YO and FS Hulls

This thread began in another, about old Aleutian freighters. The OP (an expert if ever there was one) noted about the fate of the original Aleutian freighters of the 1980s:

QUOTE][I]Slowly those old rides are disappearing into razor blades[/I]…[/QUOTE]

I might add: about the only way to dispose of the old YO and FS hulls, such as the Bowfin[I] is [/I]to melt them down. I can't think of any other hull as hard to kill. As others have noted, the hulls were built for the U.S. Army and Navy in 1944-1945, as harbor tender boats and small freighters. About 160' to 180' LOA x 32' beam. The YOs were oilers. The FSs were cargo tenders. The FS class also served as "mother ships" for landing craft operations after an initial amphibious attack. If you watch the old movie "Mister Roberts", the boat the movie plot revolves around is a FS used to supply a backwater island in the South Pacific. Based on the screenwriter's experience. So they did roam around the open Pacific as part of their original use. You can also read a novel called "Williwaw" written during the war. In it a FS is used as a freighter running around (of all places) the Aleutian islands. The novel's author served on one.

YOs and FSs are extraordinarily tough. Built for war. They can take an incredible beating. They've withstood Gulf of Alaska storms for going on forty years. Not a comfortable ride in 20' to 40' seas, but then what is? "Survivability" has a comfort all its own. I found myself in more than one storm thanking the naval architect and shipyard that built the boat under me. Has a YO or FS hull broke up in a storm? I have never heard of it. if you know the GOA in winter you know storms. Don't trust me. Read the Coast Pilot...
  Where trouble was encountered was in converting the hulls to other uses. The YOs were a set of longitudinal oil tanks under a single weather deck, and are single screw. The FSs were a single cargo hold under a weather deck and are twin screw, single rudder. When converted to Alaskan-use, as processors, fishing boats, and freighters, a shelter deck was added on top of the weather deck, making the boat two decks high. Some times the wheelhouse had to be raised, to look over the new weather deck. All this additional weight could (not always) change the hydrodynamics, sometimes in quite negative ways. But then again, [I]all [/I]those conversions survived the Gulf of Alaska, too, though someone may correct me. Hard to disparage a boat that keeps bring you back alive no matter how many times you try to kill yourself...

Melt them down quick or they might be around for another 70 years. Many were run aground on solid granite several times, repaired, and promptly put back to work. Example: one freighter side-swiped a rock going through Wrangell Narrows. Flooded into double bottoms. Boat took on list. Repaired in a shipyard. Back to work. Not so many trips later she heavily iced-up crossing the GOA in March. Took on a 40 degree list in 24 hours. Captain nearly ran it up on the beach at Chirikof Island purposely, to keep her from capsizing. Anchored at the last minute just outside the surf to give beating the ice off one last try. The crew spent 4 steady days chipping and beating ice to get the boat down to a 15 degree list. Gets to Chignik. Dock manager there is so horrified by what he sees he refuses to let the boat tie to the dock lest she capsize alongside. "Should have seen it couple of days and 150 miles ago", the crew says...They anchor out and chip ice for another two solid days. After which they complete the trip and just work cargo as usual. No drama... Not so many trips later a captain drives her over a reef, 40 miles from Dutch Harbor. Puts a tear in the hull about 100' long, nearly all the way from the bow to just forward of the ER bulkhead. Impact is so violent the manhole covers on the top of the double bottom are blown upwards into the lower cargo holds aft. Don't worry about an oil spill, because the oil floods into the cargo hold as the seawater floods up into the tanks. Rudder torn off. Both wheels severely damaged. Tons of water and fuel oil in the Lower 2 hold. Down by the head. What do you do? You go slow ahead on the engines and steer with what is left of the wheels, without a rudder, down Beaver Inlet and Baby Pass, 40 miles back to Dutch Harbor for repair. Boat back in action a couple months later, like nothing happened. That particular boat, by the way, was converted into a longliner (fishing boat) and is likely still working to this day. She may be working safely when many of the old salts reading this story are one with Ninevah and Tyre...

The steel in the hulls seems to be superior in terms of corrosion resistance than what followed in peace time. Or it may be the fact that they were originally painted inside and out with lead paint, a coating often never completely removed in all the subsequent shipyard periods.  Damp places like the forepeak and steering room are coated on the inside with something I believe was called "bitumastic"(somebody will give us the correct name). A black coating, tar-like in appearance though not sticky. Amazing stuff. After 50 years it is still keeping corrosion at bay (of course this in the PNW where rust works slower than in warmer climes). It laughs at removal by needle gun, if you are stupid enough to try. Where things rusted-out on the old freighters was everything added during "conversion": the shelter decks, new bulkheads, ER piping, rails, etc. Steel work often poorly designed and rarely with longevity in mind.

