I’m curious…if MSC has an abundance of newly graduated 3/M’s and a shortage of AB’s, then why not offer 3/M’s a job as an A/B for the time being? The person would have to be willing to take a pay cut obviously, but a job is a job to me. I’ve heard that AB’s in the company are going overdue for relief and resorting to going NFFD just to leave the ships.
Maybe I’m wrong, but that seems like a good idea…
Word is all third mates and third engineers were given letters for voluntary separation. If they were in the pool or on ship they got them. CHENGs were notified.
Anyone have a copy of the text of the letter?
I wonder what the RIF criteria will be? I vaguely remember an old-timer telling me in the past it was based on how many years of government service a person had. I also vaguely remember being told many were offered a chance to accept demotion instead of termination.
Are there any old-timers who were around the last time who can confirm or refute?
Deck Ape you brought up a good point if they demote 3rds to AB and just put us on the BQ for 3rd mate I think everyone would take it. We are short ABs right now
Copy/paste
The manning as of DEC 2016 for FY17 were as follows:
Master (3 under)
1/O (4 over)
2/O (29 over)
3/O (107 over)
CHENG (5 under)
1AE (7 over)
2AE (21 over)
3AE (87 over)
Here is what I read up on DOD RIF’s.
I would assume since MSC falls under DON which falls under DOD, we would follow these procedures. I forgot which site I saw, but it gave a perfect example of how this new system under the Trump administration works with performance, time in service, vet’s preference, etc.
This sums up the new and improved DOD RIF guidelines set forth by the Trump administration. I would assume MSC would follow?
[QUOTE=DeckApe;195935]The manning as of DEC 2016 for FY17 were as follows:
Master (3 under)
1/O (4 over)
2/O (29 over)
3/O (107 over)
CHENG (5 under)
1AE (7 over)
2AE (21 over)
3AE (87 over)[/QUOTE]
I don’t get how you can be overstaffed for CM and 1AE yet claim to be understaffed for Master and CE. Just promote some people…
An actual scan of the letter finally made it to my ship. For the pittance they’re offering, I can’t imagine they’d get many takers. People are already fed up; if they were going to quit, they’d have already quit.
Yeah…it’s crappy…like one weeks worth of pay for every year of service…I doubt there will be any takers.
[QUOTE=Salty_;196173]An actual scan of the letter finally made it to my ship. For the pittance they’re offering, I can’t imagine they’d get many takers. People are already fed up; if they were going to quit, they’d have already quit.[/QUOTE]
So after that date that is given in the letter, how long before an actual RIF would take place? Anyone seen this with MSC ever…or know someone who’s been through it?
[QUOTE=Salty_;196173]An actual scan of the letter finally made it to my ship. For the pittance they’re offering, I can’t imagine they’d get many takers. People are already fed up; if they were going to quit, they’d have already quit.[/QUOTE]
I am amused by the perspective here, and a little puzzled. As I understand it, MSC is overstaffed, and needs to get rid of people. So instead of doing what private companies do all the time(lay them off and tell them to go on unemployment,)MSC actually gives them up to $40,000 to leave? Is this a guy a year away from retirement and getting shafted from his pension, or a guy with what, 3 years in? Because if it is the latter,the deal in the rest of the private sector is last hired, first fired, go on unemployment. Am I, as a taxpayer, paying for some guy’s $40,000 parachute because he happens to work, what, 5 years, for a company and then gets laid-off? Very few Americans get that deal. Great for him, not so much for me. Doesn’t sound like a pittance to me. But if I am missing something here, please let me know.
Government service is not the same as commercial employment.
Different needs, different priorities, different arrangement. Throw in different problems and inefficiencies to boot.
The 40k cap won’t apply to many people unless they’re near retirement.
The deal for early retirement isn’t bad. There will be few if any takers. There are few third mates and third engineers with enough years of federal service. Who knows? Maybe one or two takers.
The deal for newer hires is bad. So bad it’s better to ride it out until the layoffs, then collect unemployment. I doubt the offer was actually intended to get anyone to quit. No, it was a formality. There may be some takers but I can’t see many.
