I doubt it can be done properly. I think the scrap value of the wreck is max NOK 10 million and I doubt anyone will pay it. So best is just to sink the shit in deep water again. Of course somebody says that 1400 of 2500 components on the ship has already been taken out to be repaired … but I don’t believe it. All components have been damaged by saltwater for 4 months and are … scrap. ---
**Author:** ![Klaveness](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/klaveness/32/7001_2.png) [@Klaveness](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Klaveness)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 1:42pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/42 "2019-03-09T13:42:02Z")
You claim that the public reports of salvaged components are false. I asked a simple question: What are your sources? Why won’t you answer? Also, thanks for reminding me why I just don’t engage with insane people on the internet. ---
**Author:** ![Heiwa](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/heiwa/32/1054_2.png) [@Heiwa](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Heiwa)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 2:19pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/43 "2019-03-09T14:19:42Z")
Just read what I say. I don’t believe the salvage company has removed 1400 of 2500 components of the wreck as part of the removal of the wreck from the sea floor. It seems the salvage company just lifted the complete wreck from the bottom of the sea on to the top of a barge at a cost of NOK 640 million (and removed some torpedoes). I don’t call that salvage. Salvage is saving property from loss. Here the company has just moved a lot of scrap from one location to another. But maybe I am too harsh with the Norwegian Royal Navy having wasted plenty time in the Swedish one as a young man as per laws and regulations. I had no choice then so I took the best option to become an officer in special services, incl. emergency repairs and transformations. 1970 I actually transformed a Swedish merchant vessel into a naval mine layer in a short time … to impress invited WP and NATO guests. And 50 years later I am still at it - transforming ships from one type to another. In this case a roro to ropax. Interesting stuff. What do you do for a living when not discussing on the internet? ---
**Author:** ![Klaveness](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/klaveness/32/7001_2.png) [@Klaveness](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Klaveness)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2019, 4:41pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/44 "2019-03-09T16:41:50Z")
I read what you say, and it confuddles me. I don’t mean to poke fun at you, that’s just too easy, but I’m genuinely curious as to why you assert that nothing has been salvaged. It’s a strange assumption. As an aside entirely impertinent to the subject at hand, I divide my time between driving a fixing boats, these days mostly the former. ---
**Author:** ![Tupsis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9a140/32.png) [@Tupsis](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Tupsis)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 11:34am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/46 "2019-03-10T11:34:12Z")
If one wishes to speculate, these RCN folks had slightly better input than some right-wing misogynist nutjob: [https://army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,129352.100.html?msg1564097](https://army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,129352.100.html?msg1564097) > [@](#): > > There is, however, an aspect of the H.I. incident that I have not seen mentioned anywhere and is pretty typical of all navies: Homeward Bound Syndrome. The ship was coming back from a large NATO exercise, the crew had worked hard for a few weeks, going through war like drills and had performed well. There was feeling of “invincibility” from having survived that, etc. etc. Then, you are going home back to family and friend. It’s night, there are no drills planned, just a few hours and you are there, it’s your home waters you know like the back of your hand and you’ve been there a hundred times. In those circumstances, the atmosphere on the bridge is relaxed, almost idyllic, everybody is smiling and the minds are wandering. And the crew on the bridge fails to assess the situation properly and disaster strike. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 12:09pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/48 "2019-03-10T12:09:23Z")
Only thing wrong with that is that HI was not on her way back to home base, but heading to Scotland for more exercises as part of NATO’s Atlantic Standing Fleet. They just chose to take the inshore route as a Navigation training exercise, while the rest of the fleet took the direct open water route. ---
**Author:** ![Dutchie](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/dutchie/32/170_2.png) [@Dutchie](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Dutchie)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 12:41pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/49 "2019-03-10T12:41:39Z")
Interesting theory although I am not sure that this was the cause of the accident and that this could have led to the apparent situational unawareness, probably because they ignored the available radar information. I cannot speak for the Navy where they call this the Homeward Bound Syndrome. I can however speak for the merchant navy I sailed in and the fact that there was something similar which we called Channel Fever. Nearing the British Channel with Rotterdam waiting at the end some of us got very nervous, restless and were unable to sleep properly. It was a kind of euphoric feeling that took hold knowing that at the end of a long voyage one would meet again with family, wife, fiancée, children and friends. For bridge officers the disrupted sleep was an unwanted and potentially dangerous situation. I didn’t suffer from this phenomenon maybe because I was not married. Because of the marital status it also had a less prosaic “Fever” name which I will refrain from mentioning here… ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 1:29pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/50 "2019-03-10T13:29:49Z")
In the offshore drilling industry it is well known, but maybe not scientifically proven, that the last week before crew change is most accident prone. ---
**Author:** ![Kennebec\_Captain](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/kennebec_captain/32/13_2.png) [@Kennebec\_Captain](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Kennebec_Captain)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 2:30pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/51 "2019-03-10T14:30:57Z")
---