So, a roller coaster ride, at best, in 20'-40' seas. Cramped. Poorly ventilated. Part submarine, part bronco. Yet the YO and FS freighters rode the GOA over 30 years and maintained a pretty tight cargo schedule due to a lot of dedicated crews. Not saints, not geniuses but [I]seamen[/I]. Those tiny, maligned boats always brought their crew home, when younger and bigger ships disappeared without a trace in more peaceful oceans. Old Alaskan hands like the OP and myself may not love the hulls but we certainly respect them. I have no desire to relive the experience of sailing on them but they bred tough, knowledgeable mariners and superb boat handlers ( commodities which, I realize, are not universally appreciated these days).

which was the vessel you mention which ripped out the bottom near Dutch? Was it a Coastal vessel or someone elses?

Coastal Voyager. Working on Life 5 out of 9 but still has 4 to go. Fishing boat now.

[QUOTE=freighterman;178913]Coastal Voyager. Working on Life 5 out of 9 but still has 4 to go. Fishing boat now.[/QUOTE]

I knew it!..the old VICEROY. I was mate on her in 1985 in Bristol Bay. She was known as “the Low Top Tennis Shoe” to the GALAXY being the “High Top”

Love FS hulls too btw…the AKUTAN was always a favorite as was the very original BETSY ROSS.

I have been working on a book for the past 30 years all about the small ships of WWII in Alaskan waters. Army, Navy, Coast Guard and Maritime Commission all. Vessels like LT tugs, YF yard freighters and C1-M-AV1 cargo ships…all of which were front and center in the Alaskan maritime and fishing industries for the past 70 odd years. Wanna collaborate?

After sailing alaskan waters the last 4 years, I would definitely read it!

[QUOTE=c.captain;178915]Love FS hulls too btw…the AKUTAN was always a favorite [/QUOTE]

Ah, the AKUTAN, we have crossed paths there. I did a relief chief gig on it in Bristol Bay way back when. It was interesting to say the least.

Some of the Army FS had two cargo holds. This is a photo the cc posted on another thread. It’s the Reluctant from the movie Mr Roberts, C Cap says was the old USS HEWELL (AKL-14)

Here is another photo this one looks like only one hold. From thesite Eagle Speak.

How about the old ALYESKA? I made the delivery from Houston to San Diego in '79.(?)Had a refer and welding crew on board all the way around. A safety man would have had an apoplexy from day one. “Interesting” trip to say the least. I finally decided to get off in San Diego instead of Dutch.

If I remember right Alyeska was a Knot Ship, smaller kid-brother to the Liberty ships. Made to carry cargoes for the the Army and Navy. Owned by a military department called MST, perhaps forerunner of MSC. But someone may correct me.

[QUOTE=freighterman;178937]If I remember right Alyeska was a Knot Ship, smaller kid-brother to the Liberty ships. Made to carry cargoes for the the Army and Navy. Owned by a military department called MST, perhaps forerunner of MSC. But someone may correct me.[/QUOTE]

was the ALYESKA really the AL-IN-ES-KA-SEA which burned in Everett and then sank out in Port Gardner Bay? Yes, a C1-M-AV1 class which were four hatch breakbulk ships with slowspeed diesel powerplants as opposed to steam which made them attractive to use in the fisheries as processsing ships since they did not need to be inspected. I have been master on two, the processor OMNISEA (ex REEF KNOT) and the cargo ship PEMBINA (ex USS PEMBINA). Both had Nordberg mains. GREAT SHIPS ALL OF EM!

Now my old brain is struggling to name all the other Knot Ship processors that have worked in Alaska. There were a bunch. Most are gone now.

MST was MSTS which stood for Military Sea Transportation Service which was the predecessor to MSC

[QUOTE=freighterman;178937]If I remember right Alyeska was a Knot Ship, smaller kid-brother to the Liberty ships. Made to carry cargoes for the the Army and Navy. Owned by a military department called MST, perhaps forerunner of MSC. But someone may correct me.[/QUOTE]

It was a YO or YOG, I don’t remember which. The last trip it made for the navy was carrying water to Gitmo when Castro turned off the water.