In oversimplified terms, the deal for quitting early is about a week of pool pay for every year employed for the first ten years. It increases to two weeks of pay for every year beyond the tenth year.
A week of third mate or third engineer pool pay is about $1150. Someone would reach the 40k cap at about twenty-two years of employment.
Unemployment for MSC will be about $378 per week for 12 to 26 weeks.
Do the math and you can see it’s better for most people to collect pool pay for a few months until the layoffs are complete, then collect unemployment. The only folks it would tempt are those who were about to quit and start a new job right away.
Those who have been building up their TSP fund with the max amount will be thankful they did.
Fixed it for ya…[QUOTE=DeckApe;196215]…Unemployment for MSC will be about $378 for Virginia, $450 for California per week for up 26 weeks but varies from 18-30 weeks depending on where (which State) filed.
[/QUOTE]
But since this would be a Federal claim (Special Claim requiring different handling), benefits are based on where filed. Massachusetts pays the most at $993 pr week. Followed by Rhode Island at $707 and Connecticut at $665…certain rules apply. Check each State for details.
Makes a difference. A lot of people actually live off Unemployment benefits.
The state of last duty station is where you would file. That would be Virginia, maybe California for West Coast mariners. As most of the mariners likely to be let go are newish most would be permanent East Coast and therefore Virginia at $378.
In any case the numbers still work out so it’s almost always best for newish employees to wait for the possible layoff and not take the voluntary resignation.
Here’s the letter for those interested. Note its a scan-to-text so there could be errors. Also note I removed names and phone numbers.
N1
24 Feb 17
From: Commander, Military Sealift Command
To: Xxxxxxxx
Subj: APPLICATION FOR VOLUNTARY SEPARATION INCENTNE PAY (VSIP) AND VOLUNTARY EARLY RETIREMENT AUTHORITY (VERA)
Encl:
(1) Benefits Information for Employees Applying for a Voluntary Early Retirement and/or Voluntary Separation Incentive Pay (CBC 12830-19)
(2) Eligibility Criteria for Civilian Voluntary Separation Incentive Pay Program
(3) Eligibility Criteria for Voluntary Early Retirement Authority
(4) VSIP Frequently Asked Questions
(5) Request for Retirement Annuity Computation When an Activity Has Authority to Offer Voluntary Early Retirement VERA (CBC 12830-17)
(6) Request for Personnel Action, Standard Form 52
(7) Voluntary Separation Incentive Pay Agreement, Lump Sum Payment (DD Form 2903-1)
(8) Voluntary Separation Incentive Pay Agreement, Bi-weekly Installment Payment (DD Form 2903-2)
(9) Voluntary Separation Incentive Pay Agreement, 6 Month Installment Payment (DD Form 2903-3)
(10) Calculation of VSIP Amount
- The Commander, Military Sealift Command, has received authority to offer a limited number of civilian Voluntary Separation Incentive Payn1ents (VSIP) in FY-17 in order to conduct workforce reshaping. You have been identified to receive the opportunity to apply for this offer.
- VSIP may be offered to an employee electing optional retirement, early retirement or resignation. If you wish to apply for a VSIP, please read the enclosed information carefully and observe all deadlines provided. Enclosure (1) provides general information on retirement eligibility requirements and employee benefits. The criteria and circumstances under which employees are eligible for VSIP under this authority are provided in enclosure (2). The criteria and circumstances under which employees are eligible for Voluntary Early Retirement Authority (VERA) under this authority are provided in enclosure (3). VSIP Frequently Asked Questions received from the DON Civilian Benefits Center are provided in enclosure (4).
- Applications for VSIP will be accepted from 3 March 2017 through 17 April 2017. Employees approved to receive a VSIP must separate from Federal employment no later than 31 May 2017. If you wish to be provided an estimate of your retirement annuity, regardless of whether you are optional or early eligible, complete enclosure (5) and fax it to Xxxxxxxx at the DON Civilian Benefits Center no later than close of business on 10 2017. The fax number is (xxx) xxx-xxxx. Please note that if you received an annuity computation within the last 12 months with a projected retirement date through 31 December 2017, you may not submit another request. Requests for computations received after 10 March 2017 may not be accepted in conjunction with this opportunity to apply for the VSIP.
