# GCaptains article by Bloomsberg regarding Orsteds large losses **URL:** \ **Category:** Professional Mariner Forum\ **Created:** [August 31, 2023, 1:13am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999 "2023-08-31T01:13:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 12:44am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/61 "2023-09-06T00:44:09Z")
> [@ombugge](#): > > Pointless to compare Australia to reality because of it’s big size, small population and it’s abundant natural resources (Not just oil & gas, or fish, like Norway) Stupid comment we are talking power, tiny population and huge hydro resources ( more then 10X Australia)and the country makes all its money exporting oil Per capita maybe up there with the top Co2 offenders? > **[How do Norway's CO2 emissions compare to other countries?](https://www.thelocal.no/20211101/how-much-co2-does-norway-produce)** > > Norway can be seen as either a relatively green country or one of the worlds largest polluters, depending on whether you include emissions which occur abroad as a result of its oil trade. "The country emits 41 million tonnes of CO2 annually, according to figures it submits to the UN. This pales in comparison to the 329 million tonnes released by the UK, the 1.5 billion tonnes emitted by Russia, the 4.7 billion tonnes the USA has reported to the UN, and the more than 10 billion tonnes China discharges. By this metric, Norway looks to be relatively green. **However, when emissions per capita are considered, Norway leapfrogs the UK and China, emitting 7.7 tonnes per person."** Crikey are you burning coal at home? All jokes aside I cant understand why per head you can emit more that a brit using coal? Love to know what is causing that statistic. ---
**Author:** ![SeaEagle](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/seaeagle/32/17788_2.png) [@SeaEagle](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/SeaEagle)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 1:23am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/62 "2023-09-06T01:23:12Z")
Yes, North Sea exploration etc. largely financed by American companies. Don’t believe they asked for the giant subsidies.now being entertained or asked for by non-American outfits. ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 3:14am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/63 "2023-09-06T03:14:26Z")
Does it show there is no money in green power and in Europe clearly the work only goes ahead with a giant and ongoing subsidy so they all think thats how the process runs. Slow uptake in countrys with less subsidy?? Everyone knows Europe, felling forests in the USA and Canada to ship wood chips for biomass as somebody worked out thats good for the environment. Leaving flying out of the Paris accord so there is no harm to the environment when flying a private jet to a meeting to discuss the price of power for the voters. > **[Pollution from Planes and Ships Left Out of Paris Agreement](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/pollution-from-planes-and-ships-left-out-of-paris-agreement/)** > > The fast growing sources dropped out of the climate change accord over the course of negotiations ---
**Author:** ![Ladder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a9a28c/32.png) [@Ladder](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/Ladder)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 6:35am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/64 "2023-09-06T06:35:19Z")
The Danish government owns 50.1% of Ørsted. Why should the US government subsidize a foreign government to operate Wind Farms in US waters? The US should have it’s own state owned energy company to run their offshore wind farms. Cut out the middle man. The UK has no state owned energy company and the UK government spends a fortune subsiding several energy companies owned by foreign governments to operate Wind Farms in UK waters. ---
**Author:** ![johnny.dollar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5f8ce5/32.png) [@johnny.dollar](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/johnny.dollar)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 7:50am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/65 "2023-09-06T07:50:14Z")
> [@powerabout](#): > > Does it show there is no money in green power and in Europe clearly the work only goes ahead with a giant and ongoing subsidy so they all think thats how the process runs. Higher interest rates will solve this problem and finally end the cancer. This “backing out” of the project is just the beginning; now that money isn’t free (ZIRP), we will see more common sense prevail (thus saving moar cents!). ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 8:07am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/66 "2023-09-06T08:07:49Z")
With the Eu energy prices based on coal and its penalty the green power companies are getting paid twice both from subsidy and from massively overpriced electricity. ---
**Author:** ![ccairoli](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ccairoli/32/656_2.png) [@ccairoli](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ccairoli)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 8:52am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/67 "2023-09-06T08:52:28Z")
Just repeating the same thing over and over it doesn’t make it true. I explained it, shipengr explained it… ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 9:03am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/68 "2023-09-06T09:03:04Z")