**Author:** ![Kennebec\_Captain](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/kennebec_captain/32/13_2.png) [@Kennebec\_Captain](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Kennebec_Captain)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 2:41pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/52 "2019-03-10T14:41:03Z")
An overworked crew will relax in any portion of the voyage they can, not just going home. I made a couple posts about this phenomena on the smaller scale of the bridge watch. [Karl Weick - An Analysis of the Tenerife Air Disaster](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/karl-weick-an-analysis-of-the-tenerife-air-disaster/46145) On ship with changes from high-tempo to lower tempo operations it’s something that can be observed and that a capt should be aware of. > Mariners that have called to Honolulu recall that at the entrance to the port there is a sea buoy and then three sets of buoys (IIRC). Once the ship gets through the buoys it is inside the breakwater. Next there is a short straight section and then a 90 degree turn. > > The connection between the Weick article and Honolulu Port entrance is that a pilot there explained there was possibility of starting the 90 degree turn late. The reason was because after the difficulty of getting through the buoys (sometimes strong set to the west with wind and current) the pilot and the bridge crew would stop concentrating on the task because little attention was required on the straight section. > > The error of the late turn would come because crews would slip into an almost daydream state. > > Weick mentions the same phenomena with the KLM crew as they had to turn the 747 around on the narrow runway. > > I was reminded of this article when I was reading about the Fitzgerald, the crew had also just completed some difficult tasks (exercises and then heavy traffic) and might have had a brief respite. ---
**Author:** ![Heiwa](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/heiwa/32/1054_2.png) [@Heiwa](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Heiwa)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 5:30pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/53 "2019-03-10T17:30:10Z")
I always admire the seamen bringing my ship up the Channel to Rotterdam in the middle of the night for loading at 06.00 am. How they found the pilot, etc, in that mess still makes me admire them. ---
**Author:** ![Dutchie](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/dutchie/32/170_2.png) [@Dutchie](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Dutchie)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2019, 10:33pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/54 "2019-03-10T22:33:59Z")
Picking up a pilot was considered by some captains as a kind of daring art. Already at some distance we tried to locate on the radar a smallish relatively fast moving target which usually was the pilot boat and kept moving slowly in that direction. We tried to avoid anchoring as much as possible as then you had to sit and wait for the pilot to board and that could take some time. Closer, by daylight, the pilot boat was flying a blue flag with white letter P. By night they carried a white light over red. With large vessels these days the pilot boards by helicopter which is simpler. ---
**Author:** ![dbeierl](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/dbeierl/32/11833_2.png) [@dbeierl](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/dbeierl)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2019, 10:41pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/55 "2019-03-18T22:41:41Z")
Full timelapse of the raising: [https://youtu.be/Y\_36HTsTHEM](https://youtu.be/Y_36HTsTHEM) ---
**Author:** ![ak44](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a87d85/32.png) [@ak44](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ak44)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2019, 12:56am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/56 "2019-03-19T00:56:05Z")
Any Navy guys here? Are these frigates equipped with flank mounted (passive) sonar arrays? (see red oval). Whatever was there was ripped of the side, opening up the hull. The bulbous bow of Sola TS left red paint marks on HI’s hull. ![ingstad_hakonsvern_17%20a](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/gcaptain_maritime_forum/original/2X/a/aa6fbace8af127a3041251922e46cc67afc977bb.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Ffinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Ffinn](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Ffinn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2019, 8:38pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/57 "2019-03-19T20:38:51Z")
Removal of sensitive equipment, methinks then scrapped… ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2019, 9:50pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/58 "2019-03-19T21:50:45Z")
What appears to be a stabilising fin has obviously been totally distorted.Whether from contact with the bulbous bow, or just the side of TS Sola as the HI was sliding along the side is not clear. Not sure if any side mounted sonar was installed, but here is details of all weapon systems and equipment on the Nansen class: > **[Nansen Class Anti-Submarine Warfare Frigates, Norway](https://thaimilitaryandasianregion.wordpress.com/2016/03/13/nansen-class-anti-submarine-warfare-frigates-norway/)** > > The five Nansen Class anti-submarine warfare frigates were built by Navantia of Spain for the Norwegian Navy. The vessels are: HNoMS Fridtjof Nansen (F 310), Roald Amundsen (F 311), Otto Sverdrup (… Posted earlier in another thread. ---
**Author:** ![SirKraken](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/sirkraken/32/7010_2.png) [@SirKraken](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/SirKraken)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/59 "2019-03-19T22:32:20Z")
Let’s not forget that after the accident HI was being pushed against rocks by tugs. This probably didn’t help the hull either. ---
**Author:** ![Heiwa](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/heiwa/32/1054_2.png) [@Heiwa](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Heiwa)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 3:22am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/60 "2019-03-27T03:22:51Z")
So the HI had plenty equipment to spot other ships, e.g. a Kongsberg MSI 2005F ASW combat system, a Spy-1F multifunction phased array radar, an RSR 210N multipurpose 2D radar system, a Vigy Observer, an MK 81 AN/SPG-62 illumination radar, an ES-3701 Tactical Radar ESM and Surveillance System all supported by an integrated communications control system. In spite of it all, the HI crew didn’t notice an Aframax tanker straight ahead, turned port so the starboard side was ripped open, etc. I would have turned starboard to start with. ---
**Author:** ![SirKraken](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/sirkraken/32/7010_2.png) [@SirKraken](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/SirKraken)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 4:54am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/61 "2019-03-27T04:54:46Z")
You forgot another system to spot ships consisting of a thin sheet of a glass pane which is transparent and lets operator look outside the closed compartment without being exposed to elements. Was crew trained in using this technology? ---
**Author:** ![Heiwa](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/heiwa/32/1054_2.png) [@Heiwa](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Heiwa)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 5:58am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141/62 "2019-03-27T05:58:40Z")
When I was in the navy 1965/70 the war ship nav.bridge was open to the elements keeping the people there awake. Only the ice breakers had enclosed nav.bridges. Luckily I never served on any such monsters. [Previous page](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/helge-ingstad-salvage-operation/50141.md?page=4)