- If you decide to apply for a VSIP, you must complete and sign enclosure (6), along with either enclosure (7), (8) or (9) as applicable, and return them to Xxxxxxxx at the MSC Human Resources Office no later than 4:00 PM on 17 April 2017. You may email or fax the documents.
Xxxxxxxx’s email address is Xxxxxxxx@navy.mil, and her fax number is (xxx) xxx-xxxx. Please note that applicants will be emailed a confirmation of receipt of their VSIP application. If confirmation is not received within 48 hours of emailing or faxing the application to Xxxxxxxx, please email her at Xxxxxxxx@navy.mil. Applicants will be notified in writing of their approval for a VSIP. Employees must evaluate all factors when considering whether or not to submit their application. Employees who submit their application and are approved for the VSIP will acknowledge that this is a voluntary separation and the decision to separate with a VSIP cannot be revoked. If you are not approved to receive a VSIP, you will not be obligated to resign or retire and your SF-52 will be returned to you.
- If approved, the amount of the incentive payment will be the lesser of $40,000 or an amount equal to what you would be entitled to receive under the severance pay formula (less FICA/Medicare taxes and Federal and state income taxes as applicable). An example of VSIP calculation is provided in enclosure (10). The VSIP amount is computed as follows:
a. One week of pay at the rate of basic pay for the position held by the employee at the time of separation for each full year of creditable service through 10 years;
b. Two weeks of pay at the rate of basic pay for the position held by the employee at the time of separation for each full year of creditable service beyond 10 years; and
c. Twenty-five percent of the otherwise applicable amount for each full 3 months of creditable service beyond the final full year.
d. Any severance pay you may have previously received must be deducted from the total severance pay calculation. You may obtain an estimate of your VSIP amount through Total Workforce Management Services (TWMS) (https://twms.navy.mil). Log into TWMS and select Benefits/Leave Info on the left side of the screen. The next screen will include your VSIP entitlement. You may elect to receive your VSIP in one of the following three ways:
(1) Lump Sum (complete enclosure (7)).
(2) Bi-weekly installment payments consisting of equal amounts at a rate you select and may not extend beyond one year from the date of separation (complete enclosure (8)).
(3) One-half of your VSIP six months following your separation and the remaining half six months later (complete enclosure (9)).
- Please note the following:
a. A Department of Defense (DoD) employee who receives a VSIP may not be reemployed by DoD (including Non-appropriated Fund (NAF) or employment through a personal services contract) for a 12 month period beginning on the effective date of the employee’s separation. The Secretary of Defense or designee may approve exceptions on a case-by-case basis.
b. If you are paid a VSIP and accept reemployment with the Federal government (including Non-appropriated Fund activities or with an agency of the United States through a personal services contract) within five years after the date of separation, you must repay the entire amount of the VSIP to DOD. Repayment can be waived only if you are the only qualified applicant available for the position being filled.
- Should unforeseen substantial events cause you to request to be relieved from this irrevocable commitment, you should understand that the agency exercises sole discretion over whether to unilaterally release you from this binding commitment.
- Please be assured that you are under no obligation or pressure to resign or retire. If you have any questions, please email Xxxxxxxx at Xxxxxxxx @navy.mil.
Xxxxxxxx
Director, Total Force Management
[QUOTE=DeckApe;196226]The state of last duty station is where you would file. That would be Virginia, maybe California for West Coast mariners. As most of the mariners likely to be let go are newish most would be permanent East Coast and therefore Virginia at $378.
In any case the numbers still work out so it’s almost always best for newish employees to wait for the possible layoff and not take the voluntary resignation.[/QUOTE]
The Federal Government is a reimbursable employer for unemployment insurance. This is for Federal and Military claims. Normally one would file where they were left off or where worked. But you can file anywhere. You can take advantage of the differences between States. Some do, especially the Military. Where they would be released from service in California then travel to Hawaii to file for the higher rate. California had a revolving door for Marines from Yuma AZ crossing the border to California for the higher weekly rate ($240 vs $450). This works really well for those Federal employees coming from overseas and now unemployed (overseas contract workers excluded).
That’s good info.