> [@ccairoli](#): > > Just repeating the same thing over and over it doesn’t make it true sure it does, Co2 is causing global warming and humans are to blame, the vaccination is safe… ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 9:34am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/69 "2023-09-06T09:34:00Z")
> [@powerabout](#): > > Co2 is causing global warming and humans are to blame, (the) vaccination is safe… Glad you finally see, understand and accept the facts. It took a while!! ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 9:35am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/70 "2023-09-06T09:35:39Z")
Speaking of facts, how is it that the Co2 output per Norwegian is greater than the average Brit? All that hydro, electric cars etc, its defies belief. Too many people working in the green sector? ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 10:21am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/71 "2023-09-06T10:21:57Z")
> [@powerabout](#): > > Co2 output per Norwegian We are getting far away from the subject, but here is all you ever want to know about Norway’s CO2 and GHG emission: > **[Norway: CO2 Country Profile](https://ourworldindata.org/co2/country/norway)** > > Norway: How much CO2 does your country emit? Are emissions falling? How does it compare to other countries? BTW: Norway had only ONE coal fired power station, in Longyearbyen, Svalbard. That one has now changed to LS Diesel while awaiting switch to green energy by cable from the mainland. ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 10:34am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/72 "2023-09-06T10:34:26Z")
Looks like electricity and heating is the big co2 contributor thats causing twice the co2 per head than a brit Yep your using 3 times the amount of power a Brit uses Still far less than a Singaporean > **[Energy use per person](https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/per-capita-energy-use)** > > Energy use not only includes electricity, but also other areas of consumption including transport, heating and cooking. I am still surprised that the power gen is causing co2 emissions at such a rate? ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 10:47am UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/73 "2023-09-06T10:47:50Z")
The oil companies operating in Norway get tax credit for their exploration and development costs. This is offset against their their earnings in the production phase. PS\> In the early days of exploration off Norway there were little facilities and knowhow available in the country. Nobody insisted that the oil companies and drilling contractors used Norwegian material or labour, although some got entry level jobs on the rigs, boats and eventually production platforms. The top and skill jobs were still filled by foreigners. When Norwegian shipowners got into owning rigs they used foreign drilling contractors to manage the operation and foreigners to fill top jobs on the rigs. At the same time Norwegians gained the skills, both to design, build and operate the rigs. The same applied to the OSVs and other services required to develop the Offshore Oil & Gas industry in Norway and beyond. It is also the case for the Offshore Wind industry today, Although there are only one functioning OWF in Norway to date, Norwegian designed vessels and technology is used worldwide. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 12:32pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/74 "2023-09-06T12:32:08Z")
> [@powerabout](#): > > Looks like electricity and heating is the big co2 contributor thats causing twice the co2 per head than a brit I don’t understand where electricity and heating as a CO2 source come from. (??) All electricity used on mainland Norway is renewable (Hydro, onshore wind) and the heating is mostly by electricity, wood burning and waste heat from incinerators (no coal, but a few oil burning central heating) Heat pumps for privat home heating and solar panels for lights at the weekend cabins are common. No Gas powered electricity, except on the offshore platforms and the LNG plant at Melkøya. Even that is slowly being changed, with the cables from shore and floating wind turbines in the fields. PS\> Electrifying Melkøya is a bit of a political controversy in the present election season: > **[Norway outlines powerful electrification of its North](https://thebarentsobserver.com/en/industry-and-energy/2023/08/norway-outlines-powerful-electrification-its-north)** > > Major investments in renewables, new power lines and emission cuts are to set stage for an industrial revival of the country's northernmost Finnmark region. > [@powerabout](#): > > Stupid comment we are talking power, tiny population and huge hydro resources ( more then 10X Australia)and the country makes all its money exporting oil The income from oil & gas in Norway is invested in a Sovereign Wealth Found, popularly known as the “Oil Fund”: > **[IMF Survey: Norway's Oil Fund Shows the Way for Wealth Funds](https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2015/09/28/04/53/sopol070908a)** > > The Norwegian Oil Fund is often cited as an exemplary sovereign wealth fund (SWF), which uniquely positions it as a model for and potentially important contributor to the new set of voluntary principles for state investment institutions. This is set aside for the next generations, or when oil & gas is no longer needed in large qualities and can only invest in foreign equity, bonds and infrastructure, with a lot of restrictions: > **[Management of revenues - Norwegianpetroleum.no](https://www.norskpetroleum.no/en/economy/management-of-revenues/)** > > The marked value of the Government Pension Fund Global is more than twice the Norwegian GDP and more than NOK 1.4 million per person i Norway at year end. > [@](#): > > The Government Pension Fund Global, originally called the Government Petroleum Fund, was established in 1990 to ensure a long-term perspective in the management of government petroleum revenues. At the end of 2022, the fund’s market value was about NOK 12 400 billion. This corresponds to more than NOK 2 million per registered person in Norway. FYI: By law less than 4% of the annual revenue of the fund can be withdrawn by the Government to cover budget expenses. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 1:02pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/75 "2023-09-06T13:02:06Z")