She had a 8-278A main, 1 Hercules DC genset, 2 turbo 4-71s driving 100kw gens and 2 turbo 12-71s driving gensets.

[QUOTE=freighterman;178909]

<snip>

 Or it may be the fact that they were originally painted inside and out with lead paint, a coating often never completely removed in all the subsequent shipyard periods.  Damp places like the forepeak and steering room are coated on the inside with something I believe was called "bitumastic"(somebody will give us the correct name). A black coating, tar-like in appearance though not sticky. Amazing stuff. After 50 years it is still keeping corrosion at bay (of course this in the PNW where rust works slower than in warmer climes). It laughs at removal by needle gun, if you are stupid enough to try.

 &lt;snip&gt; [/QUOTE]

Great read. . .really enjoyed that. As far as the coating, sounds like Coal Tar Epoxy. . .

[QUOTE=c.captain;178939]was the ALYESKA really the AL-IN-ES-KA-SEA which burned in Everett and then sank out in Port Gardner Bay? Yes, a C1-M-AV1 class which were four hatch breakbulk ships with slowspeed diesel powerplants as opposed to steam which made them attractive to use in the fisheries as processsing ships since they did not need to be inspected. I have been master on two, the processor OMNISEA (ex REEF KNOT) and the cargo ship PEMBINA (ex USS PEMBINA). Both had Nordberg mains. GREAT SHIPS ALL OF EM!

Now my old brain is struggling to name all the other Knot Ship processors that have worked in Alaska. There were a bunch. Most are gone now.

MST was MSTS which stood for Military Sea Transportation Service which was the predecessor to MSC[/QUOTE]

There were two Knot Ships on Lake Union in Seattle at one time. One was the [I]Yardarm Knot[/I] IIRC. I don’t recall the name of the other one.

[QUOTE=c.captain;178939]was the ALYESKA really the AL-IN-ES-KA-SEA which burned in Everett and then sank out in Port Gardner Bay? [/QUOTE]
I’ve got several friends who have dived the AL-IN-ES-KA-SEA in recent years. The visibility there usually isn’t conducive to photos or video but Laura has an old clip from 1993 posted. There’s also a decent Everett Herald article written in 2012 commemorating thirty years passing since the fire with a photo gallery.

she burned up at one point and filled with water from fire dept. couldn’t move her as she found the bottom think that was right by the coastal yard I was pretty young when that happened.

I recall mid 90's a family putting flowers in the water at the Everett dock next to where the MSRC Responder moored -somebody was lost diving on the wreck and was never recovered.   The wreck sits in 120-130 ft depth and on its side not far from the south end of the marina.

Edit- I read the article- I guess it was deeper than 120’. Maybe they did recover the body.

[QUOTE=rshrew;178960]she burned up at one point and filled with water from fire dept. couldn’t move her as she found the bottom think that was right by the coastal yard I was pretty young when that happened.[/QUOTE]

I think every Knotship processor burned at one time or another…just a matter of degree of damage from all that flammable sprayed in foam insulation. OMNISEA’s was the most spectacular by far!

rebuilding her after that was pure folly…they never got their money back in the end

We recently incorporated the lessons learned from the Galaxy video into our Sunday safety meeting. Are some of these vessels y’all are talking about similar in design the Galaxy? Was the Galaxy as seen in the video footage the original design or had it been converted?

[QUOTE=Fraqrat;178973]We recently incorporated the lessons learned from the Galaxy video into our Sunday safety meeting. Are some of these vessels y’all are talking about similar in design the Galaxy? Was the Galaxy as seen in the video footage the original design or had it been converted?[/QUOTE]

I used to run the GALAXY and that fire was as text book of how not to combat a fire at sea as you can get. The thing is if that fire happened when I was running the vessel, the same thing would likely have happened. We never drilled and I doubt anyone on board really knew what to do in a genuine emergency.

regarding her build, she was originally a WWII mineplanter converted to a USCG bouytender then to a fisheries vessel in the early 70’s. In her last role she was woefully short of any structural fire protection, was filled with wood and had no sprinklers. Built to burn and it was only the whim of God that the terror of that day fell on another man and not I nor any of the other masters who commanded her. Sometimes the events that define our lives are determined by nothing more than shit luck!

Fish processor fires are not limited to YO, FS, or Knot ships. The Aleutian Falcon is an OSV conversion and she had a pretty spectacular fire (even with fire retardant foam insulation) at the dock in Dutch Harbor in the early 90’s.