Abs certification


#1

If you have a tug that’s ABS load line certified/class (not full class) and you let the certification expire. What are the consequences?

And what are the benefits of having a boat ABS load line class?


#2

I am quite rusty on this, but my recollection is is that any “outside” vessel over 79 feet or 149 GRT must have a load line. The load lines need to be renewed periodically. ABS does a load line inspection. As I recall, the inspection is primarily about structural and watertight integrity.

If the load line is required, but expired, then it would be a violation of the law. Also, it would give the insurance underwriter an excuse not to pay claims.

Again, I am pretty rusty on this. One of the former ABS inspectors here should have the straight story.


#3

From what I can remember is if you let a vessel go Out of Class you will pay holy hell to get it back. IIRC, they can force you to put it back to almost new condition, so it is best never to let the Load Line expire!


#4

What tugs said


#5

There is a huge difference between a “class” certificate, and a “loadline certificate.” No law requires that a typical tug be “classed.” Owners frequently drop “class” because it is too expensive to maintain. Tugs can easily get insurance without “class.”

Where the law requires that a seagoing must have a loadline, it is not lawful to take the vessel to sea without a current “loadline certificate.” I imagine that if the loadline has only been expired for a very short time (a grace period), its probably not too difficult to get it renewed. However, if the loadline certificate has lapsed for an extended period of time, it may not be economically feasible to get it back. Without a loadline, a tug that is required to have a loadline cannot go to sea. It can only be used in “inland waters,” such as NY harbor or Puget Sound.

If a loadlined outside tug has lost its loadline, it has probably lost most of its value.


#6

For example the wastage limits are far stricter when going back to class/load line than when just renewing. Forget the percentages but it pays to stay current! You get far closer to “new” standards going back in.


#7

[QUOTE=tugsailor;128885]There is a huge difference between a “class” certificate, and a “loadline certificate.” No law requires that a typical tug be “classed.” Owners frequently drop “class” because it is too expensive to maintain. Tugs can easily get insurance without “class.”

Where the law requires that a seagoing must have a loadline, it is not lawful to take the vessel to sea without a current “loadline certificate.” I imagine that if the loadline has only been expired for a very short time (a grace period), its probably not too difficult to get it renewed. However, if the loadline certificate has lapsed for an extended period of time, it may not be economically feasible to get it back. Without a loadline, a tug that is required to have a loadline cannot go to sea. It can only be used in “inland waters,” such as NY harbor or Puget Sound.

If a loadlined outside tug has lost its loadline, it has probably lost most of its value.[/QUOTE]

This is the most accurate reply.

Contact the local abs office and speak to a senior or principal surveyor. They can help you understand the process, but cannot speak to value or legal questions. The load line survey is to see to the structural and water / weathertight aspects of the boat. If money is too tight to maintain load line, I would not want to sail on it, insure or finance it. Other than that, what bother with a load line.


#8

[QUOTE=+A465B;128888]This is the most accurate reply.

Contact the local abs office and speak to a senior or principal surveyor. They can help you understand the process, but cannot speak to value or legal questions. The load line survey is to see to the structural and water / weathertight aspects of the boat. If money is too tight to maintain load line, I would not want to sail on it, insure or finance it. Other than that, what bother with a load line.[/QUOTE]

Yup. Now, as far as getting any insurance, well that depends on what premiums you want to pay and what kind of coverage. Standard marine policies for ocean going vessels often require Class as a warranty item. There is also the nebulous “seaworthiness” issue that lawyers like to bandy about. . . .


#9

[QUOTE=Tugs;128881]From what I can remember is if you let a vessel go Out of Class you will pay holy hell to get it back. IIRC, they can force you to put it back to almost new condition, so it is best never to let the Load Line expire![/QUOTE]

That’s pretty much it. You will break out your wallet and empty your pockets because they will look at [I]everything.[/I]


#10

Load line is load line items, not renewal of class.

For renewal of load line it will basically be drydocking, gaugings, visual exams of all structure, guard rails, hatches, doors, closures and any necessary repairs to any / all of the foregoing. It is pretty straightforward process that a good supt, capt or chief can organize. Just add money & time.

Cmakin is correct on the insurance. It is possible to insure about any risk - it is just the premium and warranties that kill you.

Good luck.

Renewal of any class ( any class society) after expiry is dealt with on a case by case basis, bearing in mind how the situation occurred. Requirements will vary.


#11

If I’m over 79ft or 149 GRT I have to be ABS load line to tow offshore?

And “offshore” being defined as what?


#12

[QUOTE=tugboatchief;129062]If I’m over 79ft or 149 GRT I have to be ABS load line to tow offshore?

And “offshore” being defined as what?[/QUOTE]

The U.S. Boundary Line is delineated in 46 CFR Part 7.

As a rule, on the Atlantic, Pacific, and Great Lakes coasts, the Boundary Line generally follows the high water shoreline, extended across the entrances to small bays, inlets, harbors, rivers, the ends of breakwaters or jetties, etc. In most cases, this means that as soon as an outbound vessel crosses seaward of the entrance, it has crossed outside the Boundary Line.

There are some significant exceptions to the above general rule, however:…


#13

Like you can tow a laden barge beyond its load line from NY to say Portsmouth legally by staying inside the boundary line!


#14

[QUOTE=tugboatchief;129062]If I’m over 79ft or 149 GRT I have to be ABS load line to tow offshore?

And “offshore” being defined as what?[/QUOTE]

Yes. That requires a loadline.

Its the same boundary line described above for COLREGS. Its in the CFRs, Coast Pilots, and printed on the charts. Same as for inland license / near coastal license.

If you want to avoid the need to have a loadline, I see two choices: Keep the vessel on “inland” waters; or install tonnage openings, deep frames, and ballast tanks to reduce the GRT below 149. There are some good sized tugs that are only 99 GRT.


#15

Yes sir. I understand. All the responses above have been very helpful. I was just trying to determine if it was cost effective to keep the load line certification in place. The vessel has no upper house and has to have one installed. It’s cheaper to do it with ABS guidelines versus lowering the GRT.

But is it and or 79ft or 149GRT?


#16

[QUOTE=tugboatchief;129067]Yes sir. I understand. All the responses above have been very helpful. I was just trying to determine if it was cost effective to keep the load line certification in place. The vessel has no upper house and has to have one installed. It’s cheaper to do it with ABS guidelines versus lowering the GRT.

But is it and or 79ft or 149GRT?[/QUOTE]

By all means, you should check with an expert. But my recollection is that its EITHER: 79 feet OR 149 GRT that trigger’s the loadline requirement. If it still has a loadline, I’d say you probably ought to keep it.

If you’re planning to install an upper house, it sounds like you’re planning to push oil. It might be worthwhile to price insurance with and without the loadline.


#17

Yes sir. I have spoke with “experts” and have gotten conflicting results. The responses found here on this thread and the other research I’ve done have led me to believe that I would be better off and money ahead to just keep the vessel within load line specs.

Now to find the plans/drawings for the architect to perform the stability test. This will be interesting.


#18

Hello Dear captains,

Could you tell me how much money you paid only for ABS tug boat load line certificate ? Please I need to know because I’m thinking to do same.

Thank you so much

Captain84


#19

My understanding from the CFRs is if the boat was built before 1968 it can be any length, but if it is over 150 GT it needs a load line to go outside. Built after 1968, it can be any tonnage, but if it is over 79 ft. it needs a load line. As I recall that is for an “International” load line, a “Domestic” load line has a different year for the change.