> [@powerabout](#): > > With the Eu energy prices based on coal and its penalty the green power companies are getting paid twice both from subsidy and from massively overpriced electricity. Wrong, electricity prices in EU was based on the price of natural gas, mostly from Russia. That has changed since Russian gas is no longer available and since renewables cover a larger shear of the electricity supply. Here is electricity prices in the EU market today: > **[Energy prices in Europe today - Electricity spot price](https://www.energyprices.eu/)** > > See electricity spot prices across Europe today, country by country. NOTE: € Per MWh BTW: Electricity prices Norway is partly dependent on EU prices since it is on the same grid and market. This is especially so for southern Norway, less so for middle and northern Norway, since the transmission lines between those parts has limited capacity. Here is hourly prices in Norway (South to North), Scandinavia and Europe for tomorrow: > **[See hourly day-ahead prices.](https://www.nordpoolgroup.com/en/Market-data1/Dayahead/Area-Prices/ALL1/Hourly/?view=table)** > > See hourly day-ahead prices. Filter to choose your area of interest. ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 2:23pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/76 "2023-09-06T14:23:30Z")
How power pricing works in Europe [![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/gcaptain_maritime_forum/original/3X/5/9/59f93c64a14c937e1a3383469397cfa37172b07c.jpeg "Yanis Varoufakis exposes Europe's energy scam") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3bo-s_OY4Q&t=11s) ---
**Author:** ![SeaEagle](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/seaeagle/32/17788_2.png) [@SeaEagle](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/SeaEagle)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 2:46pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/77 "2023-09-06T14:46:23Z")
Interesting, Could that happen in USA, or already happening? I feel for the New Yorkers subject to a potential 43% rise in their already not cheap power bills. I enjoy somewhat reasonable/unreasonable power rates in Virginia… Dominion Power has two offshore “Experimental units” and hopes to extend that much further . Infrastructure is being developed by a recent land purchase for a staging/support area of a previously unused property near Oceana Air base. Another staging area was aquired near an unused/delapidated PIT Box terminal in Portsmouth Va a few years back, appx 70-80 acres. Access to navigable waters and railroad service. They are most certainly relying on subsidies, ok with that it stays in country. What will piss me off if and when they raise my rates again with the developmental “surcharges”. Selling the taxpayers and politicians under the all too familiar guise “We will save you money”… ---
**Author:** ![powerabout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/43a26b/32.png) [@powerabout](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/powerabout)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 2:48pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/78 "2023-09-06T14:48:31Z")
In another vid he worked out that if each supplier earned 10% profit the electricity price in Greece would drop 30% ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 3:53pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/79 "2023-09-06T15:53:54Z")
Surprised to see you take a “libertarian Marxist” (as he describe himself) to your heart. Is it because he is (or was?) a fellow Aussie? He has an impressive life story and CV, with a reputation as a rabble-rouser, participating in any protest movement he could find. ---
**Author:** ![ombugge](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.gcaptain.com/ombugge/32/11217_2.png) [@ombugge](https://forum.gcaptain.com/u/ombugge)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2023, 9:17pm UTC](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999/80 "2023-09-06T21:17:34Z")
It is not only Ørsted that has problems with their US OWF projects under the present regulatory system: > **[Equinor, BP seek 54% hike in US offshore wind power price, filings show](https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/equinor-bp-seek-54-hike-us-offshore-wind-power-price-filings-show-2023-08-31/)** > > Norway's Equinor and its partner BP are seeking a 54% increase for the price of power produced at three planned offshore U.S. wind farms, according to a filing made by a New York state regulatory authority. Is it “those greedy foreigners” that is at fault, or could it be that…? No, no, perish the thought. [Previous page](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forum.gcaptain.com/t/gcaptains-article-by-bloomsberg-regarding-orsteds-large-losses/66999.md?page=5)